The Jerx Year Three

Discuss general aspects of Genii.
Joe Mckay
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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Joe Mckay » February 25th, 2018, 4:00 pm

It is interesting trying to find tricks that could go well with Google Home.

My sense is that most self-working/mathematical card tricks will be able to be adapted in this way. Miraskill would be a good one to use in this way.

Of course - dressing up an old mathematical card trick in this way is not very imaginative. But I find it useful to start with the obvious ideas and then try and build up from there.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Joe Mckay » March 6th, 2018, 11:47 pm

Something I have been thinking about is how to apply Andy's "Jerx" style approach to magic rather than just mentalism type effects.

I really love Andy's ambitious presentations. There is nothing else like it in magic. But since Andy is a big fan of the interaction made possible with mentalism - his creative focus is often centered on mentalism type effects.

Of course I can think of a few magic tricks he has come up with creative presentations for as well. But the majority of ambitious thinking is centered around mentalism effects. Rather than more traditional magic effects.

A key difference between mentalism and magic is this. Whilst both will fool the mind - only magic can also provide a visual novelty at the same time. You see a card change into another card. It fools you and your eyes get a lovely jolt as your brain tries to comprehend the impossibility it has just witnessed. It is like a momentary (non-drug induced) hallucination.

So with this in mind. I wonder what would make for good "Jerx" style approaches to the T&R card, the linking cards, colour change, colour changing deck, rising cards, coin vanish, coin assembly, coin thru' table and so on...?

Tom Stone has a fascinating colour changing deck that relies on change blindness that was in GENII a few years ago. The method is incredibly bold. So much so that it is even more interesting to watch when you are let in on the secret and get to watch it again. Watching somebody else be fooled by the trick that just fooled you - whilst you are watching the method stare them in the face - is something that really intrigues me. And I am sure that such a premise is not too far away from a "Jerx" style presentation. In this case with a dose of inspiration from the work of Penn & Teller as well.

I once came up with a fun presentation for a coin trick. It is a coin trick where you use simple sleight of hand to (secretly) switch one coin for another - that is twice as big. So you give the effect of the coin instantly doubling in size.

I will give the presentation below. It is a nice example of taking a simple coin trick. And resting a BIG concept on top of it - so that the coin trick hints at a much bigger (and more interesting) effect.

I ask the spectator if they want to see a coin trick or the largest magic trick ever attempted?

They always pick the latter. But even if they pick the former - I can still bend it to justify what I am going to do next.

I then show them a coin. I tell them that instead of trying to make the coin double in size. I am going to do something even more impressive. I am going to make the rest of the universe shrink in half.

I then pass my hand over the coin and the coin doubles in size. I then tell them I am glad they didn't ask for the coin trick since it is not nearly as good a trick.

------------------

If they ask to see the "coin trick" - I just brush over what they said and tell them I will show them something much more impressive instead. And do the presentation above. They soon realise that I was gonna' show them the coin trick either way.

One interesting approach that Andy does detail is not so much to do with the presentation of the magic trick. But is instead addressed at the mystery surrounding the secret.

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2017/8/14/embedding-secrets-in-secrets

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2017/11/8/the-faux-secret-imp

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2016/6/12/a-big-concept-and-a-little-idea [see the second part of this post]

I suppose working on universal meta-presentations like these might be the best way to make a magic trick more interesting. Rather than trying to shoehorn a much bigger concept into a magic trick? And since you are looking for meta-presentations, there is a lot more room to find something genuinely new. Rather than some new clothes for an old trick.

And speaking of universal presentations that can be applied to any magic trick. Simply asking for feedback on something you are working on is a low-key way to make a magic trick more engaging. This is something Andy has covered as well.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Joe Mckay » March 10th, 2018, 3:01 pm

I always said that my favourite example of Dual Reality in magic was 'Freak Out' by Joshua Logan.

But I think Andy's latest offering pips it.

