New evil on the block

Discuss general aspects of Genii.
000
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New evil on the block

Postby 000 » August 17th, 2008, 8:46 am

Today I read about www.mymagazine.com which apparently encourages users to scan and load copies of mainstream magazines.
Outright copyright theft, but based offshore so not easily policed. Could be very hurtful to publishers I would imagine.

Silly Walter
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Silly Walter » August 17th, 2008, 8:59 am

I can't wait until this site gets going. Free magazines are awesome.
Silly Walter The Polar Bear

000
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby 000 » August 17th, 2008, 12:01 pm

Not sure if the Chief Genii shares your sentiment.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 17th, 2008, 4:06 pm

That's right, I don't share your stupid sentiment, Walter. You're an [censored]: [censored] like you will be the cause magazines like those in our field will eventually be forced to cease publication.

Those putzes who run that site don't give a [censored] about the personal, artistic, or business ramifications of what they're doing--including helping to put out of business the very magazines which form their content.
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Ian Kendall
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Ian Kendall » August 17th, 2008, 4:16 pm

I sense a wee bit of sarcasm, or at least cynicism, from Walter.

Take care, Ian

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Bob Cunningham
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Bob Cunningham » August 17th, 2008, 4:22 pm

Walter, I'm curious - why would you think that stealing magazines is "awesome"?

Do you work for free? If you do, please come to Dallas - I have lots of work that could use our attention.

If you do not work for free then why would you expect those who create magazines to work for free?

If I could steal your wallet and avoid prosecution would that be OK with you?

If it is wrong for me to steal from you then why is it OK for you to steal from those who create magazines?

I am pretty sure that you are a young man. Can I offer some since advice from a somewhat older man. As you get older you will realize that you are nothing more than the sum of your choices in life.

If you choose to be kind enough times you become a kind man. If you choose to be a thief enough times then you become a thief.

In the long run, you will be happier (and healthier)if you choose to be kind, honest and giving - as opposed to mean, lying and greedy.

I hope you have a life full of good choices :-)

/Bob

PapaG
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby PapaG » August 17th, 2008, 4:37 pm

He was being sarcastic.

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Marco Pusterla
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Marco Pusterla » August 17th, 2008, 5:09 pm

On checking the site suggested by "000", I couldn't find anything about scanning and sharing magazines... To me, it seems a domain's placeholder, providing search engines links to magazines and raising some cash to the site owner (one Eric Woodward, of Statewood Properties Ltd., Canada) who has a number of sites that provide ad-links to other sites...

No need to get all warmed up, yet, methinks...
Marco Pusterla - http://www.mpmagic.com

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bagelsandlox
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby bagelsandlox » August 17th, 2008, 5:20 pm

Silly Walter is forward thinking and sees the future, so he's attacked. Sad.

Lawyers do Pro Bono work, so Magazine Publishers should give out freebies as well.

We all love free things. Magazine Publishers get free product to review. They should turn it down and pay for it like everyone else if freebies bother them.

Terry
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Terry » August 17th, 2008, 5:31 pm

bagelsandlox wrote:We all love free things. Magazine Publishers get free product to review. They should turn it down and pay for it like everyone else if freebies bother them.


Producers of tricks/books/videos send them in to be reviewed for the free publicity it offers. If one can get a Mike Close or Jamy Swiss to say a product is first class, it might also result in more sales than a simple flat ad would.

Magazine publishers are feeling the heat of decreased sales just like mass produced newspapers are. Once the publications are gone, they are sometimes gone for good.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 17th, 2008, 6:10 pm

If Walter was being scarcastic, then I profoundly apologize.
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Green Skittle
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Green Skittle » August 17th, 2008, 6:25 pm

The website looks like a domain placeholder to me, unless it's down or is one of those covers for a piracy website. 000 where did you read about it?

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David Nethery
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby David Nethery » August 17th, 2008, 8:04 pm

000 wrote:Today I read about www.mymagazine.com which apparently encourages users to scan and load copies of mainstream magazines.
Outright copyright theft, but based offshore so not easily policed. Could be very hurtful to publishers I would imagine.



This is horrible news . As if there are not enough things stacked against small press publications like Genii. Don't these idiots know that eventually what results from this sort of thing is the cessation of all original content ? So after they've made everything "free" and there's no more motivation to put in the hard work to produce original content ... what then ? We just sit around and watch know-nothings blather on their "tutorials" posted on their YouTube channels ?

