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airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 1:13 am
by smokemist
I have contemplated the idea of travelling with a fism flash, flash paper, & some other strange looking things internationally. Would it be a problem to check the bagagge with these items onto your flights, as long as it wasn't carry on?
What process would you use?

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 8:04 am
by Richard Kaufman
You should carry FISM FLash so you can demonstrate that it's not an explosive if asked.
It's illegal to carry any highly flammable items on a plane, and I think that would probably include flash paper. I can envision a scenario in which Flash Paper could be used for evil purposes, so it definitely should be banned!
I certainly wouldn't carry it.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 8:17 am
by John LeBlanc
Originally posted by Richard Kaufman:
I certainly wouldn't carry it.
Unless your goal is to get on the Drudge Report or The Smoking Gun.

John
http://www.escamoteurettes.com/blog/

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 8:23 am
by Jonathan Townsend
Originally posted by steveowens:
...travelling with a fism flash, flash paper, & some other strange looking things internationally. Would it be a problem to check the bagagge with these items onto your flights, as long as it wasn't carry on?
What process would you use?
Wonderful things, and easily packed except for the explosives, (tri nitro cellulose is an explosive) so perhaps that could be shipped separately.

The mental image of someone trying to walk onto plane all loaded up for performance is amusing in a grotesque sort of way that probably involves stern faced staff, the news media and rubber gloves.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 8:59 am
by John LeBlanc
Originally posted by Jonathan Townsend:
and rubber gloves.
Wow. I could do without that mental image.

You know, there's always shipping stuff ahead of the performance.

John
http://www.escamoteurettes.com/blog/

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 9:02 am
by rage
im not saying whether or not you should or shouldnt bring flash paper, but not to long ago, a very big named magician lectured and talked about how he brings this stuff all the time. he said he brings tons of it, and no one has ever said anything to him.

again, im not saying it's okay or that you should bring this stuff, im just saying that it's possible.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 10:08 am
by John LeBlanc
Originally posted by rage1:
again, im not saying it's okay or that you should bring this stuff, im just saying that it's possible.
Just about anything is possible. What's possible isn't the issue. It's what happens when you are found with flash paper on your person or in your baggage that becomes the issue. Just driving 120 MPH in a 25 MPH zone isn't what gets you into trouble; it's been clocked doing 120 MPH in a 25 MPH zone that could cause some legal discomfort.

As for trying to bring flash paper (or flash cotton, or flash string) onto a plane? You do realize the initial decision on whether or not to act on something like this is at the screener's discretion, right? Do you think that, here in the year 2006, a screener would rather err on the side of being over cautious? I do. And frankly I hope they do.

John
http://www.escamoteurettes.com/blog/

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 1:26 pm
by Herman Koster
Here in Holland a while back, someone's suitcase and clothing was stolen. Also his Fismflash that he carried in a shoe to protect the bulb. The shoe and flash were later found and the area was sealed because they thought it was a bomb. The magician got a lot of publicity out of it. He called the police and told them it was his shoe and that he was robbed the day before.
So, I don't think it's wise to carry it on an airplane with you.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 2:51 pm
by Pete Biro
I'm not sure of the exact URL, but the ATA has a website with all the information on what you can or cannot bring and how to pack, etc.

Do a google search for the URL

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 3:07 pm
by Curtis Kam
Careful, I believe there are also regulations on how you can and can't ship flash paper. The local magic store recieves it packed wet.

Why not just contact a local magic supplier and have it ready for you when you arrive?

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 3:43 pm
by Guest
Here's the TSA website on what you can't carry on your person , and what you can't put in checked luggage,

There are a number of items that are prohibited in checked baggage, such as lighters, matches, explosive material and flammable items.
So the answer is:Flash paper, no way. Ship it ground.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 3:48 pm
by Terrence
The lecturer in question (the one I was at anyway) was talking specifically about transporting flash cotton. (!!!)

It's a big risk guys - remember Valujet?

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 1st, 2006, 4:42 pm
by rage
ah yes, good memory terrence. it was cotton. ;)

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 2nd, 2006, 3:12 am
by Eric Rose
Don't try to screw with the TSA - they have access to federal prosecutors, prisons and weapons. Magic isn't worth that.

You mentioned traveling internationally. Remember that when you are traveling in another country you are subject to their laws. Don't assume that you won't go to jail just because you are a visitor.

Ever considered moving away from the flash effects to maybe cards or coins?

