The Genii Forum

I have made a list of topics/questions that I find boring (Thank you, Mr. Giobbi) but which I realize others might find fodder for engaging discussion:

1. Is it a trick or an effect?

2. Is it misdirection or direction?

3. Is it a double lift or a double turnover?

4. Why read a book when I have Youtube?

5. Is magic dead?

6. Real Secrets.

Andy has been running a small pledge drive this week (it ends tonight).

Anyway - it is a shame how many people are unaware of this great blog. So I just want to link to some amazing magic that Andy has shared on the blog:

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/9/28/cryptophasia

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/6/22/cellphone-magic

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/6/10/p ... prediction

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/7/26/t ... ar-mystery

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/7/7/mu ... -selection

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/6/16/p ... ord-reveal

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/8/8/wi ... your-dream

Andy is a great thinker. There is nobody else like him in magic.

The magic he has shared is just a bonus since the blog is mostly filled with great writing, insightful theory and very funny jokes.

$260 to support his blog for a year and get the book?

I don't ask anyone to support my work by doing anything other than buying a book for a straight up price, and I guarantee the Tenyo book at $250 took me a lot more time than he's devoted to his blog. You get a bigger book with four DVDs and 3 physical tricks that costs less.

What's the choice here?

Well - it is simple maths.

A lot of people are excited about the Tenyo book. And are happy to support it.

Hell - I am probably the first person on that list!

Andy's blog has a smaller number of fans. He is cool with shutting down the blog (although the latest update suggests that is not what he is going to do).

But he has put together some numbers to see if there are enough fans who love his work so much (and who will be rewarded with really cool extras) to see if he can devote the same level of time in the future to running the blog at the same pace he has until now. Since until now he has been putting up daily (and often lengthy multimedia) posts.

Andy is outcome independent about the whole thing. He can easily make more money doing other stuff. And it is fun stuff as well since Andy works in the creative industries.

After taking 5 months off work to devote 20-30 hours a week to the blog he is at a crossroads. And he just wants to give his fans a chance to support the site. Unlike last time when he disappeared for ten years without warning.

His fans win out either way. Either with exclusive cool extras. Or exclusive cool extras which also frees up Andy to continue to spend more time on the blog in the future. The people supporting Andy (like me) just think it is good for magic in general to have a superb blog like this available to everyone.

I am nutty enough about the blog that I would happily send Andy a sizable donation. But with the extras - it basically feels like a simple magic purchase. And I am sure that is how the rest of his supporters feel. I would happily pay a lot of cash for more of his work in paper format.

One other thing. Andy is the best thinker in magic today. It is that simple. I have spent the past 20 years reading thousands of magic books and magazines. I may be a [censored] magician. But few people have read more about magic than me (Max Maven excluded).

So - I do not say it lightly when I say Andy is the best thinker in magic today. This blog is a lot more precious than the usual run of the mill blog.

I am super excited about your Tenyo book, Richard. In fact - if you dig through the Magic Cafe you will see I was one of the first people to pray that a Tenyo book would one day be written. For instance you will struggle to find a bigger Lubor Fiedler fan than me. And Lubor's best work mostly came out through Tenyo.

I really couldn't be more excited about your book, Richard.

But - I am just as excited about Andy's future book since his thinking is so different to anything else in magic.

As such - supporting his site is just a side benefit (for me) of getting the book. And any other extras he offers.

Andy is cool either way with the future of the blog. Since his supporters will be covered either way. It is just a case of seeing whether there is enough demand for the blog for Andy to give it the same attention in future as he has over the past 5 months.

There is no need to make it into a pissing contest between your work and his.

Whoops - I forgot to mention this routine in the list I gave before! Annoying cos it is definitely one of Andy's best.

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/6/25/p ... less-ahead

There is too much bad language on that blog and I do not approve.

Pot and kettle.

AJM wrote:Pot and kettle.

I NEVER use profanity! It is ugly particularly in print and exhibits a lower class mentality. I do not find it acceptable and it taints the content for those readers of a mere respectable disposition. Again, I do not approve and neither should anyone of good breeding.

What about trolling, that's worse in my book?

AJM wrote:What about trolling, that's worse in my book?

I agree with your sentiment, but you must have missed the part where at least three people on this thread have defended the act of trolling a message board for sport.

AJM wrote:What about trolling, that's worse in my book?

It appears that we are experiencing comments from the Scottish lower classes. May I remind you that you said "Pot, Kettle, Black" and anyone who is not intellectually deprived would assume you were accusing me of profanity. I challenge you to find one swear word from me on the internet.

Furthermore one man's trolling is another man's ironic genius. I rather think the latter view is far more perceptive than the former.

I think a small comparison will emphasize this point sufficiently even to rude and incompetent people from Scotland. It is no wonder they lost to the English at the battle of Culloden.

If the amount of knowledge and wisdom you have contributed to this site over the years were to be compared to the amount of knowledge and wisdom I have contributed I rather think mine at a conservative estimate would be approximately one thousand times as much as yours. If that is "trolling" so be it.

