Slydini's material

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Kieran
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Slydini's material

Postby Kieran » July 12th, 2018, 4:36 pm

Hi everyone,
I have Slydini's "as i recall" dvd set and would like to get his books also, the thing is i dont want to get the books that have the same material as in the dvd set. If anyone has the dvd set and books could you please point me in the right direction as to which books to get, thanks.

Kieran

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Richard Kaufman » July 12th, 2018, 5:08 pm

There are only four books:
The Magic of Slydini
Slydini Encores
The Best of Slydini
The Magical World of Slydini.

You need all of them.
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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Jeffrey Cowan » July 12th, 2018, 5:38 pm

Concur with Richard, but you want the relatively recent annotated version of The Magic of Slydini. Gene Matsura adds some great tips and details that Lewis Ganson missed (or Tony didn't share with him).
I recommend that you first buy/study the Magic of Slydini and The Best of Slydini and More before getting to the other two books. These two contain the cornerstones of Slydini's work on timing and movement that you need to understand to do much of his material.
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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Kieran » July 13th, 2018, 1:47 am

Thanks for the replies, i will get all the books and look forward to reading every one of them. The man was a legend and I cannot stop watching him perform on the dvds, even before I go out the dvd set i must of watched him on YouTube a 100 times!

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby performer » July 14th, 2018, 4:46 pm

I agree with Richard that all 4 books should be read. I do find one fault with all of them except the Encores book is the million photographs which I find may not necessarily be a good thing. As grumpy old Wilfrid Jonson once remarked it is an incompetent author and an inattentive student who requires dollops and dollops of illustrations to study a subject. And all those pictures have a tendency to turn the student into a Slydini clone. And it can make things more of a struggle to study when you have to keep looking at another picture every few seconds.

I do a lot of Slydini material but I found it early on that once you have mastered the stuff you should not be afraid to change it somewhat to your own style. For example I always found that the paper balls in a hat thing was somewhat weak and indeed boring. And Ken Brooke once told me that even Slydini thought it wasn't that great but he included in his book as it was an excellent illustration of his techniques and necessary for the student to progress in the studies of his methods.

I always ignored the trick until fairly recently. Now I get great results from it. I got rid of the silly hat or box idea, substituted a paper bag for it so I could perform it impromptu in coffee shops, I got rid of the music nonsense and substituted amusing patter and altered the method so I wouldn't be making an invisible ball disappear. I believe the trick is twice as good as it was before.

The moral of the tale is not to be stuck in the Slydini material as if it were cast in tablets of stone. Once you have mastered it then don't be afraid to alter it to suit yourself.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Kieran » July 23rd, 2018, 1:07 pm

Thank you for the advice Mark about not becoming another slydini clone, whenever i perfect a trick i always try and change it abit so im performing it my way not the same as 100's of other magicians. Just recently I learned Nate leipzig's colour change from the book "A tribute to Nate leipzig", i perfected it the way it is described in the book but now have changed the handling a little to suit me.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby performer » July 23rd, 2018, 2:33 pm

Yes, I have also changed the Leipzig colour change routine around to suit my own preferences.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Leonard Hevia » July 28th, 2018, 11:50 am

At the very end of The Best of Slydini...and More, Fulves announces the imminent arrival of the second set of books, and lists the effects slated for those two volumes. There were silk effects in that list like the appearing and color changing silks, along with Slydini's well known silk knots routine. I have never seen any of those other silk effects published or mentioned anywhere. The knots routine made it to the second set but the rest slipped thru the cracks when Fulves worked on the books.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby J-Mac » August 4th, 2018, 12:45 am

There is also "The Master of Misdirection" by D. Angelo Ferri (aka Dennis Barlotta).

The book is all on Slydini and is written by a long-time student of his. I believe it is only available as an ebook.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Q. Kumber » August 4th, 2018, 4:09 am

There's another book (about 20 pages) of Slydini material that never seems to get mentioned. It's Slydini's Linking Rubber Band Mystery by Alma Ritchie (Bluestone).

Googling has not resulted in any information on Alma Ritchie.

The routine is structurally a mirror image of Slydini's Linking Pins, written by and described by Richard Kaufman in Apocalypse Volume One, and also available from Palmer Magic. Done well, Slydini's Linking Rubber Bands is, in my opinion much stronger than most of the linking bands handlings I've seen, largely because it is a properly structured routine that builds and makes eyes pop.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Leonard Hevia » August 4th, 2018, 10:05 am

Fulves wrote at the end of The Best of Slydini...