Last year in his column in Genii Jon Racherbaumer mentioned the book "The Cult of the Amateur :
How Blogs, MySpace, YouTube, and the Rest of Today's User-Created Media are destroying our Economy , our Culture, and our Values"
which I have finally picked up and began to read this weekend.

It certainly is destroying our magic economy, culture , and values. Want to get just a taste and be totally depressed ? Go on YouTube and type in "Magic Tutorials" . The lunatics are running the asylum. Every idiot with a thumb tip and who thinks they know how to do a double-lift is posting their wisdom in the form of "tutorials" on YouTube. The blind leading the blind. And the tags for these videos all include "Criss Angel" and "David Blaine" . (I'm supposed to be impressed? Whatever. I think some of these people's idea of magic history begins in 1997 with the first broadcast of "Street Magic" .)

And now the same mentality wants to destroy the few remaining voices of sanity like Genii magazine ? [censored] indeed. (and that's being nice)

Jonathan Townsend
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Jonathan Townsend » August 17th, 2008, 8:11 pm

Yes, the link goes nowhere - but the typing continues...

Here's the link in question - and from there it's up to you.

http://mashable.com/2008/07/19/mygazines/ for the article

and the abyss can be found here: http://www.mygazines.com/
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Jim Maloney
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Jim Maloney » August 17th, 2008, 9:12 pm

000 wrote:Today I read about www.mymagazine.com which apparently encourages users to scan and load copies of mainstream magazines.
Outright copyright theft, but based offshore so not easily policed. Could be very hurtful to publishers I would imagine.


Are you referring to MyGazines.com, perhaps? If so, while they do make it clear that it's a place to upload and share magazines, I don't see anywhere that they indicate that users should share content illegally. In fact, it seems fairly clear that their intended uploaders are the original content owners, as seen in this snippet from their website:

Why should I upload my publication to mygazines.com?

...
  • Increase your distribution and advertising revenue by exposing your publication to more eyes
  • Keep control of your publication: Mygazines will not allow for downloading or printing of your publication. Your original source file is never accessible.


In addition, their terms of use explicitly forbids uploading illegal content:

By way of example, and not as a limitation, you agree not to use the Services:

...

2. to post or transmit, or cause to be posted or transmitted, any Content that is infringing, libelous, defamatory, obscene, pornographic, abusive, offensive, profane, or otherwise violates any law or right of any third party;
3. for any illegal or unauthorized purpose. If you are an international user, you agree to comply with all local laws regarding online conduct and acceptable content;

...

Mygazines may remove any Content and Mygazines accounts at any time for any reason (including, but not limited to, upon receipt of claims or allegations from third parties or authorities relating to such Content), or for no reason at all. To report Terms of Use abuse, please email: abuse@mygazines.com

You are solely responsible for your interactions with other users of the Site. Mygazines reserves the right, but has no obligation, to monitor disputes between you and other users.


It's basically a YouTube for magazines...copyrighted content will probably stay until someone complains about it.

-Jim
Books and Magazines for sale -- more than 200 items (Last updated January 10th, 2014. Link goes to public Google Doc.)

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Marco Pusterla
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Marco Pusterla » August 18th, 2008, 3:30 am

Jim Maloney wrote:Are you referring to MyGazines.com, perhaps?


Well, this makes sense, but it isn't the same link posted at the top of the thread...
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Jim Maloney
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Jim Maloney » August 18th, 2008, 9:18 am

I know it's not the same link, but considering the original link doesn't go anywhere, I thought the one I provided might the the link actually intended.

-Jim
Books and Magazines for sale -- more than 200 items (Last updated January 10th, 2014. Link goes to public Google Doc.)

