THIS CHICK HAS RIPPED OFF CHRIS HART'S ENTIRE ACT!

Discuss the latest news and rumors in the magic world.

Postby Richard Kaufman » 06/13/06 12:44 PM

Hey, this should be a lively discussion. Take a look at this:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=umEH1J8Vbdg
Not sure what country the clip is from (Holland, Germany?), but this girl does Chris Hart's entire hand act almost move for move! (Except, that is, when the male hand grabs her bosom.) I'm not kidding, you really have to watch it.
Someone out there should alert Chris, though I'm not sure what he can do about it.
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Postby Guest » 06/13/06 01:00 PM

Here's "Mara's" website:

http://kazan.tros.nl

Oscar, Renzo & Mara - were as young as 15, 13 and 14 when in 1996 the three of them decided to form the group Magic Unlimited. Even then, it was their idea to combine spectacular illusions and magic with contemporary music, dance, dynamics and romance. This idea of theirs turned out to hit a bulls eye and within a few short years they grew out to be Europes most popular illusionists.

In 1999 they were asked to perform at a special gala in Las Vegas for the first time and less than 6 months later, at the request of many, they returned to this international centre of entertainment in the US to perform in the famous casino cum theatre Caesars Palace. This successful performance was taped by NBC television and televised coast-to-coast.

In Europe, theatre and TV performances followed in rapid succession. In 2000, during a series of shows in Paris, France, The City of Lights, - Oscar, Renzo & Mara - were invited to appear in a renown TV show on the French TF-1 channel. Much to their surprise and completely unexpectedly, they were awarded the Mandrake d Or after this performance. This is the prestigious international special achievement award for illusionists, which is granted annually.

In 2001, - Oscar, Renzo & Mara - hosted 8 immensely popular magic shows for Dutch national TV. Because of their dazzling and dynamic presentation and wonderful personalities they gained a massive Dutch audience. Broadcaster Tros decided to continue the shows in 2002 and 2003. During these shows they involved celebrity guests in baffling tricks and illusions.

There was no stopping them.Late 2002, - Oscar, Renzo & Mara - started to tour the theatres. Currently they travel from one packed European stage to the next, and they are booked solid up to April 2005.

Dutch Tros-television decided to broadcast 16 (!) new magic shows on prime-time during the year 2005.

They are regular guests in theatres and TV shows all over Europe. Well-known TV shows, such as Le plus grand cabaret du Monde in France, Traumtnzer and Fernsehgarten in Germany, Worlds Greatest Magic in the US and many more, regularly invite these young, sympathetic magic entertainers. - Oscar, Renzo & Mara - have turned into popular illusionists the world over.

In 2006, - Oscar, Renzo & Mara - hope to open their own magic theatre in the South of Spain. The theatre will seat 500 people, and they will perform a large proportion of the year for a spoilt international audience.
Naturally, - Oscar, Renzo & Mara -will continue to perform for TV and in theatres all over the world and they will live up to their motto: - Oscar, Renzo & Mara - .what you getis an illusion!!
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Postby Guest » 06/13/06 01:21 PM

It always makes me sick to see people do other peoples act. There is so many things we can do ...

I remember many years ago a guy doing the whole Jeff Mc Bride act ...

:eek:
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Postby Guest » 06/13/06 02:26 PM

I remember them from when they were mid teens, they were on some TV show here in the states.
Steve V
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Postby Guest » 06/13/06 03:15 PM

Relying on RK's observation that this is Chris Hart's routine, move for move, unless Chris sold them performing rights for his creation, such a performance is outright theft.
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Postby Pete Biro » 06/13/06 03:25 PM

The link has been forwarded to Chris.
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Postby Guest » 06/13/06 08:23 PM

She's much cuter than Chris, (of course, that's subjective.) Still, there's no excuse for outright theft of an act that is so related to another performer. Shame Shame Shame.
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Postby Guest » 06/13/06 09:15 PM

>>It always makes me sick to see people do other peoples act.

Sometimes they've become big acts themselves, too.

http://www.spencersmagic.com/media.html
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 12:19 AM

John, could you clarify your above post ?
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 09:40 AM

Sometimes the copy-ists become big acts in and of themselves, too.
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 09:53 AM

So - if I understand you correctly - you are then claiming that The Spencers are copyists ?

Would you substantiate that claim ?
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Postby Pete Biro » 06/14/06 09:53 AM

Are you saying that the Spencers are big time copyists? Of whom?
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 10:24 AM

Look at the videos, see what you think.
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 10:33 AM

I believe John is trying to say that the Spencer's have copied the Pendragon's look and style. They definately remind me of them, but I wouldn't say they have copied John and Char though; at least not as blantantly obvious as the girl in question.
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 11:06 AM

It's nothing new...in my Navy days I'd go to places where girls would grope themselves on stage. Good stuff.
Steve V
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 11:12 AM

I've seen their videos ( as well as their touring DVD ) and don't believe there is much comparison to be made.

