Magic Castle difficulties

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undercut
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby undercut » May 16th, 2011, 9:13 pm

-$64,000 additional dollars lost
-4months and 2 weeks unil the MC runs out of money, and can't pay it's bills.

How long before it closes? This is now measurable.

Where's the first quarter financials?

What's the hurry?

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Richard Kaufman » May 16th, 2011, 9:46 pm

Okay, undercut, I think you've made your point. Let's let the new Treasurer do his work.
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Roger M.
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Roger M. » May 16th, 2011, 10:14 pm

Fixing something that's broken, and doing it in a responsible manner takes a bit of time.

Sitting at your computer and banging out missives, one every few hours takes nothing more than an internet connection and a computer.

undercut, perhaps in 4 months and 2 weeks you'll be able to say "I told you so" if the MC, in fact, runs out of money..........until then though, please give it at least a bit of a rest.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Alan Bursky » May 16th, 2011, 10:57 pm

I hate when people do not tell you who they are! Hiding is for cowards.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Richard Kaufman » May 16th, 2011, 11:50 pm

Alan, stop it. We've already gone over the business of anonymous postings and I don't want to get into it again.
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undercut
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby undercut » May 17th, 2011, 12:50 am

Roger M. wrote:Fixing something that's broken, and doing it in a responsible manner takes a bit of time.

Sitting at your computer and banging out missives, one every few hours takes nothing more than an internet connection and a computer.

undercut, perhaps in 4 months and 2 weeks you'll be able to say "I told you so" if the MC, in fact, runs out of money..........until then though, please give it at least a bit of a rest.



Roger, some might consider that a victory, I would consider it a terrible defeat. I don't disagree that working out a solution is complex, with probable real consequences for actual people. If you and others don't yet understand, there will need to be some MAJOR actions taken. When the Treasurer proposes those changes, there will be people who will throw hissy-fits and act like infants.

Will be people be willing to give up friday lunches, Saturday brunch, cutting out the additional venues, the magician lectures, the member discounts? I'm not advocating those things....I actually don't think they'll account for enough. But would people be willing to part with those, to save the MC?
Can you imagine the chaos of implimentation?

Roger, are you willing to stand arem-in-arm with me and say to the Board that we will support WHATEVER needs to be done?

I had a conversation with a "power that be" a week or two ago, in which they stated that the "guiding powers" would NEVER allow the Yearly awards show to go onto a break even budget. (It's probably the bigggest single loser). With that situation it is going to take a lot of cocktail napkin contracts to bail the club out.

By the way, Roger, if you don't want to read about MC difficulties, God gave you the ability to skip the thread.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Richard Kaufman » May 17th, 2011, 1:10 am

The AMA doesn't need to do any of the heavy-handed things you've mentioned. Simply cutting fat out of the existing budget should more than make up for their deficit.
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Terrence » May 17th, 2011, 11:43 am

There are small things we can do as members.

Larry Horowitz and I have started declining our 20% Volunteer Discount at MC Meals until we're out of this mess. That doesn't help much, but we want to spread that attitude -- more positive than, say, nano-managing an individual board member's weekend life.

I'm increasing giving out of guest cards, and at the magic counter I'm keeping watch for prospective members/juniors.

One thing I've heard is that the BOD is working out how to get progress reports to the membership. (Of course they don't want to telegraph their strategy to those opposed to these efforts, so that's going to be tricky for awhile.)

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Roger M. » May 18th, 2011, 12:23 am

Well, considering your tone undercut.....please let me be more frank in order that you might more clearly understand what I was saying to you.

You're a classic armchair quarterback.
You're incredibly repetitive.
You're extremely harpy and negative, without really offering anything of value beyond screaming "the sky is falling, the sky is falling".

In a nutshell, your posts are generally pointless and certainly a drag to read.

You obviously consider yourself an "insider", but based on your posts you probably are viewed by those who are truly "insiders" exactly as I view you............a harpy old lady, taking every opportunity to let everybody know that YOU know how to fix things, and that YOU have all the answers.

Poppycock........you appear to know nothing beyond how to blow your own horn..........blowing it in your grand total of 28 posts, and blowing it each and every time you post.

undercut
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby undercut » May 18th, 2011, 1:57 am

Thanks for your very productive post on your best evaluation of me and my abilities. It certainly adds to the thread.

As I said previously, if you don't like what I write, DONT READ IT. Can you say, DUH? If you have figured out the title of the thread, you can easily avoid it. Otherwise, it is pretty cheeky to ask me not to post in the thread that I started.

However, you don't actually appear to have read with any comprehension, or you would have seen that I have been castigated for the very specific suggestions that I have made, while you are attacking me for making none.