And at least there was no bad language.

I await one single pearl of wisdom from you sir.

Well, Joe, clearly you’re a fan and good luck with that. What I’ve seen is not particularly thrilling and is not worth the money. I’m sure (hope) you’ll allow me that. However:

“One other thing. Andy is the best thinker in magic today. It is that simple”.
Hmm.

As to language, well if I have a (very) mad moment and try a bit of DIY, I’m likely to hit my thumb with a hammer. If so, I’ll excuse myself an expletive or two. Otherwise, I’ll restrain myself. Mostly I think it’s lazy and unimaginative. But that’s just me, ever and always the barbarian. Greater beings have warbled otherwise and will doubtless continue to do so.

“Don’t swear boy, it’ shows a lack of vocabulary”. Alan Bennett. Although he should talk.

"The best thinker in magic today" charging $260 for a book? I can think of half a dozen people to whom that statement might be applied, Juan Tamariz being the major one. I'm afraid Andy isn't even on the list, although his material is clever.

AJM wrote:I await one single pearl of wisdom from you sir.

Alas my boy, education requires input from two sources. One is that you have to have a good teacher and the other is that you have to have a good student. I of course am a superb teacher which means we only have to have another decent source to complete the equation. Alas I am afraid you are an awful student and therefore there is no hope for you.

Since you are deficient in your learning ability then naturally giving you my great wisdom is pointless because it will fall on deaf ears.

Ah, such unbridled wit.

I must make sure to hold myself together as I fear my sides will split.

Performer, you have contributed so much to this Forum on so many levels (very witty, entertaining and insightful commentary, wisdom as to presentation born of experience, a generous willingness to share your knowledge, responsiveness to my comments and observations, and those of other members, etc.). Thank you!

Andy's blog is terrific. I read it every day and enjoy it immensely. But $260.00 is too high a price to pay for one book and whatever extras he's offering. I pay less than that per year for subscriptions to Genii, MAGIC, The Linking Ring and MUM..

So, as a gesture of my thanks and support for his insightful, funny, profane, wildly creative efforts, I gave him a free copy of Framework. I didn't even request a copy of his book. That feels like a reasonable "payment" for his material.

AJM wrote:Ah, such unbridled wit.

I must make sure to hold myself together as I fear my sides will split.

I hope they do.

Oh, and thank you Alfred.

The Jerx is hands down the best new magic content on the web. Andy's thinking and presentations are leaps ahead.

And the blog is as funny as f@@@.

So, PapaG, are you going to give him $260?

That is a very expensive book. How many pages are there? And for that price I would expect it to be very well produced, possibly with a gold plated cover. And are there good contact details of the author such as phone numbers and suchlike in case of delivery problems?

performer wrote:That is a very expensive book.

I think the named sum is a suggestion on how much to donate if one want to see the blog updated daily ($5 a week), and the book is just a bonus for those who donate for a whole year ahead.
http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/10/10/ ... 1-the-book

Ah! So they are paying for the blog rather than the book. The book is thrown in free as a present. It sounds much better that way!

Joe Mckay wrote:Andy has been running a small pledge drive this week (it ends tonight).

Anyway - it is a shame how many people are unaware of this great blog. So I just want to link to some amazing magic that Andy has shared on the blog:

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/9/28/cryptophasia

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/6/22/cellphone-magic

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/6/10/p ... prediction

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/7/26/t ... ar-mystery

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/7/7/mu ... -selection

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/6/16/p ... ord-reveal

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/8/8/wi ... your-dream

Andy is a great thinker. There is nobody else like him in magic.

The magic he has shared is just a bonus since the blog is mostly filled with reat writing, insightful theory and very funny jokes.

I agree, Andy is a creative genius and one of the best thinkers in magic out there. I have no issues supporting him. I have sent in my money

Andy is focused on the overall effect of a magic trick rather than just the trick itself.

This is something most magicians ignore. The tricks are in a bubble where the magician is making it clear that these are just tricks and the presentations are only there so he has something to say during the performance.

Compare that to how Andy frames a gambling demo:

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/6/11/p ... ces-3-ways

Now I don't think anyone reading this is actually going to go and hire a yellow Lamborghini for the sake of a card trick. But it is still good example (if an extreme one) of the wider context that Andy is trying to build into his magic.

And I think there is an important lesson in that. Andy is trying to build something much bigger than the usual magic trick. But instead of going down the bizarre magick road of pomposity and solemnity - he is pushing for something funny and surreal.

For those who want to see Andy's manifesto on magic - check out this post:

http://www.thejerx.com/blog/2015/7/10/a ... tric-magic

Andy is showing a fun side to magic that has opened new doors for me. And if he wasn't so damn funny - more people would take his ideas seriously.

Richard Kaufman wrote:$260 to support his blog for a year and get the book?

Richard, if you said tomorrow truthfully that you couldn't continue the Genii forums or the publication of Genii without a donation of $6/ week from a percentage of your audience, I'd contribute. You've already proven your worth to me--that would be my thank you . I feel the same way about Andy's stuff.