They have very different performing styles !
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 11:22 AM

Magic Palace, Spain:
http://www.magicpalace.info/
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 12:34 PM

Maybe I'm wrong. I thought that's who John was speaking of. Please keep in mind, I'm not agreeing with him though. I see similarities, not a copy.
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 06/14/06 01:20 PM

Getting back on track, I just received this note from Christopher Hart, who requested that I post it on the Forum:

I was recently told about your Genii forum and read some of the comments regarding the girl who stole my Glove routine.

I am in the process of gathering information for possible legal recourse; but for the record I have never sold any performance rights for that routine to anyone.

In my opinion, it should not be supported by any magic group or organization. It is only through group support that pressure can be affected to prevent the blatant stealing of a persons act, routine, or original idea.

Thank you,
Christopher Hart
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 01:50 PM

I quite agree with Christopher Hart's view. However, you do realize of course that weeding out all the acts which are direct copies of other acts and routines would seriously impact the volume of performances.

I don't know what it is like today but I can certainly say that if all the would be Cardini's or the wanna be Channing Pollocks had been snuffed out the magical scene would have been refreshingly more entertaining. Less cluttered certainly.
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 03:13 PM

Its one thing to take the technique of a trick its an entirely different thing to completely copy the act of another. I believe the this is the case we have here.
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 04:51 PM

There was an asian "mentalist" (I use the term loosely) who even looked like Max Maven, and that WAS scary. :eek:

PSIncerely Yours,
Paul Alberstat
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Postby Guest » 06/14/06 10:35 PM

The problem, of course, will be the cost of litigation which almost certainly will have to be brought in their home country or where the infringement occurred, if this was a one-time thing. Litigation of this type in the US is time-consuming and expensive. I can only imagine it being more so if it has to be mounted someplace in Europe, assuming that Chris has any protection over there.

Perhaps a strongly worded letter from a lawyer with the possible threat of a lawsuit and the resulting bad publicity will be enough to extract a settlement.

Of course, the problem is, if the little cutie-pie has performed this repeatedly on television or on stage, then any time Chris performs it in Europe he looks like the thief. The theft of the routine and the potential loss of business combined with the embarrassment factor should be enough to prompt a settlement...unless she learned it from a "creative consultant" who is the person who stole it from Chris.

This could become complicated.
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Postby Guest » 06/15/06 10:28 AM

I was hoping for a wardrobe malfunction, but I'll settle for a cease and desist order in Chris' favor.
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Postby Jeff Haas » 06/15/06 10:37 AM

Didn't Chris do his routine all over the world, around the time the Addams Family movies came out?
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Postby Guest » 06/15/06 10:49 AM

I'm willing to give her a spanking as punishment.
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Postby Guest » 06/15/06 11:41 AM

In that part of the world, $10,000 US could certainly make the problem go away if you know the right people. :whack:

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Postby Guest » 06/15/06 05:51 PM

With the recognition that great care and discretion would have to be exercised (i.e., perhaps only RK and fellow admins would have posting privileges), what about creating a GF online hall of shame for blatant, uncreative copycats?

Clay
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Postby Guest » 06/16/06 04:43 AM

Originally posted by Magicam:
With the recognition that great care and discretion would have to be exercised ...
Surely those who find themselves on such a list are unlikely to believe there was much care or discretion involved.

And such a list would more likely validate particular interests than offer a "don't show new stuff around these people" warning.
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Postby Guest » 06/16/06 11:28 AM

Originally posted by Magicam:
With the recognition that great care and discretion would have to be exercised (i.e., perhaps only RK and fellow admins would have posting privileges), what about creating a GF online hall of shame for blatant, uncreative copycats?
Clay
The problem, of course, is that the posting of a person's name on such a list would automatically carry the accusation of theft. Absent compelling, no, make that air-tight evidence, the likelihood of legal action by the aggrieved party is almost a certainty. It would get expensive and ugly very quickly with RK, as owner, in the middle. I doubt very much that he wants to take up his time and resources defending such a case.

Few cases are this cut and dried with move-by-move evidence on video tape and Chris Hart declaring that he did not sell rights to anyone. The case seems open and shut that she either stole Chris' act or someone taught her the act, failing to inform her and her partners that the act belonged to Chris.

