ERDNASE

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Joe Mckay
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Joe Mckay » August 8th, 2018, 7:19 pm

Leo - check out the April & May (1971) issues of The Linking Ring.

PM me if you need copies of the magazines.

Bill Mullins
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Bill Mullins » August 15th, 2018, 11:58 pm

In Sept 1889, the Duke & Sons tobacco company released a set of 24 trade cards in association with their "Honest Long Cut" tobacco entitled "Tricks with Cards", each of which described a card trick.

Trick #1 was a Rising Card (from a glass). Erdnase included a Rising Card trick (from the hands).
Tricks #3 and 8 were Card Stabs (3 cards stabbed on a sword, single card stabbed on a wand). Erdnase included a Card Stab (Malini-style, single card stabbed on table).
Trick #4 was "The Row of Ten Cards" as written up in Erdnase, under a different title.
Trick #6 was where a performed slaps a deck held in a spectator's hands, leaving a singled (selected) card. Erdnase included this as a "Sleight for Terminating Tricks".
Trick #9 has the effect of a single phase of "3 Card Monte". Erdnase included "3 Card Monte".
Tricks #10 and 21 are based on the "Eight Kings" stack. Erdnase includes a discussion of the stack in "Tricks with a Prearranged Deck", and based a trick on it.
Trick #12 is a selected card at a selected number. Erdnase accomplishes a similar effect, with a different method, in "Power of Concentrated Thought."
Trick #17 is accomplished by use of the Glide, which Erdnase discusses and calls "The Slide".

It may be that Erdnase was a smoker, and was familiar with this set of trade cards.

Leonard Hevia
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Leonard Hevia » August 16th, 2018, 10:53 am

An interesting find Bill! This tobacco company must have paid somebody well versed in card magic to write up the tricks on those trading cards. Since most of those card tricks appear in The Expert, you have to wonder if it might have been the author.

Jonathan Townsend
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Jonathan Townsend » August 16th, 2018, 6:31 pm

https://thetraderspeaks.com/n138-tricks-with-cards/

Hey, thanks. Great find in terms of history. Does the explanation text scan as familiar?
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time

Bill Mullins
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Bill Mullins » August 17th, 2018, 3:48 am

Jonathan Townsend wrote: Great find in terms of history. Does the explanation text scan as familiar?


Not to me, it doesn't.

Edward Pungot
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Edward Pungot » August 17th, 2018, 5:20 am

Great find!!!
I've chewed a lot of gum and smoked plenty of cigarettes but only came up with comics and a smelly left hand.

Edward Pungot
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Edward Pungot » August 17th, 2018, 5:25 am

What's the method Bill?
Where how do you find this stuff .

Bill Mullins
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Bill Mullins » August 17th, 2018, 1:47 pm

I've only been "into" magic seriously for 20 years. I started collecting cards in the late 1970s, and have known about this particular set for a long time. I only just now took the trouble to compare them to Erdnase, though.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 17th, 2018, 3:06 pm

Bill, that's amazing.
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Joe Mckay
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Joe Mckay » August 17th, 2018, 5:30 pm

John Moehring had an interesting article about these tobacco cards in the June 2001 issue of MAGIC magazine. Check out page 52.

Joe Mckay
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Joe Mckay » August 17th, 2018, 5:37 pm

The article is in three parts. The second part is in the July 2001 issue of MAGIC. Check out page 54.

And the third part is in the August 2001 issue of MAGIC. Check out page 50.

There isn't really much information in the articles. It is mainly devoted to reproductions of the tobacco cards.

Leonard Hevia
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Leonard Hevia » August 18th, 2018, 9:16 am

The Erdnase/tobacco cards possible connection begs the question: Were the card tricks on those tobacco trading cards popular effects with card magicians in the late 19th century? Much like the packet trick craze of the 1970s.

If yes then it might account for the appearance of those effects in The Expert. The author surely didn't just randomly pick out those effects for inclusion in the book. It would also be neat to know the identity of the magician who was contracted by the tobacco company to write up those tricks.

Bill Mullins
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Bill Mullins » August 18th, 2018, 9:45 pm

Joe Mckay wrote:John Moehring had an interesting article about these tobacco cards in the June 2001 issue of MAGIC magazine. Check out page 52.


The article went on for the next two issues, as well. It featured Burton Sperber's set of the cards, who also wrote them up in an issue of his publication "A Real Miracle". Potter & Potter sold his set in 2014. It went for $3400 plus buyer's premium -- over $4000.

There are a couple of minor errors in the articles. The cards were released in Sept 1889, not 1887 (I found reference to their release at that time in an issue of Tobacco, a trade journal for tobacco producers and sellers). And "Honest Long Cut," the product in which the cards were inserted, was not a brand of cigarettes. It was a loose-cut tobacco, suitable for either rolling your own cigarettes, or for chewing.

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Richard Kaufman
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 18th, 2018, 9:56 pm

Leo, the Duke set of cards is highly rare, accounting for its high price. I don't know of another set that early which describes card tricks of this type.
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Bill Mullins
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Bill Mullins » August 18th, 2018, 10:22 pm

Leonard Hevia wrote:The Erdnase/tobacco cards possible connection begs the question: Were the card tricks on those tobacco trading cards popular effects with card magicians in the late 19th century? Much like the packet trick craze of the 1970s.


I think they are (mostly) more or less "standard" tricks, popular then and now. The Rising Card and the Card Stab are timeless.

observer
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby observer » August 19th, 2018, 12:33 am

Bill Mullins wrote:
Leonard Hevia wrote:The Erdnase/tobacco cards possible connection begs the question: Were the card tricks on those tobacco trading cards popular effects with card magicians in the late 19th century? Much like the packet trick craze of the 1970s.


I think they are (mostly) more or less "standard" tricks, popular then and now. The Rising Card and the Card Stab are timeless.


Eight Kings goes back to 1876 (at least) (Hoffman's Modern Magic).

"Selected card at selected number by different methods" .. that's most card tricks, isn't it?

3 Card Monte - a specialty of Canada Bill Jones (1837-1877).

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Marco Pusterla
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Re: ERDNASE

Postby Marco Pusterla » August 19th, 2018, 4:20 am

observer wrote:
Eight Kings goes back to 1876 (at least) (Hoffman's Modern Magic).


Eight Kings was first described in The Expositor, or, Many Mysteries Unravelled - Including that of the Learned Pig published in Boston in 1805 by William Frederick Pinchbeck. The trick begins on page 95: "By what manner the Pig is thought to know the card drawn".

It is not the first cyclical stack: earlier examples exist - in Latin - going back to the late Middle Ages (cfr. Ye Olde Magic Mag, Vol. 2 #3).
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