Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

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Bill Hallahan
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Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Bill Hallahan » March 17th, 2024, 9:12 pm

I've written a book that is currently unpublished. It contains mathematical stacks.

I found some things about the Bart Harding stack that aren't published. I'm certain the ideas are original. I wanted to include a chapter in the book about that. However, I wouldn't published those ideas unless Bart Harding gave me his permission to publish his stack. However, I don't know if he's still alive. He released his stack back in 1962, so he would be very old now.

I know Alan Saxon published the Bart Harding stack. Alan Saxon passed away years ago. Weeks agao, I contacted the head of the Magic Circle through email asking about this. I received no reply. I'm not surprised I received no reply.

As it is now, I'll have to remove that chapter from the book.

Does anyone know if Bart Harding is still alive, and if so, how to contact him?

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Richard Kaufman » March 17th, 2024, 9:27 pm

You don't need anyone's permission to publish variations of published ideas.
The stack and plenty of information about it is all over the internet: https://www.google.com/search?client=fi ... g+magician
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Jack Shalom
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Jack Shalom » March 17th, 2024, 9:36 pm

Bill, is there any way to talk about these original ideas without giving away the actual stack? Say, for example, if you discovered that the diamonds all happen to be at prime numbered positions, it would seem fair to be able to publish that without compromising the stack itself. Then those who do know the stack will be able to use your information.

Richard, it seems to me that as a general rule, magicians have not agreed to such a principle. If because Roth published the Tuning Fork, then I'd be allowed to publish the Tuning Knife, and reveal Roth's modus operandi? That doesn't sound right to me.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Richard Kaufman » March 17th, 2024, 9:37 pm

Nevertheless, Jack, that is EXACTLY how magic literature operates.
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Q. Kumber
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Q. Kumber » March 18th, 2024, 4:24 am

Bart Harding passed away some years ago. I never met him but from what I know of him, I believe he would be delighted to be in your book.

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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Ian Kendall » March 18th, 2024, 5:15 am

We published some work on the Bart Harding stack in the Nine of Diamonds book. As I recall, Neil got the green light from Alan Shaxon to detail the stack in the book; he seemed very happy to do so.

I think you're good :)

Bill Hallahan
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Bill Hallahan » March 18th, 2024, 1:21 pm

Q. Kumber wrote:Bart Harding passed away some years ago. I never met him but from what I know of him, I believe he would be delighted to be in your book.


Thank you. Do you know where he lived and his full name?

Q. Kumber
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Q. Kumber » March 18th, 2024, 3:06 pm

Hi Bill, I contacted Ian Adair (formerly of The Supreme Magic Co.) who told me Bart lived in Southampton and performed mentalism with the billing, The Man With the Computer Brain.

Tarotist
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Tarotist » March 18th, 2024, 3:32 pm

I rather liked Bart Harding mainly on the grounds that he purchased and raved about my svengali routine. We did have some correspondence
many years ago.

Duane Gillam
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Duane Gillam » March 18th, 2024, 5:46 pm

Bart Harding was the stage name of Arthur Bridgeman

Bill Hallahan
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Bill Hallahan » March 18th, 2024, 8:39 pm

Duane Gillam wrote:Bart Harding was the stage name of Arthur Bridgeman


Thank you very much! That lead me to the Magic Week article below. Sadly, "Bart Harding (Arthur Bridgman), died on March 18, 2002, and through a coincidence, it's March 18 today, albeit 22 years later!

I consider his stack one of the most brilliant creations in card magic. I'm a fan of the Aronson stack, and there's no substitute for memorizing a deck, well, almost no substitute. While I usually use the Aronson stack, I can do the card-to-position and position-to-card calculations for the Bart Harding stack fairly rapidly, and of the several algorithmic stacks I know that allow such calculations, I consider that one the best. When spread, the deck appears random.

Some have pointed out he had two exceptions to his rules for how his stack works. However, if his system is understood, then even if someone were to forget those exceptions, they would jump out at a person who forgot them when they made the calculations.

I wish I could have met him.

----------------------------------------

The article from 2002 states:
"Bart Harding (Arthur Bridgman) died on Monday, he was 83. A professional children's entertainer for many years, magicians will also have known him for his unique stacked deck system. He was one of magic's real characters and will be missed by all who knew him • Paul Gordon has asked me to let readers know that David Clake's magic collection is being sold, with the proceeds going to his family Click Here • Magic Societies are now using the MagicWeek Lecturers page much more: Lecturers - maybe you should be on it! • Your news, reviews and thoughts are always welcomed - see you next week, Duncan. 23.3.02"

MagicWeek - Number 91 - 23rd March 2002
https://magicweek.co.uk/backissues_0050-0099/0091.htm

Duane Gillam
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Duane Gillam » March 20th, 2024, 3:31 pm

I would like to know more about Bart Harding/ Arthur Bridgeman. Does anyone who knew him care to share their recollections of what he was like as a person and as a performer? Who was this man who devised such a clever stack and how did he use it in the magic he performed?

Bill Hallahan
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Bill Hallahan » March 21st, 2024, 11:07 pm

Duane Gillam, thank you. I should have asked for that. I know relatively little about him.

I updated what I had already written about him, so the text below now includes the MagicWeek article. Note, I had to edit the Latex text to post it here. Quoted things were often emphasized text, and the footnote numbers are different numbers here, since I didn't actually list the references here.

I want to know more about him too.

--------------------

The "Bart Harding stack" was first published in "The Magic Circular" in 1962. It was published a number of other places after that, including "Club 71 - Spring 1987"[1] in 1987, and later in "The Bart Harding Card System"[2] in 2002.

Bart Harding was the stage name of Arthur Bridgman. I found relatively little about him online. On a German website titled "Magier Der Welt[3], I found him listed as, "Bridgeman Frederic Arthur-Bart Harding." There, I found the citation, "1919 Scotland Magic 12/2002 Page 533 + 5/2002 Magic 12/2002 Page 533" for the following information:

"About the person: Englishman, member of the London Inner Magic Circle and the MENSA Super Intelligent Club, trained carpenter, professional, tricks: children's magic, mental magic, inventor : Inventor of the Harding card system - stacked deck system"

I also found this from a 2002 MagicWeek article:
"Bart Harding (Arthur Bridgman) died on Monday, he was 83. A professional children's entertainer for many years, magicians will also have known him for his unique stacked deck system. He was one of magic's real characters and will be missed by all who knew him."[4]

He was a brilliant creator.

Q. Kumber
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Re: Reaching a creator to ask for permission.

Postby Q. Kumber » March 22nd, 2024, 4:16 am

There must be many around still who know him.
An enquiry on Duncan Trillo's www.magicweek.co.uk should help as well as on many of the UK magic Facebook forums.
The Magic Circle also has its own FB page but it is for members only.


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