From each according to his ability, to each according to his need, as they say on NCIS.

Oh, don't give him ideas!

I do feel we should expect to pay for content that people have spent time creating.

I occasionally read The Jerx but am not as big a fan of Andy's as others are here so would be unwilling to subscribe at the current rate suggested. If that means the site goes or is blocked to non-members then so be it.

As far as the Genii Forum is concerned, based on current content, I probably would be unwilling to pay a fee for that either.

I've never been to The Cafe so unable to comment on that.

Andrew

Paying for internet content seems to be an unpopular idea for most people. We want everything to be free. I believe the Cafe remains extant due to the numerous banner ads strewn throughout countless and often redundant forums. There are also frequent broadcast "messages" that are actually paid advertisements. Genii has a magazine subscriber base and also Kaufman & Co. to help maintain the costs of running a message board, along with a few banner ads. Two different ways of doing business.

I don't see anything wrong with supporting web content that one enjoys or from which he benefits, but I doubt the support would be overwhelming no matter what the subject is.

It is an interesting topic. This is what I wrote on the Conjure Nation forum:

I am on board with this. It would be weird not to since I am such a huge fan of Andy's work.

I think the internet is heading towards an interesting crossroads. I have been online since around 1999 and for the first 10-15 years the culture of the internet was pretty much one of gorging yourself on free stuff. I was never really into pirating but I use YouTube a lot. And I consider a lot of the stuff on there to be a form of piracy.

However - I think things are changing now. Industries like music and newspapers have been shattered by the internet. And the rise in quality TV programming is now driven by companies like Netflix who charge monthly subscription fees. As such - I think people are starting to realise that if you want to support quality original content it has to be done on a basis that is economically sustainable.

As such - I think Andy has timed his sales pitch well. The internet isn't just about cool free stuff anymore. It is also about finding a way to fund projects (as we see with Kickstarter) that would never otherwise come into existence.

A lot of people are prepared to pay a little to support quality TV on Netflix. And I hope a few people (in magic) will be prepared to pay a bit more to support a quality magic product that would otherwise not exist. It is this aspect of the internet that I think will be most exciting in the future. When it becomes a place for fellow fanatics to help bring to life quality projects that would otherwise never exist. A bit like a band putting their first album out for free and then asking fans to support the costs of a follow-up album.

I am happy to pay a premium for quality that cannot be found elsewhere. And I honestly think that Andy's is without parallel in today's magic community. With something like a blog - the overheads are pretty low. So - this should mean the funding can go directly to support the producer. And not simply be eaten up by overheads. It would be great if the internet can evolve in a way that will help bring supporters together and as a way of cutting out extraneous overheads as well.

I have been trying to like this site but as yet have not quite managed it. As already stated the disgusting profanity and references to sexual matters put me off more than a trifle but I did try to put that aside to see what the actual content consisted of.

We have opinions about magic and tricks. I haven't got to the tricks yet so perhaps there may possibly be some redemption in that department. I have looked at the opinions though. I just shrugged my shoulders at them. They are just opinions and I couldn't feel any particular enthusiasm for them and I don't think I necessarily agree with them either. The trouble with magicians is that they think their opinions are important and of course they aren't. Except mine of course.

This stuff seems to be enthusiastic venting of an amateur magician. Now, I have nothing whatsoever against amateur magicians and I certainly don't look down on them as many professionals do. After all some of them have made fantastic contributions to magic.
However, the opinions of a professional who works in the real world does have a certain something that amateurs don't possess. Not always of course. I have seen pretty bad ideas and opinions from pros on occasion.

So that leaves the tricks. Perhaps this is where the statements made about the gentleman being a "great thinker" stem from. I suppose I had better check them out. Perhaps this may be the wheat rather than the chaff.

As for the post above Ronald's, that is exactly what https://www.patreon.com is doing, very successfully for the people using it

One example, Daily Tech News Show, fairly niche.

4974 people are giving 16k a month to him for daily podcasts mon-fri that are 30 minutes long.

He's asking for a buck a month. It's hard to say no.

Putting content behind a pay wall and charging anything other than a tiny amount (which in our field means making a tiny amount of money since the group is so small).

It never occurred to me to put the Forum behind a pay wall.

I don't think you can compare an open forum with a site which comprises one person's ideas and thinking (produced at a rate of knots...).

Not that I am not a fan of the Genii forum.

PapaG wrote: Not that I am not a fan of the Genii forum.

What a boorish thing to say here.

Well done you.

I think PapaG used the double negative accidentally, making his statement, "I am a fan of the Genii Forum." Unless he meant otherwise, which he's free to tell us.

Richard Kaufman wrote:I think PapaG used the double negative accidentally, making his statement, "I am a fan of the Genii Forum." Unless he meant otherwise, which he's free to tell us.

I meant the double negative - I am a fan of the Genii forum. I did logic as part of my degree years ago but you've got me thinking what the hell did that mean for a moment...

I misinterpreted his statement, and I apologize to PapaG. The Forum is usually a pretty good place.