What is the name of this effect?

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timbrown
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What is the name of this effect?

Postby timbrown » December 12th, 2017, 4:43 pm

Years ago I purchased a trick from a magic shop in Champaign, Illinois (Dallas Magic). It consisted of two Fox Lake bridge decks. I lost the instructions and have spent years trying to remember the name of the effect. Does anyone know the name of this?

Here is what I remember about the trick:

2 cased decks are used:

BLUE DECK – Rough/Smooth Svengali. ½ half is normal random cards (but NO 8 of hearts) that are roughed on the backs. Every other card will be an 8 of hearts that have been roughed on the faces. When spread face-up you will see the random cards but will not see the 8 of hearts.

RED DECK – Normal deck with an 8 of hearts placed 10th from the top.

Ask spectator to name any number (for example from one to 20)

Now show the two cased decks of cards.

Remove, spread through and show the faces of the blue deck. Because of the rough/smooth principle they will not see an 8 of hearts. Cut the deck several times face down to the table.

Remove, spread through and show the faces of the red deck but while doing so cut the correct number of cards such that the 8 of hearts will be at the named number position when the deck is placed face down to the table. This can be done under the guise of “showing the faces of the cards”.

• If the spectator’s earlier named number was “10” you simply false cut the deck in small sections to the table until the entire deck is face down with the force card at the named position

• If the spectator’s earlier named number is less than 10 you would cut off the correct number of cards from the top of the deck (10 minus the number that was named by the spectator) face down to the table and then make a few false cuts with the remainder of the deck. You should end up with the face down red deck that has the 8 of hearts at the correct named position.

• If the spectator’s earlier named number is more than 10 you would cut the correct number of cards from the bottom to the top of the deck (to position the force card at the named position) and then false cut the deck in sections to the table.

Re-case both of the decks

Now use equivoque to result in the red backed deck being chosen by the spectator. At least that is what you want him to think!

You pick up the blue backed deck, remove it from the case and again spread to show all different faces. Because of the R/S you can easily spread the entire deck face up across the table without fear of exposing the 8 of Hearts force cards. Then spread the deck face down while asking the spectator to touch one of the face down cards. You can ask him to change his mind if he wants – it does not matter because he will be touching one of the 8 of heart force cards no matter where he places his finger. Spread this card (to separate the R/S) and hand it to the spectator face down.

Now ask the spectator to take the red deck from its case, hold it face down, count to his number and remove the card at this position. Re-emphasize the fairness (he could have chosen either deck, he could have changed his mind when he selected the deck, he could have touched any card, etc.)

Now have the spectator turn over both cards. They match!

Russ
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby Russ » December 12th, 2017, 7:27 pm

Tim,
No idea. But why when there are so many ways to do this with normal cards. I am sure many others will chime in but think. Think number forces and perhaps the clock effect. Perhaps you just needed a reference to that one purchased effect. Sorry, never heard of it.

Best,
Russ
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Richard Kaufman
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby Richard Kaufman » December 12th, 2017, 10:18 pm

It's irrelevant whether it can be done with straight cards. It was obviously designed to be sold! :)
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luigimar
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby luigimar » December 13th, 2017, 1:38 am

In 1986 I bought a trick that from your description, is almost the same. It is by Loftus Magic and the trick is called "Red and Blue." Mine has a red deck with a blue card 9 from the top. And the blue deck is R&S with a force card that matches the blue card in the red deck. There are 4 cards at the bottom with no force card where you make the chosen card disappear (thanks to the R&S) and it is found at the chosen number in the red deck.

Could it be the one?
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timbrown
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby timbrown » December 13th, 2017, 5:26 am

luigimar wrote:In 1986 I bought a trick that from your description, is almost the same. It is by Loftus Magic and the trick is called "Red and Blue." Mine has a red deck with a blue card 9 from the top. And the blue deck is R&S with a force card that matches the blue card in the red deck. There are 4 cards at the bottom with no force card where you make the chosen card disappear (thanks to the R&S) and it is found at the chosen number in the red deck.

Could it be the one?

Yes - I do believe that it is the same effect! But I've misplaced the instructions so my memory of the effect wasn't entirely correct. I still have the two Fox Lake decks and someday hope to locate the instructions.


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Philippe Billot
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby Philippe Billot » December 13th, 2017, 8:53 am

It's one of the many variations of Robert-Houdin's trick : Double pensée prévue (1868)

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luigimar
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby luigimar » December 13th, 2017, 1:16 pm

Tim,

I have the instructions but I don't know if we are allowed to take a picture (I don't have a scanner to make a better file) and send it to you. Let's see what Richard can tell us about this.

I looked for the trick at loftus.com (so you could try to contact them or buy another trick with instructions) but they don't have it anymore, so I guess you will have to rely on someone owning the effect to get you a copy of the instructions.
luigimar

timbrown
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby timbrown » December 13th, 2017, 9:01 pm

luigimar wrote:Tim,

I have the instructions but I don't know if we are allowed to take a picture (I don't have a scanner to make a better file) and send it to you. Let's see what Richard can tell us about this.

I looked for the trick at loftus.com (so you could try to contact them or buy another trick with instructions) but they don't have it anymore, so I guess you will have to rely on someone owning the effect to get you a copy of the instructions.

Ok thanks! I'd certainly like to get the instruction sheet but not if this is appropriate.


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timbrown
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby timbrown » December 14th, 2017, 11:41 am

CORRECTION!

Ok thanks! I'd certainly like to get the instruction sheet but not if this is inappropriate.

marselmarsel
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby marselmarsel » December 14th, 2017, 10:50 pm

Houdin or Hofzinser idea?

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Q. Kumber
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby Q. Kumber » December 15th, 2017, 3:13 am

luigimar wrote:Tim,

I have the instructions but I don't know if we are allowed to take a picture (I don't have a scanner to make a better file) and send it to you. Let's see what Richard can tell us about this.

I looked for the trick at loftus.com (so you could try to contact them or buy another trick with instructions) but they don't have it anymore, so I guess you will have to rely on someone owning the effect to get you a copy of the instructions.


I see no problem in sending him a copy of the instructions, as he has the original trick.

Philippe Billot
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby Philippe Billot » December 15th, 2017, 5:00 am

marselmarsel wrote:Houdin or Hofzinser idea?


I don't know but if you have a reference which comes from the public record, I'll be happy to know it.

Thanks in advance.

marselmarsel
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Re: What is the name of this effect?

Postby marselmarsel » December 16th, 2017, 7:15 pm

Hofzinser's Card Conjuring by Ottokar Fischer; 1st edition, (1931) translated by Samuel H. Sharpe, published by George Johnson, London.
25 Synonymous Thoughts (First Method)
may be this trick.


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