World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

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Chance Wolf
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World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Chance Wolf » September 27th, 2003, 3:34 pm

Hey Folks,
I looked into attending the WMS 2004 as a Dealer over 2 weeks ago. I was told that the dealers section was BOOKED UP! I was prepared to offer the asking price of $1000 a table. It seems odd that there is not enough room, already, to squeeze in another table. Has anybody else received a rejection to attend as a dealer? It amazes me that my new company is setting the industry on fire with a revolutionary approach to Childrens Magic unlike ANYTHING in the HISTORY of Magic. You think they would be excited to have us attend. Any other Convention has been more than willing to do anything they can to get us there.
Can someone please give me some insight on this situation? I am only asking because I really was given no explanation or alternative.
Thank you,
Chance Wolf
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George Olson
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby George Olson » September 28th, 2003, 10:42 am

Seeing Chances' delightful material at Stan Kramien's Jamboree last Spring made me a believer!

The thought and craftmanship of his "stuff" is just great....ask Biro.

Stan wanted a couple of pieces on the spot.

Keep trying Chance, :help: if you're not successful, it's their loss.

GO

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Wolfgang
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Wolfgang » September 28th, 2003, 12:33 pm

Hey Chance,
I do not see your point. When they are sold out they are sold out. I am sure you are not asking to be treated different than other reputable dealers.
If you supply your product to one of the dealers going (Joe Stevens, Viking etc.) then you are represented very well and maybe you can strike a deal with those to demo the items for them at their booth......
All the best
Wolfgang

Chance Wolf
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Chance Wolf » September 28th, 2003, 12:55 pm

Wolfgang,
Of course I am not asking for special treatment. I am not trying to "make a point" rather than understand the layout of the convention, being the "monster Con" it seems to be advertised as, that they could not simply make some more room to make more money. Seems common business sense to me. However, I admit my ignorance to this convention as I have never attended and I understand the limitations of room, availabilty etc. My original post was written in haste and I did not mean to sound whiney. I was just more amazed at the apparent limitations for something i perceived as a larger show/Con. My bad.
I am used to actual GIANT Conventions, when I was a Comic Book artist and there was ALWAYS room for more as the intention was to attract attention of ATTENDEES. Having cool fresh new ideas is a sure fire way to add excitment to a Convention.
By the way, no offense, but the last thing i need is a "representative". I am my own company promoting myself at conventions. That is kind of the whole point of going there. I apologize if that sounds cocky or brash Wolfgang, it is not my intention and I truly I appreciate your input.
I am not trying to raise a stink here...just asking questions and trying to gain a perspective.
All is cool as we will probably just dump the whole idea of WMS and plan for Summer Cons where we have been personally invited. Sounds much easier :D
Thanks a bunch!
Chance
Success and wealth are symptomatic of your passion.

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Wolfgang
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Wolfgang » September 28th, 2003, 2:39 pm

I personally think it is very good business sense by the WMS organizers. Rather than taking the etxra cash they make sure that the dealers who registered early have a chance to make money. Instead of having 50 dealers of which none at the end makes money it is smart to have only ten and allow them to make money. The three years I organized "the magic hands" convention in germany we always had only 8 dealers. Everyone in the business knew that sales were excellent and so we had always a long list of companies who wanted in. Dealers who did get a chance to exhibit were asked to spend extra effort in building a bigger and more elegant booth than you see at other conventions thus we had to make sure everyone had a a good shot at making good money. There were offers from reputable dealers who offered $5000 just to get in but a good mix of material was more important for us than the added cash. Also the dealers room was booked a year in advance.
As Gorbi said: He who is late finds the buffet empty......(In a very free translation).
As you know I am following your items closely and I have told you that I think they are excellent but the whole topic sounded to me like you wanted the public to put presure on the WMS organizers and that would be wrong in my book.
:confused:
My suggestion in regards to the having your items exhibited by a company that has a booth there was not intended as having a representative but rather as to have that additional exposure at a convention that you were not able to make other arrangements for. I am sure your items show well and I thought it was also about added sales..... I was just trying to help...

Chance Wolf
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Chance Wolf » September 28th, 2003, 3:04 pm

Wolfgang,
See, that is what I wanted. Insight and yours was great. It makes absolute sense and I could't agree more. Thanks for the advice.
Chance Wolf
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Richard Kaufman
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Richard Kaufman » September 29th, 2003, 8:12 am

I'll play devil's advocate: from the point of view of a convention attendee, it stinks to have just a few dealers. People WANT to go to the dealer room and spend DAYS walking around looking for cool stuff. The fewer dealers there are, the less there is to look at and buy.
I've been to conventions where there were a limited number of dealers and the dealers room was about as interesting as old cheese.
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Brad Henderson
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Brad Henderson » September 29th, 2003, 8:39 am

I think the key is having a large dealer's room with lots of variety. I think Chance's products would offer that variety, but if there were a preset limit or deadline, then to allow him in could stir an avalanche of general dealers demanding to be admitted as well. These potential dealers might see the treatment given Chance as preferential. Sadly, many do not see the benifit of adding a unique product line to a room. To some, it is only about getting oneself admitted in order to take a slice of the pie, no matter how small. I think the organizers of WMS probably have a good idea how much "Action" occurs in the dealer's room and are probably savvy enough to put together the right mix and numbers to make sure its a win-win situation for everyone. To flex the rules could lead to upsetting this balance, and that would serve no one. Instead, Chance, may I suggest you apply for next year's event now and avoid disappointment.

And great luck on your products. That Cheese prop is visually arresting. I don;t do kid's magic, but I still might get one.

