Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Discuss the latest news and rumors in the magic world.
Joe Lyons
Posts: 875
Joined: November 13th, 2017, 8:27 am
Favorite Magician: Wonder
Location: Texas

Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Joe Lyons » March 14th, 2021, 6:15 pm


Jon Pendragon
Posts: 62
Joined: November 26th, 2018, 10:26 pm
Favorite Magician: Jonathan Pendragon

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Jon Pendragon » March 16th, 2021, 6:23 pm

I wish him well, it sounds like an exciting project, it sounds like fun. There is a relatively recent history with magic and this story as well as magic and theater in general. In the late 1980s there was a production of Invisible Man outside London that Ali Bongo worked on, it actually ended with the performance of a stage illusion. I believe Max Maven, Charlotte and myself saw it while working on John Fisher's Best of Magic. It's a magician's dream, you can apply many more magical techniques besides thread work. In 1937 Orson Welles presented Dr. Faustus on Broadway under the WPA banner. In the performance he used black art theater as well as puppetry to help tell the story. When theater reopens, we have Harry Potter and the Cursed Child on Broadway. I can't think of anyone who has done more to bring magic to theater than Jim Steinmeyer. His work for the Disney Musicals has made him the Wizard of Broadway. My apologies to Harry and OZ, the Great and Terrible.

User avatar
Marco Pusterla
Posts: 516
Joined: January 17th, 2008, 12:00 pm
Location: Suffolk - UK
Contact:

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Marco Pusterla » March 17th, 2021, 11:41 am

Paul Kieve designed the special effects for The Invisible Man production in London and elsewhere, and his ideas are phenomenal. I think this was the production you saw; not sure how much involved Ali Bongo was.
Marco Pusterla - https://mpmagic.co.uk

Ye Olde Magic Mag: magazine on magic history and collecting.

Tom Moore
Posts: 635
Joined: February 7th, 2012, 6:45 pm
Location: Europe
Contact:

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Tom Moore » March 17th, 2021, 12:45 pm

Marco Pusterla wrote:Paul Kieve designed the special effects for The Invisible Man production in London and elsewhere, and his ideas are phenomenal. I think this was the production you saw; not sure how much involved Ali Bongo was.

Paul designed the effects for the 1993-1994 production that later toured - The Best of Magic was filmed 5 years before that so whilst John Fisher had many talents time-travel wasn't one of them; Jonathon definitely saw the bongo versions...
"Ingenious" - Ben Brantley: New York Times

thomasmoorecreative

Bob Farmer
Posts: 3308
Joined: January 17th, 2008, 12:00 pm
Location: Short card above selection.

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Bob Farmer » March 17th, 2021, 1:02 pm

There is new black art technology available:

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-ne ... 180962748/

Jon Pendragon
Posts: 62
Joined: November 26th, 2018, 10:26 pm
Favorite Magician: Jonathan Pendragon

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Jon Pendragon » March 17th, 2021, 2:24 pm

It was 1988 when I saw the production and yes I am also aware of the later version Paul worked on.

Tom Moore
Posts: 635
Joined: February 7th, 2012, 6:45 pm
Location: Europe
Contact:

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Tom Moore » March 17th, 2021, 3:32 pm

Bob Farmer wrote:There is new black art technology available:

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-ne ... 180962748/


That’s the much hyped vantaBlack and is completely impractical (it requires a huge industrial process to apply it to just a few square inches) and very fragile. We’ve also played with various other similar products and they all have the same problems.
TBH I’ve always found that a textured mat black background provides a much better BA illusion than a pure matt black.
"Ingenious" - Ben Brantley: New York Times

thomasmoorecreative

Bob Farmer
Posts: 3308
Joined: January 17th, 2008, 12:00 pm
Location: Short card above selection.