So let me be clear, this is EXACTLY what the Board is going to encounter when it starts to act (assuming everyone is back from vacations before it closes down)

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Edward Pungot » May 18th, 2011, 1:59 am

The Magic Castle has such a rich history and so many shared, collected memories that I dont think we have to worry about it disappearing or being reverted back into an apartment complex. The big, long-term picture is the Castle is here to stay.

Short-term, there will always be a changing of the guard that will fare well with the magic body one cycle and not so much the next cycle. Such is the nature of politics. The attention that this thread and other circles like them generate is all that is needed to get upper management to get their act straight to avoid further defamation. Someone has to play devils advocate and undercut has done his or her job like an actor playing the part of a magician playing the part of devils advocate. Well done.

We all care about the Magic Castle for the reasons stated above. And we all do our part to show our concern any way we know how. Collectively we all keep the Castle on the straight and narrow to hold it to its proper glory. We are after all the eyes and ears of the Castle, and for most of us, the hands as well. We as the magic community are indeed the heart and soul of what keeps an establishment like the Castle alive.

Those who are in charge need to be reminded and remind themselves of the task and privilege it is to keep the business side of things in working order so that the Club can continue to do what it is world famous for doing and presenting. This will only come about when board and non-board members will remember the joy that magic has given them and the role and honor that they have in giving back by doing their part. For the board members, it will be a more transparent and accountable operation. For the non-board members, it will be a more proactive involvement and inquiry into the boards agendas and committee meetings via looking over the minutes and financial documents and open communication via actual sit-ins.

Im overly optimistic about the future state of the Magic Castle, again, because of such a rich history that makes the place so endearing for us all. Many of my most cherished memories are contained in that old Victorian mansion. The greats who are now relegated to our books and pictures come to life again in the showrooms and within those sacred walls. If we can all somehow manage to respect each others time and each other, than maybe we can all get back to more pressing matters like upgrading our sleights and improving our acts ;)

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Lisa Cousins » May 19th, 2011, 5:14 pm

At last night's Member Meet-Up, Irene Larsen drew attention once again to the critical connection between the Magic Castle and Genii Magazine, and spoke of the crucial role Genii played in spreading the Magic Castle's fame and contributing to its success. It made me wonder if the spill-over from the Magic Castle Forum onto Genii wasn't fueled by some mystical yearning for a renewal of this connection, and I'm thinking probably yes.

We had Milt Larsen speaking about his original inspiration for the Castle and some of the details of the hand-shake deal that got it going, all of which served to remind us of how tenuous and wing-and-a-prayer the Magic Castle has been from the beginning, and yet how enduring.

West Flanagan, granddaughter of the hand-shaker, recalled her visits to the Castle while she was growing up. She told us that Invisible Irma had a "theme song" for each member of the Glover family that was played when any of them entered the room. Cute!

We got to hear from new Board of Directors member Randy Sinnott, who shared information on his business, military, and magic background.

There were three magic presentations: one from Carl Christman, demonstrating a new mental effect he's released; one from Jonathan Pendragon, who used his presentation as a springboard to share some interesting magic theory musings; and one from Bill Goodwin, who told everybody to go to the library if they wanted to learn how it was done.

Irene Larsen then reminisced about the extreme wonderfulness of Bill Larsen, and we watched a video of Bill & Irene doing a spoof "code act" on a Magic Cruise. (Bill: "What kind of drink am I holding up, comrade?" Blindfolded Irene: "Vodka!") This was followed, to Irene's (and everyone's) surprise, by an "update" of the act starring Irene's granddaughter Libby wearing the blindfold, and Libby's boyfriend Brett signaling the code.

The monthly Member Meet-Ups were launched by Board of Trustees member Jon Armstrong at the beginning of the year, and have been (and still are) evolving in interesting ways. I thought the timing of this one, with its emphasis on "remember how it all began" was perfect, and had a reassuring and galvanizing effect on everyone present.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby JohnCox » May 19th, 2011, 6:41 pm

Thanks for that, Lisa. I'm been sick this week, so I couldn't make it. Sounds like I missed a truly great meet-up, dang-it.
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undercut
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby undercut » May 23rd, 2011, 2:20 pm

-$80,000 additional dollars lost
-4 months and 1 week unil the MC runs out of money, and can't pay it's bills.

-new Treasurer, new President
-is the situation getting better, or worse---has weekly monitoring been established?
-where is the First Quarter financials, which they surely have
-is there some sort of monitoring plan in place?
-are there new monitary controls?
-is there a timeline for a comprehensive recommendation moving forward?
-is there a committment to transparency to the membership about what is happening?
-there is a new president-NPH-I'm surprised that he hasn't communicated about this.....about ANYTHING since becoming president---this is leadership in a crisis?

What the hurry? Why rush?