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 2nd, 2006, 10:49 am
by Guest
Yup...the TSA is there and does look into bags and cartons behind the scenes. In my 'drinking days' I hand carried a brick of fire crackers on a flight from Jacksonville to San Francisco via Atlanta. I'm still happy I didn't get caught.
Steve V

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 2nd, 2006, 12:05 pm
by Pete Biro
I wasn't even drinking and I brought back a SUITCASE full of fireworks from South Carolina to Los Angeles in the good old days... :rolleyes:

I did sweat the whold flight though... :eek:

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 2nd, 2006, 12:53 pm
by Herman Koster
Dear Steve and Pete,
this has nothing to do with the subject, so if this message gets erased I understand. But talking about fireworks, in Holland we have very strict rules about storage and selling. I remember that in the US I saw small wooden shacks near gasoline stations selling fireworks. (actually I only saw signs that said Fireworks) Isn't this a dangerous place to sell that.
I'm not sure if I was in Vegas or in Florida at the time.
Just always been curious about this.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 2nd, 2006, 3:32 pm
by Pete Biro
Lots of places, especially in the South, sell fireworks and they are often in what we call UNINCORPORATED areas...ie: outside of the actual city boundaries.

They are illegal in most states.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 2nd, 2006, 3:56 pm
by John LeBlanc
Originally posted by Pete Biro:
Lots of places, especially in the South, sell fireworks and they are often in what we call UNINCORPORATED areas...ie: outside of the actual city boundaries.
These areas are typically identified by having two or fewer McDonalds restaurants.

John
http://www.escamoteurettes.com/blog/

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 2nd, 2006, 4:10 pm
by Guest
Mine also came from South Carolina. Not only did I sneak 'em on the plane (really doesn't count as I was too drunk to realize I had them) I also smuggled them onto a Navy ship on one of the most secure bases in the world. In answer to our Dutch friend, the danger isn't so much about where they are sold but where they are fired off.
Steve V

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 2nd, 2006, 10:17 pm
by Spellbinder
You can render flashpaper safe for carrying and shipping by enclosing it in a ziplock bag and soaking it down with water,then letting the water drain off until you just have damp flashpaper. When you arrive at your destination, or receive the package you shipped to yourself, dry the flashpaper overnight and it is as good as new.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 3rd, 2006, 8:27 am
by John LeBlanc
Originally posted by Spellbinder:
You can render flashpaper safe for carrying and shipping by enclosing it in a ziplock bag and soaking it down with water,then letting the water drain off until you just have damp flashpaper. When you arrive at your destination, or receive the package you shipped to yourself, dry the flashpaper overnight and it is as good as new.
Scene at Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport:

Airport Screener: Sir, why do you have wet paper in a Ziplock bag?

Magician: Oh, I'm a magician. That's flash paper. I wet it so it won't...

Airport Screener: What's flash paper?

Magician: Oh, it's special paper magicians use to make flashes of fire. You know, fireballs. We light it and ...

Airport Screener (whispering into walkie talkie): CODE RED, GATE 103B. I REPEAT, CODE RED, GATE 103B.

(cue Jerry Jeff Walker music) "Up against the wall, redneck mother."

It'd be like "Midnight Express, 2006" -- wouldn't that be entertaining?

Maybe it's just me, maybe I'm just being silly, but I don't think I want to have to explain to anyone wearing a gun at an airport that the contents of my baggie is usually used to make fireballs and I'd like to carry it onto a plane, is that okay with you, sir?

John
Finding the next Siegfried and Roy
http://www.escamoteurettes.com/blog/

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 3rd, 2006, 9:06 am
by Pete Biro
NO NO you tell 'em it is wet wipes for your hemeroids! To KO that burning feeling.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 3rd, 2006, 11:29 am
by Michael Close
How tough is Pete Biro?

I'll tell you how tough he is:

He uses flash paper to soothe his hemorrhoids.

Man, that's tough.

Close

:)

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 3rd, 2006, 2:58 pm
by Pete Biro
And they burn with a blue flame! :cool:

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 3rd, 2006, 3:56 pm
by John LeBlanc

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 5th, 2006, 7:24 am
by Bryan Dreyfus
I have never flown anywhere where one side of the plane wasn't removed for skydivers so I'm way out of my element here.

I think I would call the airlines, explain what I was need ing to do and ask them for thier solution. It may be nothing more than a special procedure of secure drop off so they can keep a close eye on it.

After all a terrorist or smuggler would not be so open about their goodies.

Bryan

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 28th, 2006, 12:54 am
by Bill Palmer
The irony of some of this is that the prohibited items list is intepreted at will by the local inspectors. For example, on the way over to the Centenary, my wife brought along a pack of safety matches -- book matches. The inspectors in Houston let her go right through. On the way back, the inspectors in London confiscated the same book of matches. Why? It didn't SAY "safety matches" on the cover.

Ironically, you can send some of the prohibited items by air mail to your next performance. But you may not be able to send them by FedEx. FedEx has their own rules about what is and is not legal.

