The Genii Forum

Is Fred Kaps' handling ever published, above or underground?

Darwin Ortiz has a version in Scams and Fantasies. Different unload.

Jackie,

Dominique Duvivier (France) and Jose Caroll (Spain) published versions loosly based on Kaps.

Thomas

Jackie Huang wrote:Is Fred Kaps' handling ever published, above or underground?

Underground stuff likes to stay underground - that means no open discussion, hinting or even mention where the lumpenmagii gather to crow over other people's mistakes.

Jonathan Townsend wrote:

Jackie Huang wrote:Is Fred Kaps' handling ever published, above or underground?

Underground stuff likes to stay underground - that means no open discussion, hinting or even mention where the lumpenmagii gather to crow over other people's mistakes.

How underground is it when you can watch a performance of the piece in question on YouTube?

-Jim

The handling - yes. As I recall it's not in his notes or the two films explaining tricks. That he did the trick IMHO not - problably simplest to just ask Koornwinder or Biro or another of Kaps associates about the handling if of interest.

You can see a performance of him doing the smoking thumb here and there but not a detailed discussion of the gimick or its handling. ;)

Via my Internet search of Gypsy Curse's history I came across this great piece (http://questx.com/magic!/magic-98.html) written by Pete Biro, circa 1992, where he wrote "Kaps developed a version that has yet to see print."

I guess that's still true 18 years later.

And, oh, by the way, there are a lot of good Tommy Wonder's comments in there as well. The good days...

Jackie, Fred Kaps left us in 1980. I don't know he entrusted his material to - or even if he had trustees. If you want to persue the routine you might do well to start by quietly asking Dick Koornwinder and/or Pete Biro directly and perhaps they will offer you the information or point you to someone who can help.

"Quietly" is the keyword. I hear,I hear.... ;)

Thanks, Jonathan.

The only person that might know is Koornwinder. I have seen him do this and never asked. It is definitely a fooler.

"This effect is based on Fred Kaps' unpublished, ungaffed handling of Peter Kane's marketed effect The Gypsy Curse. My version follows the Kaps version fairly closely. the presentation is my main contribution and the reason for publishing it here."

Ortiz met and sessioned with Kaps in company of Derek Dingle. I imagine that's where he learned the routine. So, the Kaps routine is in print.

I don't think so.

Here is the link where Frde Kaos performing 7 Card Gypsy Monte
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufyCwkc0M6I

Is this what is being reffered to by Jackie Huang ?

Pete, it's a fact. Kaps spent time in NY at the Lambs club sessioning with Dingle, Ortiz and Pat Cook. He tipped this routine.

Dingle and Ortiz and Cook can keep secrets. Just because Kaps showed them his version of a trick does not mean any of them showed it around or published the workings.

Except that Ortiz published it in Scams & Fantasies. See above.

The quote is from the book:

"This effect is based on Fred Kaps' unpublished, ungaffed handling of Peter Kane's marketed effect The Gypsy Curse. My version follows the Kaps version fairly closely. the presentation is my main contribution and the reason for publishing it here."