New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

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Ryan Matney
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New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Ryan Matney » November 12th, 2004, 10:05 am

Announcing the release of a NEW
LIMITED
manuscript

The Midnight Oil
(Late-night sessions with a Pug)

This new manuscript is strictly limited to 150 copies and will never be reprinted. Bob Kohler can quote me on that! 150 copies and that is all, gents. Each copy will be signed and numbered.
The Midnight Oil contains 10 new card tricks. All but one using regular cards. But, dont worry, because Ive gone through the trouble of having a custom gaff printed for the one gimmicked trick that will be included with each book!

Full Contents listed below:

The Red Skelton Magic ShowA transposition routine with the laughs built in to the presentation. This one has a surprise kicker that always gets an amazing reaction. You end clean and all cards can be examined. Comes with the custom gaffed card supplied! Everything after this trick is gravy.

The CardBoard JungleA spectator selects the treasure that will be stolen by two thieves. This is an easy, commercial, and entertaining piece of magic.

Count Elmsleys Treasure-A multiphase routine with a completely different method that evolved from ideas in The Cardboard Jungle

The L.B. Color Changing DeckAnother very entertaining piece that combines the Signature Transposition plot with the Color Changing deck in a logical way.

ECHO-Easy Chicago Opener.

A Lower DeepSmall Packet ambitious card routine with a surprise finale.

The Hofzinser Insurance ScamA novel version of Hammans Signed Card plot.

The Open Influence A do anywhere, anytime, any deck, surprise transposition trick.

The WitchFinder General The spectator is taken on a hypothetical witch-hunt in this routine featuring a multi-climax finale.

The Conqueror Worm-Further explorations into witch hunting.

Plus, as a bonus, Im giving away my presentation for an underused bit of classic mental magic. This will be presentation only and no working details will be provided. But, you all probably have the book containing this gem on your shelf right now.

The best part about The Midnight Oil is the price. As a special only available to Genii Forum readers, Im offering a pre-publication price of only $15.99 including shipping. $15.99 postage paid.

The Midnight Oil will ship in about three weeks and the price will be raised to $20.99 at that time. Reserve your copy now for only $15.99. Only 150 will be made available. Get it before its gone.

Paypal to Ryan@foocan.com
Also, contact to make payment via check or MO.

My previous publication Card Jones is still available at www.ryanmatney.com Details for ordering The Midnight Oil will be up there soon. The pre-publication offer will not be made available through the website.
Distilled- 100% Pure Self-Working Card Magic - Available now at http://www.ryanmatneymagic.com

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Richard Kaufman » November 12th, 2004, 12:23 pm

What's the point of selling only 150 copies? Do you expect only the 150 people who buy it to be able to credit you for your ideas in the future?
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Bob Farmer
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Bob Farmer » November 12th, 2004, 1:21 pm

My new book, "Magna Carda" will be strictly limited to 12 copies and once they are sold, I will track down each person who bought one and destroy their copy.

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Darren Lawbuary
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Darren Lawbuary » November 12th, 2004, 4:46 pm

Ryan,
Money on its way, buddy.
Darren
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Ryan Matney
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Ryan Matney » November 14th, 2004, 9:17 pm

I wasn't really thinking about making sure I get credited, Richard. What about all the other limited stuff that's been released by big name magicians?
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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Richard Kaufman » November 15th, 2004, 7:46 am

Such as ...

This foolish business of selling only 100 copies of an e-book or pamphlet is silly. What's the point of limiting it?
When someone else recreates an idea that's been published in one of these obscure (and that's the only word for it) pamphlets or e-books, there'll be a lot of crying and wailing on the part of the original inventor.
But too bad, my friend, since almost no one will have read your original publication!
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Van » November 16th, 2004, 9:35 pm

Mr. Matney do you have any effects published in any of the magic magazines(like maybe Genii) so that I can get an idea if I like the type of effects you write. No offense intended but I don't know anything about you or the type of magic you do, so why should I spend any money to purchase your book?

Van

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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Guest » November 17th, 2004, 10:05 am

'Cuz, "This new manuscript is strictly limited to 150 copies and will never be reprinted. Bob Kohler can quote me on that! 150 copies and that is all, gents. Each copy will be signed and numbered."

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Ryan Matney
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Ryan Matney » November 17th, 2004, 12:14 pm

Oh Boy...

Richard, you should run for president in 2008 because you managed to make a whole post without answering my question. Just about everyone has done a limited manuscript at one time or another. You act as if I invented the concept. Larry Jennings even released several limited items, some through Busby, his videos Thoughts on Cards and even so, you are siting on a pile of Jennings material that you frequently 'credit police.' If nobody has seen it but you, Richard, I'd call that pretty limited. Maybe someone can take up the good fight for me. But then, I'm not Jerry Sadowitz and I don't really care if someone reinvents my tricks after they are published in an obscure source. There's a lot better things to take credit for than a card trick.