I assume the "Pray the gay away" plot is a new one in magic? And it makes a for wonderful (and funny) use of Dual Reality.

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2018/3/8/gardyloo-49

Andy is one smart (and funny) mofo...

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby AJM » March 10th, 2018, 3:40 pm

Joe - are you on commission?

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 10th, 2018, 3:53 pm

I have often wondered if he IS Andy!

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Joe Mckay » March 10th, 2018, 5:26 pm

Yes - yes... I am sure I have heard this accusation before

I just happen to be Andy's No. 1 Fan. I can see why people mix that up with regular people. As it is - I would happily admit to being Andy - if I happened to be Andy.

Ironically - Mark sold my Mum a Svengali deck when I was 7 years old. And I am sure that has played a big part in me being here 29 years later...

I would be delighted if I was The Jerx (Andy) - since I would have no reason to hide my identity. Alas - unlike Andy (whoever he is?), I am not a genius. I wish I was. If I was - I would be more than happy to boast about who I am.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby AJM » March 10th, 2018, 6:10 pm

I think anyone interested in Andy’s blog knows where to find it.

I look in now and then.

I did happen to see the the trick you describe which uses the Jerx app (which I have) and thought it was a bit lame to be honest. I guess it’s all a matter of opinion.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 10th, 2018, 6:20 pm

Yes. I think I sold your mother a deck in Gateshead. Oddly enough you are not the only magician who has told me that either they or a parent purchased a svengali deck from me and that was the start of their lifelong interest in magic. It has happened on a few occasions. However, the most memorable of them did not involve the svengali deck at all.

Years and years and years ago I was visiting the Magic Circle and asked one of the members how he started magic. He said, "You!" and he startled me by telling of the time he saw me doing card tricks on the top floor of a double decker bus in London! I was reading a book on card tricks and someone asked me about it. Before I knew where I was the whole top floor of the bus was crowded around me watching, laughing and gasping and that included the bus conductor! I still remember overhearing one fellow saying to his friend, "he doesn't look like a magician--he looks like a "lernuch". To this day I don't even know what a "lernuch" is. Or what language it is. I suspect it might have been Yiddish as the bus was going through a Jewish area. I should really look up the meaning but I have a horrible feeling I might not like it.

Anyway, I forgot all about it until years later when I met this guy at the Magic Circle. All I can remember about him is that his name was Barry something or other. He told me that he saw me performing on the bus and decided to investigate magic. As a result of my youthful shenanigans on the bus he found sources of learning and eventually joined the Magic Circle where he told me the story years later.

Magic is a funny thing......................................

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Joe Mckay » March 11th, 2018, 12:45 am

I was quite dumb as a kid. As such - I had no idea that the Svengali deck I had consisted of long and short cards.

It made the deck much more magical to me since I honestly had no idea how it worked. I knew every other card was the same. But I couldn't figure out why the deck worked the way it did just from that.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 11th, 2018, 10:52 am

The same thing happened to me. When I was a kid I found a deck lying on the ground in a park. I flipped them back and forth and was amazed to find them all nine of clubs one way and all different the other way. I couldn't figure it out at all because of course I never noticed the difference in size.

In fact this can be useful if you ever want to have the deck examined when you perform the trick. I never bother since I simply say, "This is a trick deck I purchased in a magic shop" which saves a hell of a lot of time and they are still amazed anyway. However, if you really want to have the deck examined you simply make them all different. Then you make them all the same. Then you inform the multitude that you will make half of them the nine of hearts and half of them not. You do so then hand the deck out for examination and hope to God they haven't purchased a deck in the past themselves. If this is the case they will find half the deck identical and half not just as you said would happen. Nothing is exposed since they won't spot the different lengths of the cards. Retrieve the deck and continue with the routine and give the well known false explanation with two piles.