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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Jim Riser » September 29th, 2003, 9:18 am

I do not agree with Woflgang's idea for limiting the number of dealers at a convention. We buy magazines for the ads and go to conventions for the dealers. The more choice available, the better. Unless the dealers at conventions are manufacturing dealers, everyone will be selling the same items - no choice and no variety. This is why there is so much cut throat cost cutting - the "dealers" have nothing to offer customers but possibly lower prices on the same items available everywhere. This really is a pathetic situation.

I do not think that anyone would argue that Chance's items would add variety and quality to the dealers displays. His stuff is cool.

Perhaps we can hear from one of the WMS backers as to what their dealer policy is. Other than that, everything is merely speculation and accomplishes nothing. Certainly the Riviera has the physical space available for any dealer who wanted to fork over the needed fees. I do not think this is a factor (more speculation).

Jim

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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Chance Wolf » September 29th, 2003, 10:23 am

Richard & Jim,
Now you are getting to the meat of my original idea I was trying to get accross. Why not open the doors to the CREATORS and DEALERS on a 50/50 split? After all, for the most part, the Dealers are carrying the SAME OL' $#!+!
Sorry guys but the Cons/Shows I have attended get tiring fast with a "pitchman" to the front. I have always found that the booths with the actual Creator sitting behind them has far more people lining up, asking questions and getting personal insight to the effects rather than a quick sales pitch. This is important to me as an attendee.
There is another problem I see is the LACK-LUSTRE Presentation Dealers/Creators give at these shows. We have designed a Booth that is unlike anything you have ever seen at a MagicCon as I have taken the same approach the Professionals have in the Comic-Book field. I can't tip my idea and design as I like the element of surprise but I can assure you a visual stimulous that would FORCE you to "enter" our booth. That is the POINT of these shows. EXCITEMENT.
I, like Richard and Jim, am striving to make killer quality magic. It seems that the Convention people would be as excited as our customers to have us there. Once again, I can accept the "rules" but hell, I thought rules were meant to be broken :D
Thanks for the kind words about my work :) Now maybe I can get back to the shop, make some money and get me a set of Riser Cups!!!
Chance
Success and wealth are symptomatic of your passion.

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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Guest » September 29th, 2003, 11:05 am

You can only fit a certain number of people in the room at a time.

They'd make more money by taking your registration so there is a reason that they refused your request. My guess (and it's only a guess) is that the room is filled up.

Next time register early.

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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Chance Wolf » September 29th, 2003, 11:19 am

Brad & Harley,
I absolutley agree. Early registration is clearly the key. I will plan on that next year as I have already passed on the whole idea of attending this year. At this point, I think it is just a good discussion, regarding this topic, to hash out some thoughts and shine some light on the future. I am learning a great deal and appreciate the input and advice.
I look forward to seeing any of you at future shows. It will be a good time :)
Chance
Success and wealth are symptomatic of your passion.

Dave Egleston
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Dave Egleston » September 29th, 2003, 4:50 pm

Well Mr Wolf,

Acting as yet another devil's advocate:

Here's an idea I've seen at bike shows - This will also piss off the other dealers and Convention planners

Why not drive your truck/trailer to the parking lot and open the back doors during the time the dealers room is closed? -

Or rent a room up on one of the floors and fill it with your product? - Be a lot cheaper than the $1000.00 they're asking for

I know it's not strictly ethical - but I've been to the Desert seminar and know a lot of magicians are selling out of the back of their cars.

Of course you could just display your wares and not sell - call it a showcase and take orders.

Sometimes it takes a bold move to change the rules that need changing

Dave

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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Mike Powers » September 29th, 2003, 6:52 pm

Don't forget the dealers' point of view. There's only so much money to be spread around. I've been a dealer at conventions where they've allowed too many dealers. It may have been fun for the attendees but the dealers came up short. There's a balance, and that's what the organizers should shoot for. They determine the proper number and type of dealer that's, hopefully, best for all parties. It's a crap shoot but there will certainly be a limit on the number of dealers.

Mike

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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Guest » September 29th, 2003, 9:47 pm

Originally posted by Dave Egleston:
Why not drive your truck/trailer to the parking lot and open the back doors during the time the dealers room is closed? -

Don't do it Chance.
All of your lovely props would melt if left in your car in the hot Vegas sun!
They don't call it the Desert Seminar for nothing.

Chance Wolf
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Chance Wolf » September 29th, 2003, 10:17 pm

Payne,
Don't worry. As tasty as it sounds, I think I would have to pass on the ol "Trunk Sales". Somehow it just doesn't reflect the image I am striving to achieve...however...I can give ya a good deal on a Rolex! :D :D
the Chancellor
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Pete Biro
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Pete Biro » September 29th, 2003, 11:20 pm

Climbing up on a soapbox...

I have always thought that at a magic convention the ONLY DEALERS should be the manufacturers. Then the folks that own magic shops can come, see what's new and order stock for their shops.

And, at the same time, the attendees, as a reward for registering can buy direct from the makers -- getting a jump on the new items.

But, alak and alas (whatever than means) no one in charge ever listened to me.

However, I think someone heard me regarding a SAFETY ISSUE in big time auto racing and they made a change to the inside are of the big superspeedways -- THAT I SUGGESTED -- and is credited with saving serious injury to many drivers this year.
Stay tooned.

Adrian Kuiper
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Adrian Kuiper » September 30th, 2003, 12:26 pm

OK Pete.....it'll be Off Thread, but what did you suggest that has made racing safer?

Thanks...Adrian

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Pete Biro
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Re: World Magic Seminar Dealers Room SOLD OUT?

Postby Pete Biro » September 30th, 2003, 3:12 pm

Will email my reply.... thanks
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