Also, I might add, as you should know, books don't sell very well anymore. It's been years since you have even attempted a NEW book. Do the reprints even sell as well as they used to? Furthermore, I don't have the name value of Jay Sankey and Ammar. ANYTHING I do, regardless of its quality, will be limited by default. So, I'm just calling a spade a spade and offering something a bit more special to the few people that will be interested. Whats the point of me wasting my money and time to print up 1,000 copies that won't sell? That would be foolish. I won't sell more than 150 copies anyway! Why not just say it's limited?

My previous book 'Card Jones' did well enough to warrent doing another but I did not sell hundreds of copies. It is a limited book in that very real sense.

Van: I've had an item in 'Penumbra' and one in Karl Fulves's 'Latter Day Secrets.' More obscure sources. I like effects where a lot happens for very little effort and I almost never use difficult sleight of hand. As for why you should spend your money on my book, how can I answer that for you?
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Andy Hurst
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Andy Hurst » November 17th, 2004, 1:12 pm

Van - I can answer it for you. If you can't afford to risk $16 on a book full of tricks then don't do it. Ryan posted a reasonable overview of what's in the book, so you've got some idea.

Let's face it, most magicians frequenty toss more than $16 down the toilet on the latest impractical packet trick.

Andy

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Richard Kaufman » November 17th, 2004, 1:13 pm

The Jennings tricks (not books) like "Coin in Beer Can" and "Stabbed Coincidence" that Busby released as booklets were not limited.
His videotapes "Thoughts on Cards" were not limited. (You may be confusing this with the deluxe editon of the tapes, which were limited.)
The only thing I can recall put out recently by a "big" name that was limited is the video on "Reformation" by Guy Hollingworth. But the trick later appeared in his book, so that method is no longer limited either.
Referring to unpublished Jennings material as "limited" is non-sensical.
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Bill Mullins » November 17th, 2004, 1:20 pm

Originally posted by Richard Kaufman:
The only thing I can recall put out recently by a "big" name that was limited is the video on "Reformation" by Guy Hollingworth. But the trick later appeared in his book, so that method is no longer limited either.
I believe Alain Nu put out some of his spoon bending material in limited form. He wanted to establish ownership, but not have it get too far into release.

Whether or not he was successful is another question, given the glut of metal bending videos from the last couple of years, some of which "borrowed" quite heavily from the works of others.

I just saw Apollo Robbins lecture. He had two copies of a ms. for sale which included his "Coin on Shoulder" routine. He said he would not release any more because it is a "worker" for him, and he didn't want others doing it.

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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby magicam » November 17th, 2004, 4:19 pm

"Absolutely NO commentary regarding the listings is allowed and such posts will be deleted..." :p

Okay, enough of being a smart ass.

What about Bob Cassidy's (sp?) website. Doesn't he limit the number of downloads?

What about Danny Korem's "Upside Down Topit"?

I am assuming that this discussion about limited editions only concerns books which are issued in one format only (i.e., there is no 'deluxe edition'), otherwise there have been scores and scores of "how-to" books issued in trade and limited issues, e.g., Okito on Magic, The Dai Vernon Book of Magic, The Magic of Slydini, The Vernon Chronicles, etc.

And with respect to historical books, limited editions almost seem more the rule than the exception, predicated often on the fact that appeal is limited. I printed only 200 copies of Historians Guide to Conjuring (Redux) #1 not because I have a fantasy of it becoming a valuable book, but because I honestly dont think there is a market for more than 200 copies for such a specialized topic.

Clay

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Richard Kaufman » November 17th, 2004, 4:46 pm

If you don't want anyone else doing your stuff, then don't put it in print or on a DVD.
If you put it in print and sell a tiny number of them, then don't be surprised if someone else comes up with a slight variation and publishes that and sells a lot of them.
Don't be surprised if you don't get credit when someone publishes a variation because they don't know where it comes from.
Don't be surprised if customers get pissed off at you because you've decided to sell such a small number of items and they get shut out.
And if you can't sell more than 100 copies of something, has it occurred to you that perhaps it's not worth publishing?
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Van » November 17th, 2004, 6:03 pm

The money isn't the important thing. The important thing is that everyone thinks they should get paid without going to the effort of establishing a reputation. Even Ed Marlo never asked for the big bucks for limited edition manuscripts until he had established himself by publishing in the magazines. Then he published smaller manuscripts through Magic,Inc.(Irelands)All the while he continued to publish in The New Tops and various Racherbaumer publications

Larry Jennings was also an established name among magicians before he went the limited distribution way.