If you are really a purist you can actually have the deck examined and no identical cards show if you use an Al Baker idea that I have no space to describe. However, it can be found in my most wondrous "The Long and Short of It" book on the subject which is now the standard work on the subject. It can be obtained here:
https://www.marklewisentertainment.com/ ... short.html

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Joe Mckay » March 11th, 2018, 12:24 pm

Mark - do you have an article about the Svengali deck coming up in GENII soon?

I am really interested in your experiences in this area.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 11th, 2018, 3:52 pm

I gave Richard my article some time ago. I am getting a psychic vibe you will never see it and my genius will have to go unrecognised.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby jkeyes1000 » March 13th, 2018, 8:09 pm

A good way to deal with a heckler who knows how The Svengali Deck works, is to switch it for an ordinary pack with say, The Ten Of Spades every other card and watch him try to achieve the effect!

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 13th, 2018, 8:38 pm

That is an amusing idea!

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 13th, 2018, 8:42 pm

On the other hand I have found even the people who have purchased them and read the instructions STILL don't know how it works! Not that I care. The decks are only for buying and selling. It doesn't really matter to me if they work or not.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby jkeyes1000 » March 13th, 2018, 10:20 pm

I have fond memories of amusing myself with the TV Magic Deck that I got in the mail when I was a kid, almost fifty years ago. It was one of the few tricks I could afford, or even get hold of, as there were no real magic shops around. Understood perfectly well how it worked, but couldn't for the life of me think of a decent routine.

Nowadays I'm much wittier. After demonstrating the familiar effect, and switching the Svengali for a regular deck with alternating dupes, I would hand it to the sarcastic fellow and allow him to make a fool of himself.

Taking the deck back, I would switch it again. This time for a pack of fifty-two, all the same.

"Well, you're off to a good start, I'll say that for you.

"You've done a thorough job of showing the cards to be mixed.

"Now let me show you once again, how they can be rendered consistent."

Riffle the pack a few times, then fan them or spread them on the table, showing each and every one to be the "chosen card".

What could the poor wretch do but sob at this point?


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AJM
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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby AJM » March 14th, 2018, 8:54 am

It’s ironic when you think about it, we move from (supposedly) cutting edge magic to the old, hackneyed,
Svengali deck in the blink of an eye...
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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Jonathan Townsend » March 14th, 2018, 9:58 am

Any source for "TV Magic" decks - the ungaffed ones - regular pack of cards. So far I've found the red Svengali and the blue stripper packs and the set of gaffs plus card box... but no ungaffed red backed deck. ??

Thanks in advance
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby jkeyes1000 » March 14th, 2018, 11:20 am

I still have my original "TV Magic" Svengali deck somewhere. Fox Lake (red). I have never actually performed the above sketch (which is more of a put-down of a rude upstart than a proper routine. Switching the pack twice? That's just flouting!) but if I were to prepare for it, I would try to find a couple of decks of all-the-same card; keep one as it is; and split the other one in half to make a "regular" pack with alternating force cards.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Jonathan Townsend » March 14th, 2018, 1:29 pm

jkeyes1000 wrote:... Switching the pack twice? That's just flouting!...
There are routines that casually mention deck switches in Hofzinser's Card Conjuring.
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 14th, 2018, 8:13 pm

AJM wrote:It’s ironic when you think about it, we move from (supposedly) cutting edge magic to the old, hackneyed,
Svengali deck in the blink of an eye...



I can assure you that my old hackneyed svengali deck routine will garner three times as much reaction from laymen (sometimes even magicians) as all the cutting edge edge stuff from any alleged hotshot card magician you can name.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby MagicbyAlfred » March 14th, 2018, 11:45 pm

Sometimes things are so old that they become new again. There was a time, at least in the U.S., when Svengali decks were very widely known among laymen, but that was back in the 60's and 70's. And is the fact of their notoriety back then any surprise considering that Marshall Brodien sold 17 million Svengali decks under the name "TV Magic Cards"? But here we are six or seven decades later, and I don't believe they are very well known or recognized among laymen today, especially anyone under the age of 50 - which is a heck of a of lot of people.