Re: airport security..

Posted: February 28th, 2006, 10:09 am
by Guest
Luckily one of the active members of this board is a Fedex hazardous goods specialist so he should be able to answer any questions about what they will or will not carry.
Steve V

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 7th, 2006, 6:25 am
by Guest
I have travelled internationally several year's (lately been to Turkey, Thailand, Germany, England, Holland, Norway, Denmark and some more countries) with dried out flash-paper in a Ziploc bag in my carry on luggage (just a few sheets). I have never had any problems (so far).
The main thing the airport security doesn't like is if you have more than two lighters in your carry on.
But naturally: Use your head. You dont want to sit at an airport for several hours just because you wanted to have a flash effect in your show

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 7th, 2006, 7:46 am
by Guest
Originally posted by Eric Rose:

Ever considered moving away from the flash effects to maybe cards or coins?
and you could change your knifes for a little stick with gems... and switch your sword to an animal balloon... oh and use a barbie for your finger chopper.... :p

Originally posted by Spellbinder:
You can render flashpaper safe for carrying and shipping by enclosing it in a ziplock bag and soaking it down with water,then letting the water drain off until you just have damp flashpaper. When you arrive at your destination, or receive the package you shipped to yourself, dry the flashpaper overnight and it is as good as new.
You could do that but you ARE breaking the law. Hazmat law. http://hazmat.dot.gov/

You have to have a Hazmat permit even if it's wet.

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 7th, 2006, 8:07 am
by Guest
1. Remember that a security person does not have a sense of humour.

2. It took about 10 minutes of persuasion at Buffalo en route for NY before I was allowed to carry on two lighters without their works.

3. My colour-change penknives were thrown away at the tiny local airport here at Norwich UK. That should not have been done I was told the following year when going to the USA, see next.

4. I was called from the departure lounge to a security room to explain why I had a jar of a pink substance which could have been explosives. In fact it was green mint jelly I was bringing over for emigrant Rachel Wild who was missing English food.

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 7th, 2006, 9:10 am
by Guest
How is "green mint jelly" a "pink substance"?

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 7th, 2006, 5:40 pm
by Larry Barnowsky
I got searched in Rome at Leonardo DaVinci Airport. They found a rope and a 3 inch ring in my carry on. The lady security person asked if was a trick rope. I said no it was a real rope. I think that was the wrong answer. I think their thinking was a real rope could be used to strangle the pilot with or something. Anyway a quick ring on rope move and I was cleared and they were smiling.

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 7th, 2006, 6:25 pm
by Pete Biro
I had the Japanese inspectors take out my Nine Bottle set and set them all out... then they examined each and every linking ring. I just kept my mouth shut and they put it all back and away I flew.

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 7th, 2006, 8:27 pm
by Richard Kaufman
It's illegal to bring cigarette lighters in your carry-on or checked baggage now, so that shouldn't even be an issue.

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 8th, 2006, 4:37 am
by Guest
The green jelly looked pink in the scanner, I was told.

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 8th, 2006, 6:18 am
by Guest
I'm not sure if this is the same person rage1 is speaking of, but at a lecture a few nights ago we were told that flash cotton does not get detected by X-rays and so forth. This was a huge star in magic, (who I won't name). Many airports now have this thing you step into and it shoots you with air blasts. It is to detect small traces of explosives. I can't imagine flash paper or cotton getting through that. The first time I saw this device was at McCarran International. Destination for a lot of magicians.

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 9th, 2006, 1:20 am
by Guest
May I suggest taking notice of combinations of otherwise innocent props!
I remember that a combination of a steel ring (for ring and rope) an a stacked set of two copper cups and a large steel ball looks rather strange on the scanner and will get you a lot of questions and unnecessary unpacking.

Re: airport security..

Posted: June 10th, 2006, 9:11 pm
by Guest
I routinely buy sets of cups when I go to various cities around the world. The Collectors Weekend in D.C. was what I call a "15 set trip." I ALWAYS carry the cups on board the flight. Imagine the look on the face of the fellow at the scanner when he sees all of these sets of cups. When that happens, I just say, "I see you have found my cups." They smile, and then pass it through.

I did get dinged once for a set of diagonal wire cutters that were in my carry on. I didn't know they were there. I told them to toss them.

The rule on penknives changed recently. For a while, ANY knife was prohibited in carry-on.

Oddly enough, I'm leery about carrying magnets. So when I go anywhere that I need my magnetic cigars or my chop cup balls, I mail them to my destination.

There is no rule against magnets in carry on or checked baggage, but I just don't want to buy a set of chop cup balls and have it taken away at the airport. And the thought of losing my John Rogers cigars -- too much!