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Steve Bryant » May 23rd, 2011, 3:30 pm

It is hard to believe that the Magic Castle has survived for 48+ years without you.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby undercut » May 23rd, 2011, 8:33 pm

Steve Bryant wrote:It is hard to believe that the Magic Castle has survived for 48+ years without you.


Thanks, Steve! You know that you are right when people don't contest the truth of what you say, or your reasoning, but they instead start to try killing the messenger, because they don't like to hear the message.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Naphtalia » May 24th, 2011, 11:17 am

undercut wrote: What the hurry? Why rush?


Our new board member and the official appointment of NPH as president was on 5/10. Your questions come up just under two weeks after that.

I am both eager and anxious to get information. I don't think one can claim a lack of transparency at this stage with what's happening.

The new treasurer needs time to look over the books and to communicate his findings to the BoD and to the membership.

Give our new treasurer a chance to review the financials, to the BoD to meet again. Give NPH a chance to get information on what the situation really is before he talks about it.

In talking to the folks I know at the Castle, I am feeling more optomistic than I have in a while.
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West McDonough
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby West McDonough » May 24th, 2011, 1:31 pm

Just because they lost an average of $80k per month last year does not mean they are still doing so. Much of that was from large one-time expenditures and hopefully they're exercising a bit more restraint about such things now that they're under scrutiny. I know that our new treasurer is devoting an enormous amount of time on a daily basis going over the numbers and making an analysis, and I know he is in constant communication with both the president and vice president. Give them some time to solidify their understanding of the situation before expecting them to start talking about it publicly. I'd rather they take the time to make sure of their facts and develop a plan that will work, instead of running around talking about every half-baked idea that comes up in the process. Haste leads to mistakes, and in my opinion it's not what's called for here.

I've talked to many of the board members and they are fully cognizant of the seriousness of the problem and the importance of getting things under control. I still have a great deal of confidence that they will do so and, as I said before, I will forbear making any judgments as to their progress for at least a few months.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Alan Bursky » May 24th, 2011, 8:40 pm

Richard,
I was absent that day. As for the Castle, it just needs new management, and a lawyer who charges less [deleted] . I am confident that those things will happen.
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby houdini's ghost » May 24th, 2011, 9:26 pm

If the Magic Castle was Tammany Hall and they made a movie about it, Alan Bursky would be played by J. M. Kerrigan. Or by Jack McGowran, if Kerrigan was busy.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Alan Bursky » May 24th, 2011, 10:30 pm

Thomas Mitchell, Alan Hale, Frank Morgan, & Ida Lupino.
At least I know who Houdini's Ghost is.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Alan Bursky » May 24th, 2011, 10:32 pm

West,
One time expenditures 2 years in a row.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby West McDonough » May 25th, 2011, 2:29 am

Alan,

Yes, I'm fully aware of that fact, and agree that it's a real problem. But there is new scrutiny by people who finally have access to data they weren't being given before, and I believe that will go a long way to making sure that the future doesn't repeat the last two years' mistakes. My point was only that a past average monthly loss doesn't necessarily correlate to current conditions, and that if they want to they can move very quickly to stop the hemorrhaging and I have great hopes that this is, in fact, what is happening.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby houdini's ghost » May 25th, 2011, 11:51 am

No. Tommy Mitchell wouldn't have made a good screen Bursky--or Alan Hale or Frank Morgan. Not even Ida Lupino.
J. M. Kerrigan or Jack McGowran.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Alan Bursky » May 26th, 2011, 12:54 am

Tommy KIrk?

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Alan Bursky » May 26th, 2011, 2:35 am

I am UNDERCUT!

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Jonathan Townsend » May 26th, 2011, 11:39 am

Okay, who's really Irma?
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time

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Rich Cowley
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Rich Cowley » May 26th, 2011, 5:30 pm

I just had an flashback to that scene in 'Spartacus', where all the slaves on the hillside start standing up and confessing...

"I am undercut."

"No, I am undercut!"

{wink!}

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby erdnasephile » May 27th, 2011, 11:43 am

Mr. Cowley:

I am pleased that you chose to join this discussion and are presumably aware of the concerns expressed by some of the members on this site.

I realize that you are not able to comment in detail about future plans. However, is there any way you could please give us a general idea about the timetable for informing the membership about the way forward from our current situation?

Thank you for your kind consideration of this request.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Richard Kaufman » May 27th, 2011, 12:07 pm

He has not "joined" the discussion--he made a joke.

AMA board members are legally prohibited from any discussion because of an insidious non-disclosure agreement that will hopefully be dumped sooner rather than later so the board members can once again speak with the members of the AMA.
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Rich Cowley
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Rich Cowley » May 27th, 2011, 12:09 pm

Erdnasephile, please don't misunderstand me; I added to this conversation only to lighten the mood a bit. At the risk of sounding rude: While I admit to "lurking" in this thread, I have no intention of contributing substantially to the conversation.