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Pete Biro
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Pete Biro » August 18th, 2008, 2:42 pm

There is no free lunch. If a magazine, or any business fails, people lose jobs, subscribers lose a resource... etc. etc. etc.
Stay tooned.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 18th, 2008, 5:26 pm

Just returned from Toronto and I see Silly Walter has not returned and made his intention clear.
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Jonathan Townsend
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Jonathan Townsend » August 18th, 2008, 6:26 pm

As Silly as Walter might be - I sincerely doubt he wishes ill to those who publish or write for a living.
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bagelsandlox
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby bagelsandlox » August 19th, 2008, 11:26 pm

Silly Walter meant no ill will. Like most Americans, he likes free stuff.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 20th, 2008, 12:10 pm

I think Silly Walter can speak for himself here.
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David Thomas
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby David Thomas » August 20th, 2008, 12:53 pm

Once I was searching for where to buy the dai vernon book of magic and I came across this site that supports free downloading of movies, music, software, etc, and I found that the Dai Vernon Book of magic pdf. file was available there for free download. That's over 200 pages of Vernon and his friends work and Lewis Ganson's work that is being given away for free. I was going to provide a specific site, but if you google "dai vernon book of magic torrent" you will see many many sites that are allowing people to download it. What would Vernon say to this?

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 20th, 2008, 1:01 pm

It's hard to know what Vernon would have said because he really didn't care about putting any of his material in print--all of that was done because he was persuaded by others to do it. He really didn't like to work too hard!

It might have been incomprehensible to him that the internet is what it is, and that the entire world is changing because of it. Of course, he saw the entire world change many times over in his life, so maybe he would've just shrugged and taken it in stride like everything else.

However, there's no question about how anyone who holds copyrights feels, and there's no question about how anyone who has paid for books, magazines, movies, music, and so on should feel: it's illegal, and immoral, and it's crushing the business model by which people have produced these things for almost 100 years.

And all the cheap little thieves who are downloading property for free are going to suddenly scratch their heads one day when there is no more property to download because all the businesses that put it out have gone bankrupt because the dumb [censored] think they don't have to pay for anything.
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Terrence
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Terrence » August 20th, 2008, 5:07 pm

Don't give up Richard.

What are these Eloi protypes going to do when we run low on power and capacity, and the Internet falls apart?

Save Our Print

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David Thomas
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby David Thomas » August 20th, 2008, 7:15 pm

I think all of everyone's comments (especially richard's) have had silly walter heading for the hills! He probably wasn't being sarcastic.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 20th, 2008, 8:00 pm

I think Silly Walter can take it. He seemed able to dish it out! :)
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Rick Schulz » August 21st, 2008, 5:25 pm

"There ain't so such thing as a free lunch!" When businesses "give away freebies", the cost of those goods and services are added into their overhead costs, which become part of the cost of the items that they sell. This also true for taxes. Don't kid yourself, the consumer ultimately pays for the so-called freebies and corporate taxes. Sure, now again a business may give their customers a "freebie" and eat the cost. But over time, they will either add such items into their overhead costs or go out of business.

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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 21st, 2008, 8:53 pm

We don't do that at Genii. The people who bring you the premium items pay for them, whether they're DVDs, or tricks, or pop-up wands, or whatever. For our readers, they truly are free.
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Rick Schulz » August 22nd, 2008, 4:37 pm

Richard,

My apologies; my comments were not directed to you and your fine organization. They were in response to the earlier comment (I fumbled when pressing the keys and clicking the icons):

bagelsandlox wrote:Silly Walter is forward thinking and sees the future, so he's attacked. Sad.

Lawyers do Pro Bono work, so Magazine Publishers should give out freebies as well.

We all love free things. Magazine Publishers get free product to review. They should turn it down and pay for it like everyone else if freebies bother them.



That quote did not make into my original reply. Sorry for the confusion.

bagelsandlox
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby bagelsandlox » August 25th, 2008, 12:26 am

When Richard says "and all the cheap little thieves who are downloading property for free are going to suddenly scratch their heads one day when there is no more property to download...."

He's angry over the situation, but the scenario isn't realistic. When videos showed up and people were copying them, the same type of 'threat' Richard used was said and nothing changed, except now they do it with DVD's;-)

People that take without paying do not care about the threat of 'one day it will be gone if they don't stop'. Something new will come along.

I guess Richard has to say something, but he knows nothing will change.

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mrgoat
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby mrgoat » August 25th, 2008, 10:03 am

In fact, when the printing press was invented, it was viewed as a piracy machine. So it goes back that long. People still seem to be managing to produce content.

