Penguin cups vs. JES cups

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Richard Tremblay
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Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Richard Tremblay » December 10th, 2003, 10:01 am

I am thinking of purchasing a new set of cups.

The ones made by JESmagic (here is the link) have been recommanded by Jim Riser and they really look terrific. However, Penguin magic just released their own Penguin cups (here is the link) .

Does anybody can compare the two and give us a reviews of the Penguin cups?

Thank you beforehand.

Richard Tremblay

Frank Yuen
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Frank Yuen » December 10th, 2003, 10:39 am

I received an e-mail from Penguin Magic within the last week or two with some special holiday deals. One of them was a free set of cups if you ordered a certain amount of product (I think it was $250.00 worth). So, if you have stuff you want to get anyway, this would be a great way to try them out for free.

Frank Yuen

Jim Riser
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Jim Riser » December 10th, 2003, 3:51 pm

Richard;
I have not yet handled a set of the Penguin Cups - so I can not comment on them. I would be interested in comparing them to the JES cups for quality. Anyone have both sets?
Jim

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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Guest » December 10th, 2003, 4:46 pm

The "Penguin Cups" are actually from Magic Makers. They were advertising these in the November 2003 issue of Magic. The cups were on their web site, but they have taken it off.

From what I've heard, these cups are mass produced in China. I wouldn't count on the quality being as good as the JESmagic cups.

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Pete Biro
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Pete Biro » December 10th, 2003, 7:04 pm

When I saw the Magic Makers cups I was interested, but then they disappeared from their site and lo and behold they show up on the Penguin site.

I would guess they COULD BE just fine... but until I get my mitts on a set can't really tell you. At the price they must be made either in China or India, where the workers probably get fifteen cents a set.

I know, as does Jim Riser, how much it costs just to make cups and to give 'em away as Penguin is, you can't believe what they must have paid for them...

Of note, I was just at Joe Porper's shop and he has his cup sets not only in copper, brass and plated, but in WOOD.
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Robert Kane
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Robert Kane » December 10th, 2003, 10:15 pm

I recently handled the Magic Makers Cups and I think that they are nicely made and an excellent value.

With respect, they are not as beautifully handcrafted as the JES Squatty Cups, The Riser Cups, The Johnny Paul/Pete Biro Cups, Mark Burger's Cups, or many of the other fine cups available.

However, for the price, they are a really great set of cups, especially if you don't want to damage your $800 Paul Fox/Danny Dew-made Cups during regular performances.

I will be sure to add a set of these neat cups to my collection. If you are a cup freak and/or if you are a performer, you will want to do the same. :)

PS - By the way, Dennis Loomis recently showed me his set of Riser Traditional Cups and I felt that they were one of the finest cups that I ever had the pleasure to lay my eyes on. They felt, handled and looked wonderful. Thick and solid, yet nimble in the hands...Beautifully handcrafted. I want some!

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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Guest » December 10th, 2003, 10:41 pm

I own a set of Sisti cups(brass) and a set of JES Squatties(copper). I love them both, although the Squatties are a bit smaller, and heavier(I think).

I will never get rid of my JES cups. I love them to no end. I am interested in a set of these cups (made in China en masse or not), but will wait for them to be around a while.

I always thought I would use my brass set as leverage for some other purchase. And right when I was getting ready to clinch a deal, my wife reminded me that I had allocated these cups to my to my two daughters, respectively, when I slip off this mortal coil.

So, in reality, this post is no help at all. Sorry. Thanks for the link to those cups.

Guest

Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Guest » December 11th, 2003, 1:53 pm

What's the ideal weight? Any opinions?

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Pete Biro
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Pete Biro » December 11th, 2003, 3:34 pm

What's ideal? Different strokes for different folks.

You gonna bang 'em around on 'em on the street?

Or polite society shows?

Almost every weight and size you can imagine is available.

My guess, looking at the photos? Probably weight wise between the light Morrissy and Aluminum cups and the Paul Fox/JES cups.

Only a guess.
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Jim Riser
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Jim Riser » December 11th, 2003, 4:15 pm

Jackie;
I do not feel that weight is as important as balance and feel. You want it thick (heavy) enough to hold up to long use; but I do not feel there is any ideal weight for all cups. There may be an ideal weight for each style/size of a specific cup due to weight distribution within the design. It really gets down to how the performer will use the cup and how it feels in the hand. A cup set that feels good to one performer may not feel quite right to another performer. There are more important design considerations than weight alone.
Jim

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Brad Jeffers
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Brad Jeffers » December 12th, 2003, 9:47 am

Originally posted by Jackie H:
What's the ideal weight? Any opinions?
The ideal weight is such, so that when you place a cup which has just been loaded with a potato down upon the table and the potato slightly shifts its position beneath the cup, the cup will not go walking across the table top. To see this effect in action, get the video Dai Vernon's Secrets of Magic and watch as Vernon teaches his cups and balls routine using styrofoam coffee cups and potatos as final loads. That final potato not only walks about six inches across the table, but is in the process of taking a bow and tipping his hat to the audience before Vernon can slam the lid on him and bring the routine to a hurried conclution.

Jim Riser
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Jim Riser » December 13th, 2003, 7:06 pm

OK guys;
I got a chance to handle a set of the "Penguin Cups". I had hoped for a nice set of cups at a bargain price; but the "off shore spinners" have once again not quite delivered. Ahh, the problems of using slave labor and poor communication...I'll describe the good first.

Good: The thickness of the copper used is excellent for this size of cup. I would guess it is .043" or there abouts. My guess is the the real PF Cups were most likely spun from .032" copper. At first glance, they look nice. Polishing job is certainly acceptable.

Bad: The spinning of the mouth beads is very inconsistent. This will not bother many magicians, though. The big problem is that 2 of the 3 cups would not nest properly. The cups were not quite spun down to the spinning chuck - so the cups stack too tightly. This is so bad that they would not even stack with pressure. Then it was difficult to separate the cups. This is a critical fault. Most likely there are lots of these types of problem cups in the lot. With just a few correct words with the spinners, these could have been much better cups.

Conclusion: IMHO - If you could get a set that nests and has a decent mouth bead, you would have a very serviceable set of cups at a cheap price. This might be pretty iffy. They are no where near as nice a cup as the JES Cups and certainly no Paul Fox Cups.
Jim

Richard Tremblay
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Richard Tremblay » December 13th, 2003, 7:46 pm

Thank you very much everybody. With these informations, I think I will save some more money to buy the JES cups as I've always wanted a Paul Fox set of cup and it seems that the JES are the ones coming nearer.

Richard Tremblay

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Pete Biro
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Re: Penguin cups vs. JES cups

Postby Pete Biro » December 14th, 2003, 11:31 am

You could also ask the seller to "carefully check the cups for fit and quality... or don't send 'em."

Even the high-quality spinner I used made a few bad ones... they do slip through, but my final inspection means I put some in the display case and will not sell them.
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