The way I see it, the Academy of Magical Arts is a private club, and I don't think it's appropriate to discuss its private business on a public forum. Unlike others, I don't believe that, just because you love magic, you automatically have a right to learn/dissect a private organization's workings.

Those in the AMA already know that I'm a frequent poster on our private forums; if I have something to say to the club, you'll likely hear from me there first. I admit, the AMA has had some issues with forum censorship in the past, and this forum then became the de facto place for frank/open discussions. Those in the Academy know I've worked hard to eliminate the roots of that censorship, though, so (with utmost respect for Genii) I'm saddened to see this forum continue to be the place where some in the AMA still choose to "air out the dirty laundry".

Further: Those who know me well, also know I hate anonymity. Again, all respect to Genii, but - I'll rarely engage at length with folks who won't use their real name and/or face.
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby mrgoat » May 27th, 2011, 1:00 pm

The Magic Castle forum was possibly the worst magic forum on the internet. And I am including Magic Bunny in that list.

I think I have less than a dozen posts there.

I rejoice RK is letting people discuss the most important magic club in the world uncensored. The business may be a private company, but I don't see why that should preclude it being discussed?

I'm sure other private companies such as Apple, or Disney have their inner workings being discussed by passionately interested parties elsewhere on the interwebs.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby JimW » May 27th, 2011, 1:57 pm

The June newsletter is now available in the Members Only section of the Magic Castle web page. Neil Patrick Harris goes into some detail about the work being done in his "Message From The President" column. It sounds like things are headed in the right direction.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Chris Aguilar » May 27th, 2011, 3:04 pm

The fact that people persist in posting these "castle dirty laundry" threads here and not on the official Castle forums tells us that Mr. Crowley and those in charge are failing miserably in making said forums more conducive to that type of discourse.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Richard Kaufman » May 27th, 2011, 3:10 pm

That's why I leave this thread open.
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Lisa Cousins » May 27th, 2011, 4:04 pm

I almost hate to admit this, but - as worrisome as the financial troubles are and as sincerely as I want to see that turned around - I'm actually glad that the non-magic events have not proved lucrative, as that would encourage the Magic Castle to continue on in that direction, which I believe to be a wrong one.

The push during the past several years has been to convert the Magic Castle into an all-purpose entertainment venue open to everyone, and all of the advertising and promotion of these events has hinged on the betrayal of Magic Castle exclusivity. On numerous occasions when I was behind the magic counter last year, I heard people bemoan (usually while also bemoaning the loss of Hollywood Magic) how the Magic Castle is now open to anyone. One woman told me how glad she was that she'd had a chance to visit the Magic Castle "back when you really had to know someone to get in."

It made me feel that, however lucrative the events might be, the long-term and enduring price we were paying in the loss of Magic Castle mystique was simply not worth it.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Richard Kaufman » May 27th, 2011, 5:22 pm

Lisa, you just have to face the fact that the AMA is going to need to generate more income in the future, no matter who the landlord is. That means expanding the business.

If I had to stand on the corner in my underwear and sell copies of Genii one at a time to generate enough money, I would do it to keep my business alive.

Fortunately it hasn't come to that, but the AMA may have to run non-magic events to draw people in. What would be genuinely great is if the restaurant were good enough to draw people just for the food and not necessarily to see entertainment afterward.
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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby erdnasephile » May 27th, 2011, 5:36 pm

mrgoat wrote:...I'm sure other private companies such as Apple, or Disney have their inner workings being discussed by passionately interested parties elsewhere on the interwebs.


Indeed, there are many very successful companies who sponsor and encourage frank exchanges on public boards that they run themselves. In fact, the feedback they get from those forums often are used to track down bugs and improve product. The company forum reps seem to be genuinely interested on what the consumer posts and respond accordingly--and it doesn't seem to hurt business nor harm brand loyalty. Indeed, the more open the company seems to be, the more the consumers seem to like it. Examples range from Garmin to even the Dallas Mavericks--you can directly email the owner, Mark Cuban, with a concern and he will answer and address the issue.

Genii and the Genii Forum also fall into this category, and I'm thankful for that.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby mrgoat » May 27th, 2011, 6:04 pm

Richard Kaufman wrote:If I had to stand on the corner in my underwear and sell copies of Genii one at a time to generate enough money, I would do it to keep my business alive.


I'll film it, we'll pop up a pay site. Make a fortune.

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Re: Magic Castle difficulties

Postby Brad Henderson » May 27th, 2011, 6:54 pm

What kind of underwear?


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