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Bob Farmer » March 18th, 2021, 8:21 am

Tom: This stuff looks different and looks easy to work with by the videos.

https://www.ko-pro.black/product/musou-black-paint/

Tom Moore
Posts: 635
Joined: February 7th, 2012, 6:45 pm
Location: Europe
Contact:

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Tom Moore » March 18th, 2021, 8:31 am

As i said, we've played with all of the "very" black paints released in the wake of Vanta.....

Black 3.0 is the most durable of them in our experience - that only peeled and failed after a day of handling which was leagues ahead of any of the others.

To quote muso's own website
Due to the powdery light absorption layer, the strength of the coating is very low, so glossing and peeling of the coating will occur even with light contact. The painted object may shrink and crack.
"Ingenious" - Ben Brantley: New York Times

thomasmoorecreative

User avatar
John M. Dale
Posts: 299
Joined: January 18th, 2008, 12:00 pm
Location: Vancouver, WA

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby John M. Dale » March 18th, 2021, 2:20 pm

This from the same manufacturer. It’s not as dark, it’s not a paint but it’s flexible and more durable.

https://www.ko-pro.black/flocksheet/

JMD

Tom Moore
Posts: 635
Joined: February 7th, 2012, 6:45 pm
Location: Europe
Contact:

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Tom Moore » March 19th, 2021, 7:13 am

I'd not seen that before so we have ordered a roll to have a play with. That said so far we've always found that textured black is actually a better black art surface than true matt black.
"Ingenious" - Ben Brantley: New York Times

thomasmoorecreative

Jon Pendragon
Posts: 62
Joined: November 26th, 2018, 10:26 pm
Favorite Magician: Jonathan Pendragon

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Jon Pendragon » May 21st, 2021, 4:55 pm

Jim Steinmeyer once mentioned "Green Art" with green velvet. He told me it worked well and because of the relatively bright color was very deceptive. Tom, I am almost sure you played with this. I haven't and don't know how well known it is.

User avatar
Eoin O'hare
Posts: 142
Joined: January 17th, 2008, 12:00 pm
Location: Ireland
Contact:

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Eoin O'hare » May 23rd, 2021, 3:55 pm

Tom Moore wrote:I'd not seen that before so we have ordered a roll to have a play with. That said so far we've always found that textured black is actually a better black art surface than true matt black.

I have a roll of this I've been playing around with. It's good but not perfect.
If you want to see it in action check out a YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9VaJKIO1JA The Action Lab. He has other videos too.
Designer & Maker of The Stripper Jig Card Trimmer

Tom Moore
Posts: 635
Joined: February 7th, 2012, 6:45 pm
Location: Europe
Contact:

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Tom Moore » May 23rd, 2021, 4:15 pm

The biggest problem is that “black art” is a catchall term that really shouldn’t be.

On a black hung stage making large objects invisible with black cloth is still the best method; however in just about every other application that black art is used our research shows that many other technologies / colours are better. Some of my smallest “bases” that everyone else would have made out of matt black we made using matt blue or wooden brown colour pallets - those bases looked much smaller than an identical base painted black because of exploiting the physics of how the eye process’s colours and patterns. Ive also had great success with hiding depth/bulk in objects using white but that isn’t practical because of how quickly it picks up dirt.

And to loop back to the earlier comments - out in the real world a texture matt black fabric (the one we use is about $15 per 3ft) is far and away the most universally dependable and deceptive black art material for traditional black art effects; it’s still consistently more deceptive and universal than the incredibly expensive black fabrics discussed in this thread.
"Ingenious" - Ben Brantley: New York Times

thomasmoorecreative

User avatar
Dustin Stinett
Posts: 7257
Joined: July 22nd, 2001, 12:00 pm
Favorite Magician: Sometimes
Location: Southern California
Contact:

Re: Derren Brown to create Invisible Man

Postby Dustin Stinett » May 23rd, 2021, 5:10 pm

Whenever I think of "The Invisible Man," I think of the late Sonny Fontana. He spent years trying to perfect that act, but never quite pulled it off. He never gave up, and there's something to say for that. Sonny was a sweet guy, and he was a gifted shadow artist.


Return to “Buzz”