Now I have seen Performer's routine, and it is anything but hackneyed. If you are entertaining and understand presentation, you can get great reactions with the 21 Card Trick. In fact, the great Bill Malone does just that, as Performer does with the Svengali deck. Like Bill, Performer understands that presentation is paramount, and he knows how to entertain laymen, not only through clever routining, but because he presents his witty, very likable self. And something can be hackneyed (meaning overused, lacking freshness, worn out or spoiled from long familiarity) if, and only if, the observer is very familiar with it and has seen (or at least heard about it) time and time again to the point of it being cliche. But, again, the pendulum has swung, and most laymen in this day and age don't have a clue what a Svengali deck is, or how it works. So the old has become new again. But I highly doubt that it has ever been anything but fresh in Performer's hands, whether half a century ago or today.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby AJM » March 15th, 2018, 2:58 am

Yes, I know what hackneyed means - that's why I used it.

There is nothing more hackneyed than Ronnie Performer turning almost every thread into one about his cheeky chappy past and his beloved Svengali decks.

It was suggested previously that he should start his own thread where he can talk about himself to his heart"s content.

Cheers

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby MagicbyAlfred » March 15th, 2018, 7:51 am

Gosh, AJM, I think that thou doth protest too much. I don't know what it was about my post that led you to believe I thought you did not know what "hackneyed" meant. The fact that I succinctly defined it (in a parenthetical) for context of my point, does not logically imply that you did not know the definition.

Second, I don't think it is even close to being a fair characterization to say that Performer turns every thread into one about the Svengali Deck and/or his past. IMO, he is a witty, engaging, entertaining writer and raconteur, with lots of insight on magic and its presentation, born of long experience. You apparently have a personal dislike for him, as evidenced by your ad hominem attack, but I fear this would be a far less interesting and entertaining forum if he weren't here to spice (and yes, stir) things up. The most recent threads in which I have participated are this one and the wonderful 3 Card Monte thread, and I don't see how he turned either into a diatribe on the Svengali Deck or his past. In fact, he took the time to research the issue of bordered versus plain cards in the monte and to make and post a video, which in my view, proves the important point he made that going slower is a far better approach, and, in fact, more deceptive, than tossing the cards fast. Like Vernon said, confusion isn't magic. Nicely done, Performer.

Third, if a member does not want to read a post by another member, no one is forcing him/her to do so. I could say more, but he is more than eminently capable of speaking for, and defending himself, and I have no doubt that he will...

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby jkeyes1000 » March 15th, 2018, 1:14 pm

Here is a simplified outline of my "Svengali Sucker Routine".

To prepare: Obtain three Svengali decks of the same design. Out of two of the packs, separate the regular cards from the short cards. Put all the regulars together to form a complete deck; then do likewise with the shorts.

You should now have a proper Svengali; an "ordinary" pack, and a one-way.

Mark one of the boxes with a black felt-tip pen, so as to distinguish it in the eyes of the spectators. Write "DEMO" or your name--anything, that it may be recognised as the original box. Place the true "Svengali" deck in the box.

Put the regular pack (loose, unboxed) in a side pocket of your jacket.

Place the one-way (also unboxed) under a newspaper on the table.

To perform: Remove the Svengali pack from the box, being sure to lingeringly show the distinctive markings on the container before stuffing it in the pocket that holds the ordinary deck.

Do a typical Svengali routine. If a member of the audience claims to know how it was done, ignore him until you have reached into the pocket for the box, and switched packs. Bring out the same recognisable carton, but with the regular deck. Pop the cards into the box and toss it on the table. You may now either proceed with another bit, and let him grab the cards, or invite him to demonstrate his familiarity with the trick.

He shall fail miserably to expose the gaff or the method.