By way of ending this book it might be wise to mention that when this book was in progress it became clear after approximately six months that all of the major Slydini routines and concepts could not be contained in a single volume. Accordingly, work then began on a parallel course to develop the text and photos for a second book. The book is now in preparation and will contain most or all of the following routines and techniques:

Here is the material that to my eyes didn't make it to the second set of books:

1. Slydini Color Change--What is this? A color changing silks effect?
2. The Close-Up Dice Routine--Sounds interesting.
2. Slydini on the Optical Cut--Is this the Table Shift on page 28 of the second book that supposedly fooled Vernon?
4. Delayed Cut as a Pass--Sounds interesting.
5. The Slydini False Count--Sounds interesting.
6. Stretching a Cigarette--This is in Ganson's The Magic of Slydini. Or in Slydini Encores? You break a cigarette in two and stretch out the individual pieces into two cigarettes.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 4th, 2018, 12:03 pm

I think some of that stuff later ended up in Chronicles.
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Re: Slydini's material

Postby performer » August 4th, 2018, 1:52 pm

I remember reading a manuscript describing Slydini's Linking Pins. I thought it was bloody awful. You really cannot beat the Andrus Linking Pins.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Leonard Hevia » August 4th, 2018, 3:38 pm

performer wrote:I remember reading a manuscript describing Slydini's Linking Pins. I thought it was bloody awful. You really cannot beat the Andrus Linking Pins.


Gaetan Bloom has a killer linking pins effect.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby performer » August 4th, 2018, 4:00 pm

Good for him. Can they be examined?

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Leonard Hevia » August 4th, 2018, 4:13 pm

Richard Kaufman wrote:I think some of that stuff later ended up in Chronicles.


My copy of Chronicles is in storage but I did look up the table of contents in Dennis Behr's Conjuring Archive website. The Slydini entries are mostly ring and rope effects and some work on the Okito box. Nothing from the Fulves list.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 4th, 2018, 6:49 pm

performer wrote:Good for him. Can they be examined?


Mark, sometimes you don't know what you're talking about. I did Slydini's pin routine for years. No one ever asked to examine the pins.
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Re: Slydini's material

Postby performer » August 4th, 2018, 8:03 pm

Richard. I bloody well DO know what I am talking about! I have no idea who you have been showing the trick to. Or how often you have been doing it. Probably not that frequently and probably to other magicians and if this is the case then it doesn't count. However, let us assume that you have been showing the trick to LAYMEN (and they are the only audiences that count).

I know how laymen think. I am an expert on it. In fact I deem it essential for a close up magician to know how the human mind works particularly the mind of a layman you show a trick to. Now just because someone doesn't ask to examine the pins doesn't mean that they wouldn't like to. People aren't stupid---the very FIRST thing they will suspect is a slit in the pins! They might not say it out loud to you but they will bloody well suspect it.

If the pins are not examinable then the trick is pathetic. I don't care what beautiful moves there are. I haven't seen the Gaeton Bloom routine but I don't give a stuff how wonderful it is if the pins cannot be examined it is a complete waste of time. And that goes for the rather awful Slydini routine as well. And bear in mind that I am a big fan of Slydini and use a lot of his material. But I know crap when I see it.

This is the Slydini pins:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hyTMRLTBj0

This is the Bloom Routine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6uuGCgdABw

And THIS is the Andrus routine. No comparison whatsoever. Everyone can judge for themselves:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hQfBSmmaZE

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby fausstroll » August 5th, 2018, 4:21 am

Leonard Hevia wrote:
Richard Kaufman wrote:I think some of that stuff later ended up in Chronicles.


My copy of Chronicles is in storage but I did look up the table of contents in Dennis Behr's Conjuring Archive website. The Slydini entries are mostly ring and rope effects and some work on the Okito box. Nothing from the Fulves list.


Slydini's pin routine is in Apocalypse, p106

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby fausstroll » August 5th, 2018, 4:26 am

performer wrote:I remember reading a manuscript describing Slydini's Linking Pins. I thought it was bloody awful. You really cannot beat the Andrus Linking Pins.


I don't understant. Slydini and Andrus use the same kind of pin, so why do you judge Andrus superior ? Is it in the routining ?

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Q. Kumber » August 5th, 2018, 5:14 am

fausstroll wrote:

I don't understant. Slydini and Andrus use the same kind of pin, so why do you judge Andrus superior ? Is it in the routining ?


The Slydini pin gimmick is different from the Andrus one.. Garton Bloom made a couple of additions to the Slydini gimmick, but his routine is basically the same as Slydini's. The other commonly used pin is that of Hans van Senus, originally published in Apocalypse, and now popularised by Bob Sheets and Dan Garrett.

In 1949 Ken Brooke put out Four Two Pins, a linking pin effect, which used the same gimmick as Slydini, though the routines are completely different. But it does have a move that fits perfectly into the Slydini routine.