At least, how about some background? What are you credentials? Why should I choose your book over the multitude of others out there?

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Ryan Matney
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Ryan Matney » November 19th, 2004, 6:20 pm

Originally posted by Richard Kaufman:
The only thing I can recall put out recently by a "big" name that was limited is the video on "Reformation" by Guy Hollingworth. But the trick later appeared in his book, so that method is no longer limited either.
Well, let's see there, is:
Every publication Karl Fulves has ever done.
Every periodical Jon Racherbaumer has ever done.
Wesley James released 'Pristine' in a limited manuscript.
Peter Duffie has released several limited items.
Martin Nash, Beme's one card link.
Stephen Hobbs's Labyrinth
Bob Kohler's Ultimate Three Fly and that hold out.
There's a partial list off the top of my head. But, before I forget, here's another 'big name' that also has been known to release limited magic items.
Richard Kaufman.
http://www.geniimagazine.com/kaufmanand ... eases.html
IE: 'Sexy magic', The Stanley Collins book, and a few others over the years.
'Swami/Mantra' was supposed to be limited and that was one of the reasons I purchased it when it was first released. It was later reprinted.
And, from Richard's own ad copy selling his new reprints of 'Strong Magic' and 'Totally out of Control' ...I quote: "Don't wait: these books are being reprinted in limited quantities and may sell out even before they hit the shelves."

Referring to unpublished Jennings material as "limited" is non-sensical.
I don't think so. Not if your argument is that only 150 people will be able to credit me properly.
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Ryan Matney
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Ryan Matney » November 19th, 2004, 6:26 pm

Originally posted by Richard Kaufman:
If you don't want anyone else doing your stuff, then don't put it in print or on a DVD.
If you put it in print and sell a tiny number of them, then don't be surprised if someone else comes up with a slight variation and publishes that and sells a lot of them.
Don't be surprised if you don't get credit when someone publishes a variation because they don't know where it comes from.
Don't be surprised if customers get pissed off at you because you've decided to sell such a small number of items and they get shut out.
But by not publishing it at all, there is every bit as much risk that it will be reinvented. In fact, I have not read every magic book written. There's a chance I have reinvented something that wasn't in a limited book. The problem is the personal credit to one's self is all some magicians worry about.

And if you can't sell more than 100 copies of something, has it occurred to you that perhaps it's not worth publishing?
That would depend what your goals are wouldn't it? I find it fun to do the books. I like to share what I've come up with and I've met some new friends in the process. I make a little bit of money which always goes toward a new magic book. What would make it worth it to you?
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Ryan Matney » November 19th, 2004, 6:37 pm

Originally posted by Van McGee:
The money isn't the important thing. The important thing is that everyone thinks they should get paid without going to the effort of establishing a reputation. Even Ed Marlo never asked for the big bucks for limited edition manuscripts until he had established himself by publishing in the magazines. Then he published smaller manuscripts through Magic,Inc.(Irelands)All the while he continued to publish in The New Tops and various Racherbaumer publications

Larry Jennings was also an established name among magicians before he went the limited distribution way.

At least, how about some background? What are you credentials? Why should I choose your book over the multitude of others out there?
Van, Marlo published a mimograph book, I believe, before he did almost anything else. Also, I'm not exactly asking the big bucks.

Seems like what you are really asking is "Who are you to even have a book?" I don't really know how to answer that. I think some of you are taking this way too seriously.

What am I supposed to do if I don't want to do lectures? What if I'm not comfortable giving my stuff to a magazine? (I don't agree with Josh Jay about what makes a good trick and, as you see, I doubt Richard wants one of my tricks.)

What if, Van, I'm not really interested in having a reputation like you describe in magic? I just wanted to share some tricks I think are fun and this is a way to do it that I enjoy and takes up some boring hours.

See, I don't really know how to answer your question because I don't think that applies to me. But, I'll tell you what, since you were interested enough to ask, if you email me at Ryan@foocan.com with your address, I'll send a proof copy of 'Card Jones' that I have lying around and I'll toss in Richard's copy of 'The Midnight Oil' on me.
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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New Limited Card Magic Manuscript

Postby Richard Kaufman » November 19th, 2004, 6:38 pm

Ryan, don't be a smartass--it wastes the time of everyone here. You cannot compare printings of 500 to 1000 copies to a printing of 150 copies, so don't do it.
If you can't tell the difference between what you're doing and the list of publications by the people you cite above, there's no point in discussing the matter further.
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