I'd still like to hear what the blond has to say and what her theory of defense is.
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Postby Pete Biro » 06/16/06 11:37 AM

Go to here site and axe! :D
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Postby Rick Ruhl » 06/17/06 03:27 PM

Originally posted by Pete Biro:
Go to her site and axe! :D
That's a bit of cruel and unusual punishiment for just stealing an act. However it might make some people think twice about stealing. <grin>

I can see it now, a new made for tv movie, based on a true story. The Magician's Axe Murders!
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Postby Guest » 06/18/06 01:20 PM

I just remembered that I had seen them before on World's greatest magic. They did Jim Steinmeyer's Modern Art illusion. It was horribly edited together MTV style.
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Postby Guest » 06/18/06 03:59 PM

Honestly:
After this entire discussion, am I the one that has to come right out and say that she's absolutely horrible?

With all the talk about her "stealing" an act, why no mention of her "butchering the hell out of" an act?

Her mugging, nipping at the air, and irritating feigned looks of "shock" and "surprise" at the wacky proceedings are absolutely unwatchable.

THIS is a "big act" around the world?

Holy crap.
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Postby Guest » 06/18/06 04:00 PM

I mean, come on.
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Postby Guest » 06/18/06 05:51 PM

Many years ago a magician I knew told me that he and another were doing an illusion show in a nearby town. I asked the simple question "when?" and in response I was treated to a tirade about how no magicians were allowed to see his show because all they do is steal. (I should mention that this particular magician has, in fact, been caught stealing on at least one occasion.)
It is a sad world we live in when people can't think up their own idea's and resort to stealing, but thankfully we live in a universe where images and information from one side of the world can now be shown on the other, making theft all that much harder to get away with.

Gord
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Postby Guest » 06/19/06 02:24 PM

Dang it, I like this castaway dave more every day.
Steve V
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Postby Guest » 06/19/06 05:26 PM

Originally posted by Gord Gardiner:
It is a sad world we live in when people can't think up their own idea's and resort to stealing, but thankfully we live in a universe where images and information from one side of the world can now be shown on the other, making theft all that much harder to get away with.
Gord
Writing original material isn't as hard as some people think. People create crap every day....just look at most television programs.

However, writing SUCCESSFUL and ENTERTAINING material is extremely difficult. For many who do not have the background or education in performing magic, or are either too lazy or too stupid to be creative, a lack of ethics can be a short cut to success by simply appropriating a successful performer's act.

The other performer has done all the work - the creativity, the refinement through performance and analysis - so the act is ready to perform. Easy enough for the hack to step in and take the fruit of someone else's labor.

More than thieves, these people are parasites. They should not be rewarded with support from the magic community. They should not be given awards or invited to perform at magic conventions. I doubt the organized magic community will do much, because it hasn't done much in the past to combat this sort of behavior.

If you see this woman or her partners invited to perform at any magic function, a strong letter of protest to the supporting organization should be sent.
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Postby Guest » 06/22/06 03:18 PM

This is a shame. Hart's routine is classic and this is such a blatent rip-off, much like the guy who stole ALL of Copperfield's show, including illusion design, choreography, blocking and music.

There are several inexpensive ways to deal with it. One is pressure from the magic community. Letters to the show's producers, newspapers, television stations which aired it. Even getting YouTube to 'pull' the clip is possible. (Especially ANY clips from television shows or films which an individual just happened to post on their own.)

Someone on this post mentioned how small the world is nowadays and with the use of the internet this can at least be addressed. ABSOLUTELY! The main thing you're shooting for is that no one can now profess to be 'ignorant' when it comes to stealing an entire routine outright. If they're 'in the business' and read up on magic online and in magazines, etc., they should know they're responsible. Playing dumb ain't going to cut it.

I can remember performing in Atlantic City and I was asked to do a separate show from the revue show I was in at the casino for a big 'high rollers' event. On the bill were some local acts as well as seasoned performers and before I go onstage, I'm watching the dressingroom monitors and there is this guy in his early Twenties onstage, doing Ronn Lucas' Turtle/sock puppet routine - word-for-word. Including having made the SAME props, everything. If he was Twelve years old and performing at a school talent show, maybe. But this was A.C. in a large 1,200 seat theater for high rollers.

And the guy was oblivious that you shouldn't take an entire act. But where is he today? I'm sure it caught up with him. Get the word out. Stop this girl from performing it on upcoming tv shows, and just let all concerned be absolutely aware that this is a original routine she ripped off. Thankfully Chris actually does have some clout with movie roles and appearances on several tv shows worldwide. That will certainly help.

Chris, let me know if there's anything I can do. : )

Chipper
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Postby Guest » 07/22/06 11:45 PM

I just saw this footage the other day and I did indeed think it was crap (must not be scottish). I remember when Rudy Coby showed some people in Japan that had TOTALLY ripped off his show. (I can't say his ideas as the multi-legged things is an old clown gag)

I have seen out right verbatim of other people's act and it makes me wanna slap them something fierce. If you work hard enuff you too can have your material ripped off. If anyone started doing my effects.. I would feel very sorry for them.

But seriously, glad Mr. Hart knows about this. I was wondering.
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