I've seen a few people do the Slydini Pin routine and every single one of them have left out the most important part - it is there in the instructions. The routine is a staple part of my repertoire, always gets a strong reaction, and the pins are handled by the audience.

Neither the Andrus nor Van Senus routines ever appealed to me, as, while very clever and ingenious, to me they look like wire puzzles.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby performer » August 5th, 2018, 7:11 am

fausstroll wrote:
performer wrote:I remember reading a manuscript describing Slydini's Linking Pins. I thought it was bloody awful. You really cannot beat the Andrus Linking Pins.


I don't understant. Slydini and Andrus use the same kind of pin, so why do you judge Andrus superior ? Is it in the routining ?


Different type of pin entirely. Bloody great gap in it. Horrible thing. You might get away with it in professional work where people are too polite to say "Let me see those pins" but you will never get away with it when performing impromptu for family and friends. Magicians have a terrible habit of underestimating the intelligence of laymen. You HAVE to have the pins examined or at the very least handled (and i don't think that is enough) otherwise you are wasting your time even doing the bloody thing.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby performer » August 5th, 2018, 7:23 am

[/quote]


Neither the Andrus nor Van Senus routines ever appealed to me, as, while very clever and ingenious, to me they look like wire puzzles.[/quote]

Yes. Perhaps in the way you might do it. But wire puzzles do not elicit gasps of astonishment in the way that the Andrus pins do. The routining is excellent and doing it with three pins instead of two confuses the issue enough to lead away from the secret. And you can have them EXAMINED rather than merely handled. And they look just like ordinary safety pins which of course is what most of them are. I vaguely remember the Slydini pins looking like nothing on earth although my memory might be faulty.

The Slydini pins is a classic example of the too perfect theory in action.

I have only one objection to the Andrus pins and that is that the climax is a bit weak but naturally I have sorted that out in my usual masterful fashion.

Incidentally I did watch the Gaeton Bloom video again and at least HE has the sense to have them examined even if nobody asks him to. If you don't do that then the trick is not worth bothering with. I still think the Andrus routine is miles better though. Three pins are better than one. And the strongest bit which always produces gasps is where the spectator holds one pin and the other is balanced on top but with a little flick of the pin it goes right through. And then you repeat the action by making the penetrated pin penetrate AGAIN onto the pin the magician is holding. There is nothing stronger you can do with the pin trick.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Joe Mckay » August 14th, 2018, 5:38 pm

David Harkey (who is a magic genius!) has the best handling for the Andrus linking pins.

He totally reworks the effect into a completely different trick.

You can see it performed on Japanese TV over here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_-KSyGUWsY

I wish David Harkey would come back to magic and share more of his wonderful ideas. He was all over the place in the late 80's/early 90's.

His best stuff is some of the best stuff ever published in magic.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Brad Henderson » August 14th, 2018, 5:46 pm

It’s not exactly the same pin as the andrus. Harkey made it very clear in conversation he considered them different, though i think the differences are hard to tell. basically the gaffs in the andrus set are a touch ‘looser’ and make it easier to do the moves in that routine.
Last edited by Brad Henderson on August 14th, 2018, 5:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 14th, 2018, 5:47 pm

The Gaetan Bloom version of Slydini's Linking Pins is the best version. By far. It's on the market.
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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Brad Henderson » August 14th, 2018, 5:51 pm

Sol Stone performed his handling of the Slydini pins when we first met. It looked amazing.

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby performer » August 14th, 2018, 7:36 pm

I can't get excited about the Gaeton Bloom routine at all. The best thing about it is that is over quickly and at least he does have the pins examined. The trouble is that all he is doing is linking and unlinking the pins several times. Just repeating the trick. No variety in the routine--no interesting phases. And no body to the trick since there are only two pins instead of three. He presents it well but alas there is nothing much to present.

You really cannot improve on the Andrus pins. I have no idea why anyone bothers. They usually make things worse. As Al Baker said, "Many a trick has been killed by improvement"

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Re: Slydini's material

Postby Jack Shalom » August 15th, 2018, 10:50 am

Brad Henderson wrote:It’s not exactly the same pin as the andrus. Harkey made it very clear in conversation he considered them different, though i think the differences are hard to tell. basically the gaffs in the andrus set are a touch ‘looser’ and make it easier to do the moves in that routine.


The Harkey effect, which I had never seen before, in my opinion, immediately leads to the solution. I didn't like it at all. I didn't know the working of the Andrus pins, but if the Harkey is the same, then I now know. The Harkey effect has the magic happening right at the gimmicked area. Much harder to tell in the other routines.


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