If this is not enough of a humiliation, take back the ordinary deck, and say something mildly sarcastic, like: "Very good! You've shown the cards to be all different.

"Now, would anyone like to see again how we do the magic?"

With the regular deck in hand, lift the back edge of the newspaper, simultaneously depositing the ordinary pack on the table underneath it, and slide the paper a few inches to casually reveal the one-way. Immediately pick up the latter and say either, "Pardon me: Do you happen to have the box?", or "What In blazes did I do with those instructions? Oh--well!"

Spread the cards face down and ask a spectator to choose one and replace it in the deck.

Snap your fingers and proceed to "spill" the cards face up (in the typical manner) indicating that the whole pack is suddenly replete with his or her selection.

"The secret, of course, is that all of the cards are now perfectly identical!"

The one-way deck may be fanned, scattered on the table, and/or given out for examination.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby AJM » March 15th, 2018, 3:00 pm

MagicbyAlfred, you’re not Ronnie Performer by any chance?

The old spider senses are tingling.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 15th, 2018, 4:26 pm

First, let me clear up one or two points in this thread.

1. No. Alfred is NOT me. I have had this discussion before in the past with Richard himself. There are videos of him performing and he has a website that can be checked out.
2. I did not bring up the svengali deck first on this thread. Joe McKay did and of course had a perfect right to do so and I had a perfect right to respond on the matter as did Mr Keyes.
3. I hardly regard the svengali deck as "beloved" as I hate the sight of the bloody things. I will concede that I do regard all the money I have made with the deck as not only beloved but absolutely adored.
4. I have no need to defend myself since Alfred has done a magificent job in doing so and has left me with not much more to say. However, as a psychic reverend of some repute it is incumbent upon me to treat AJM with the utmost compassion. It must be very difficult for him to contain his envy when he is in the presence of one of the world's greatest magicians and has to compare his meagre talents to someone of infinitely more ability. I do suggest some peppermint tea to calm him down and for him to accept the sad reality that some of us are born to lead and some of us are born to follow. Alas he is in the latter category but he must not despair. In my spiritual capacity I shall pray for his unworthy soul.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby MagicbyAlfred » March 15th, 2018, 4:55 pm

Methinks that AJM might be lacing that peppermint tea Performer mentioned with a wee bit of Glenlivit. I understand that the combination has hallucinogenic properties. And perhaps he is listening to that Beatles song as he does so - you know, the one that goes:

"I am he
As you are he
As you are me
And we are all together"

- and then there's that part about the Walrus (which is who I really am).

But, I am happy to be anybody he wants me to be. I just pray that he doesn't tip my new and exciting effect, "Chameleon Delusion" to Penn & Teller prematurely.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Brad Henderson » March 15th, 2018, 5:24 pm

keyes,

your example seems to support my theory that your approach to magic is relevant only to people who know the methods. As you said, magic is a puzzle where you invite people to figure out how it's done.

would you say that's true? if it's not true, what about the routine you have offered belies that claim?

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 15th, 2018, 5:47 pm

And now back to Jkeyes and Brad once more!

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby AJM » March 15th, 2018, 5:47 pm

I think a DNA test is called for - I'm convinced there must at least be a familial match.

(I would genuinely have expected Ron to come up with the Glenlivet 'gag' so Richard may well have a point.)

Anyway, until the results come through, let's all sit back and enjoy the next Brad/Keyes debate...

Cheers

Andrew
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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Richard Kaufman » March 15th, 2018, 5:51 pm

Alfred is not Mark. I can attest to that. But I would assume they are friends.
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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 15th, 2018, 5:54 pm

I have never met Alfred. I don't even know where he lives. However, here is proof of his identity. He has his own you tube channel.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnrrti ... 8XdTvjRccQ

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby MagicbyAlfred » March 15th, 2018, 6:47 pm

performer wrote:I have never met Alfred. I don't even know where he lives. However, here is proof of his identity. He has his own you tube channel.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnrrti ... 8XdTvjRccQ


Well, until a few months ago, it was Santa Rosa, California; now it's Myrtle Beach, South Carolina. If anyone gets out this way look me up...