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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Rick Schulz » August 25th, 2008, 11:46 am

bagelsandlox wrote:When Richard says "and all the cheap little thieves who are downloading property for free are going to suddenly scratch their heads one day when there is no more property to download...."

He's angry over the situation, but the scenario isn't realistic. When videos showed up and people were copying them, the same type of 'threat' Richard used was said and nothing changed, except now they do it with DVD's;-)

People that take without paying do not care about the threat of 'one day it will be gone if they don't stop'. Something new will come along.

I guess Richard has to say something, but he knows nothing will change.


Other crimes, such as murder, rape, arson, etc, have been around for longer than recorded history and people have found new and ingenious methods of committing such crimes. It doesn't make it right. People who steal other people's work are, at best, scum. Period.

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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Jonathan Townsend » August 25th, 2008, 12:26 pm

This "right to copy" is at the root of one of our larger problems in conjuring. No dispute over the "unauthorized duplication of text/media" here. However, while we fuss over some aspect of keeping magic data protected - elsewhere on this very BBS we have folks arguing that the widespread dissemination is integral and necessary for our craft to evolve.

The forces are as follows:

Copyright of fixed expressions of work
Secrecy
Respect for a living artists work not to be copied without permission
Right to sell any work by any person not infringing upon works protected by patent

Over time a strategy evolved to get through most of that confusion. Here's the strategy for "outing" a work into common knowledge -

get a video or published source
video an explanation by a volunteer and give to third party to upload - (or have them show item around at conventions)
have fourth party write up discussion of item and seek publication online or magazine

done deal - whatever the item is - it's now open season for 'variations'

Okay - now what do you suggest?
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Silly Walter
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Silly Walter » August 26th, 2008, 6:05 pm

Sorry for the late response, I was reading free magazines. Now that I am finished I will confirm that I was being 100% sarcastic and I figured since 99% of my posts reflect the same kind of sarcasm that it is pretty obvious that I was joking.

Richard Kaufman - Chief Genii. I do accept your apology and I think deep down you knew I was joking.
Silly Walter The Polar Bear

Silly Walter
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Silly Walter » August 26th, 2008, 6:15 pm

Bob Cunningham wrote:Walter, I'm curious - why would you think that stealing magazines is "awesome"?


Because I don't have to pay for them. I mean, duhhhh.

Bob Cunningham wrote:Do you work for free? If you do, please come to Dallas - I have lots of work that could use our attention.


I would love to but unfortunately I have been to Dallas. If the state of Texas needed an enema, they would stick it in Dallas, TX.

Bob Cunningham wrote:If you do not work for free then why would you expect those who create magazines to work for free?


By the time I read them, the news is old anyway. The doctors and dentists don't mind when I read back issues of Highlights, so if I read what happened in Zimbabwe back in July for free, it should be cool since it happened a while ago.

Bob Cunningham wrote:If I could steal your wallet and avoid prosecution would that be OK with you?


I think you would be very disappointed. All you would find is my IBM membership card, a receipt from a restaurant I ate at 7 weeks ago and a condom that is still in the wrapper just in case one of my tiny pasteboard illusions wows the other sex.

Bob Cunningham wrote:If it is wrong for me to steal from you then why is it OK for you to steal from those who create magazines?


If they kept the free magazines in their wallet I would get in trouble for taking it, but these magazines are online. Someone went to all of that trouble to put them on line so the least I can do is read them.

Bob Cunningham wrote:I am pretty sure that you are a young man. Can I offer some since advice from a somewhat older man. As you get older you will realize that you are nothing more than the sum of your choices in life.

If you choose to be kind enough times you become a kind man. If you choose to be a thief enough times then you become a thief.

In the long run, you will be happier (and healthier)if you choose to be kind, honest and giving - as opposed to mean, lying and greedy.

I hope you have a life full of good choices :-)

/Bob


Bob, I hope you do realize from this post that I was being sarcastic. Thanks for playing. As a consolation prize, I can offer you some free magazines. Do you prefer Newsweek, Sports Illustrated or Hustler?
Silly Walter The Polar Bear

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Bob Cunningham
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Re: New evil on the block

Postby Bob Cunningham » August 26th, 2008, 8:11 pm

Hi Walter,

I apologize for not recognizing your humor - thanks for clarifying.

As to non-magic magazines, I'm a geek so how about network world ;-)

/Bob


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