Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

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Jackie Huang
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Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Jackie Huang » July 15th, 2013, 7:09 pm

I won a bid on ebay for an used Frame Of Destruction but it didn't come with the instructions. I was trying to find the secret myself but...ahem...failed. :? :( :oops:

Could someone PM me and tell me how it works? I will send a photo of me holding it to prove I do own it.

Thanks in advance! (This is a little embarrassing actually.)

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Richard Kaufman » July 15th, 2013, 7:38 pm

Essentially, the envelope is longer than the plastic frame: 50% longer. The frame is shifted so you can put the pencil through the middle of the envelope.
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MManchester
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby MManchester » July 15th, 2013, 8:04 pm

Jackie's question brings up an important consideration for this, or any, magic forum. To what extent is the discussion of an effect's method permitted?

I had planned to post a video of my handling and patter for Sakkaku scale. I could get into a discussion of a difference between my approach and that of the method described by Tenyo in the instructions. But I don't want to be guilty of revealing too much.

As a comparison, during an episode of The Magic Newswire podcast someone mentioned the thumbtip. Another participant, who has contributed here recently, objected preferring that it be referred to as a TT. This seemed unnecessary to me as it was a podcast specifically about magic. But a forum is more open to the general public and different rules might apply. Is this to be decided on a case-by-case basis?
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Tom Leyland
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Tom Leyland » July 15th, 2013, 10:56 pm

Believe it or not, what Richard mentions above isn't considered exposure.

There is a fine line.

Jackie Huang
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Jackie Huang » July 16th, 2013, 12:26 am

Thanks, Richard. That was my guess of its principle, knowing how other Tenyo tricks use "shift" as well. Perhaps I just need to watch the video on YouTube few more times and see if I can work out the handling.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Richard Kaufman » July 16th, 2013, 12:58 am

This is a magic forum. We discuss tricks AND methods. Laymen don't come here and read this stuff! It's boring to them.

Jackie, send me an email at moobooks@verizon.net and I'll try to scan the instructions for you. There are lots of subtleties to Sugawara's handling.
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Jackie Huang
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Jackie Huang » July 16th, 2013, 6:22 am

Thanks, Richard!!!! Will do. :D :D :D

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MManchester
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby MManchester » July 16th, 2013, 11:04 am

Laymen don't come here and read this stuff! It's boring to them.


But Genii forum posts do appear as Google and Bing search results. Type in tenyo frame of destruction in Google and a previous Genii forum topic appears on the first page as the fourth result. This one will eventually as well. Laymen are sufficiently interested in magic secrets to justify several exposure specials on Fox. If methods are discussed here in detail, and if someone enters the right search combination, the Genii forum could unwittingly contribute to the dissemination of those secrets.
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Richard Kaufman
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Richard Kaufman » July 16th, 2013, 11:21 am

I run the Forum, and I say it's okay to discuss magic here. End of story.
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby edshern » July 16th, 2013, 12:18 pm

I think the magic community pays far too much attention to worrying about some civilian searching for secrets. The percentage of people who care how the Frame is done, or any other of the THOUSANDS of effects we do is miniscule. There is information out there and it can not be contained, and who cares. Do you think that the masked magician learned how to do magic on the internet? Does it matter that a 14 year old kid knows card secrets. Maybe being more open would encourage a greater involvement on these boards. In fact, I think this community would be better served by being open, sharing ideas, & experience.

Magic is an art form. No one thinks we perform miracles. Everyone knows it's a trick.

"Just because you know how it's done doesn't make it any less beautiful" anon

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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Jackie Huang » July 16th, 2013, 2:12 pm

If there are any previous discussions of how Frame of Destruction is done, I assure you Google fails to find them. :D

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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Jonathan Townsend » July 16th, 2013, 2:44 pm

I think the magic community pays far too much attention to worrying about some civilian searching for secrets.


? unless you are doing material where you claim to cure cancer ... WTF? Imagine what would happen if, even for a moment, someone took a magic trick seriously. Let's take that as proof by contradiction that the audience knows it's not supposed to be serious. That leaves the notion as relevant only inside the magic shop.

IMHO "secrets" is about attempting to add perceived value to magic shop product by offering a false sense of intimacy, share the secret, to the act of purchase which is equated to consumption of items offered for sale to all and sundry in public.

As best I've seen among "civilians" they just want to beware of charlatans and sometimes ask for reassurance by saying "how did you do that" when they might as well be saying "
that was very nice - thank you".

"Secret" - you know the ad copy.
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time

edshern
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby edshern » July 17th, 2013, 3:42 pm

Jonathan Townsend wrote:
I think the magic community pays far too much attention to worrying about some civilian searching for secrets.


? unless you are doing material where you claim to cure cancer ... WTF? Imagine what would happen if, even for a moment, someone took a magic trick seriously. Let's take that as proof by contradiction that the audience knows it's not supposed to be serious. That leaves the notion as relevant only inside the magic shop.

IMHO "secrets" is about attempting to add perceived value to magic shop product by offering a false sense of intimacy, share the secret, to the act of purchase which is equated to consumption of items offered for sale to all and sundry in public.

As best I've seen among "civilians" they just want to beware of charlatans and sometimes ask for reassurance by saying "how did you do that" when they might as well be saying "
that was very nice - thank you".

"Secret" - you know the ad copy.


I don't claim to be the brightest crayon in the box, so don't get me wrong when I say I've read your post twice and have no clue what you are trying to say. Sorry?

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MManchester
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby MManchester » July 17th, 2013, 9:12 pm

I regret giving the impression that I was trying to dictate how the forum should operate. I would delete my previous comment but subsequent remarks would lack context. I apologize.
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Richard Kaufman
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Richard Kaufman » July 17th, 2013, 9:54 pm

Don't worry about it: we value all feedback, even if we disagree.
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Re: Need Help on Frame Of Destruction

Postby Jonathan Townsend » July 18th, 2013, 7:59 am

I don't claim to be the brightest crayon in the box, so don't get me wrong when I say I've read your post twice and have no clue what you are trying to say. Sorry?


The notion of secrets in magic is a lure to the vain, advertising copy, a way to make a product seem to bring the customer "closer" to some imagined place where their idea of magic and what they can buy meet.

Secret - built for ...
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time


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