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby jkeyes1000 » March 15th, 2018, 8:16 pm

Brad--We are talking about The Svengali Deck. At the very least, everyone knows it is gaffed. I should think it would be of interest to anyone performing the standard routine, to dispel the idea.

And I made it clear enough, that this is a recourse in the event that someone does get "smart".

In addition, I would imagine the general audience will get a kick out of seeing a cynic get his just desserts. And be glad they weren't him!

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 15th, 2018, 9:32 pm

I don't really do this very much, if at all but there is something you can do after the deck is switched. You have done all the usual svengali stuff but you continue doing it after the deck is switched. This is how. Make sure the third card from the top is the key card. Do a triple lift, put the top card face down on the table. Now do a double lift showing the same card and put that face down on the table. Show the now top card also to be an identical one, top change it and put that on the table. That should satisfy any needy magician who desperately requires "cutting edge" sleight of hand.

You now show that the three previously identical cards have changed to indifferent cards. Your first magic moment. You now overhand shuffle the top key card to the bottom of the deck, do the well known Hindu shuffle move where you flash the bottom card repeatedly showing the deck is identical. Finally you show the entire deck is normal. Then leave them on the table. Someone will grab them particularly if they were foolish enough to purchase a deck from me at some time or other. They will find nothing.

Just one of my little touches in "The Long and the Short of It" which is now considered to be the definitive work on the svengali deck and obtainable direct from me. For some reason which I don't quite understand there has been a little rush on this book lately. I am not sure why. Perhaps somebody mentioned it on the Magic Cafe or something.

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Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby Brad Henderson » March 15th, 2018, 10:11 pm

does everyone think the cards are tricked? does everyone know the svengali deck?

my experience says otherwise.

My experience also tells me that audiences LOVE seeing one of there own baited and humiliated. It makes them incredibly eager to volunteer for other pieces and always pushes them to root for the success of the performer.

It's that confrontational aspect of magic we should play up as much as possible.

Now tell me keyes - am i lying?

performer
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Joined: August 7th, 2015, 10:35 pm

Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby performer » March 15th, 2018, 11:16 pm

The reason so many people do not know the svengali deck despite the fact that thousands upon thousands of them have been sold over the years is very simple. New kids are born every year and as yet haven't seen it. And this can go on for decades. It brings new meaning to the saying "there is one born every minute"

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jkeyes1000
Posts: 472
Joined: August 2nd, 2012, 3:12 pm

Re: The Jerx Year Three

Postby jkeyes1000 » March 16th, 2018, 3:49 am

Let me put it this way, Brad: When folks recognise it as a Svengali Deck, they know it is specially designed. Why else would Mark be selling it? I personally don't know anyone that tries to pass it off as an ordinary pack. Do you?

And if anyone did, how far would they get before someone said, "I've seen that trick before"? It only takes one.

And the odds favour there being at least one in every crowd.

As I have noted on several occasions--you have a very feeble grasp on logic. Here you are, once again contradicting yourself in hope of making a temporary point.

You oh-so-sharply suggest that spectators resent being fooled by magicians, yet it was you also that driveled on for pages about how they will allow themselves to be deceived for the sheer delight of it.

Besides--the scenario I wrote above in no way reflects ill upon the performer. The impression given is that the braggart gets what he deserves. It is his own determination to expose the secret and thereby spoil the effect. Are you now on the side of The Puzzler, The Critical Thinker, The Sceptic?

All to prove how devastating your In-depth analysis of my theatrical routine can be.

Perhaps you should have become a boxer. You "float like a butterfly, sting like a bee". You are always shifting in order to get in a good jab and dashing this way and that to avoid being hit.


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