Real Secrets...

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Postby Dustin Stinett » 12/27/12 06:27 PM

Another envelope from RS today (including mystery items...).
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 12/27/12 06:38 PM

Argh!!!! Not in Washington yet!

NOTE that there are two new bonus items up on the Real Secrets website. (Not the stuff that was there a few weeks ago, but NEW items.)
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Postby Doug Thornton » 12/27/12 09:54 PM

At the risk of being forever banned from Real Secrets...the mystery items might make up for this...but the latest item is disappointing. Previous items have had their intrigue, and have been interesting and appealing, but this item would have been OK as a bonus...
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 12/28/12 12:54 AM

With over two dozen items in the first year, they can afford to have a few items that won't appeal to every one of their customers.
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Postby Dustin Stinett » 12/28/12 01:30 AM

Doug, that was my initial reaction, but now I consider it a challenge: an excellent exercise for my own "creativity muscles." Is there a way to make this "work" for ME?
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Postby Bill Mullins » 12/28/12 03:49 PM

Doug Thornton wrote:At the risk of being forever banned from Real Secrets...the mystery items might make up for this...but the latest item is disappointing. Previous items have had their intrigue, and have been interesting and appealing, but this item would have been OK as a bonus...


Different strokes for different folks, I guess. I really like the plastic item.
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 12/28/12 05:38 PM

Plastic? That's something new.
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Postby stereo » 12/28/12 07:04 PM

Yes the one you speak about in previous message and you can see on the RS website.
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 12/28/12 09:39 PM

Hey Stereo, welcome to the Genii Forum.
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Postby stereo » 12/29/12 09:14 AM

Merci !
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Postby stereo » 12/29/12 12:41 PM

Richard Kaufman wrote:Plastic? That's something new.


It's not plastic finally. It's better than plastic !
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Postby Ted M » 12/29/12 01:10 PM

Lame.

This is the kind of thing that would come as a prize in a box of cereal.

Very, very lame.
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Postby AJM » 12/29/12 02:16 PM

So with regard to the new bonus items on the website, where are the written instructions that are referred to?

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Postby Ted M » 12/29/12 02:40 PM

The one with straight lines isn't an extra. This month's "feature trick" is a page of written instructions for what you've watched.
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Postby AJM » 12/29/12 02:51 PM

Ok, Ted, I think I've got you - when I receive this month's mailing (which, given usual international mail timescales, will probably arrive this time next year) all will become clear.

Many thanks!

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Postby Doug Thornton » 12/29/12 09:23 PM

I have given more thought to the new item and admittedly am swayed by Dustin's comment and the info on the Real Secrets site. There is a place for the new item and it's a matter of being selective as to when and where to use it (like many Real Secrets effects and magic in general). The two added "references" on the site are welcome and helped by expanding on the instructions that arrived in the mail. However, the second item is not quite "working" for me. I need to look at it some more.
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 12/30/12 01:09 AM

I think that few optical illusions will have the appeal to us of a good trick. I've done some optical illusions for people, small things, and they get an interesting reaction, but of course they're not magic--they lack the "wow" factor of seeing a mortal perform the impossible. But a performance of close-up magic can benefit from the variety just the way a stage show will often have a juggler or vent to break things up.
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Postby erdnasephile » 12/30/12 02:03 AM

I agree with Richard.

One notable exception, however, is the Tenyo trick with the stretching and shrinking cats. I've found that the audience's familiarity with the optical illusion behind the trick sets them up perfectly to be crushed at the climax of the effect.
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 12/30/12 02:16 AM

Yes, but the "Sakkaku Illusion Scale" is not just an optical illusion--there's real technique and a secret to it, a trick, that makes it more effective than the normal version of this common optical illusion. When I do it for people it is seen as a magic trick, not as an optical illusion.
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 01/01/13 02:06 PM

Finally received the latest installment of Real Secrets.

I would not do it as described. I don't know about the rest of you, but I'd have a hard time keeping the spectators interested while I engaged in the necessary activity before actually being able to demonstrate what's interesting. And I actually have a better idea, which comes from Theodore DeLand. The idea is to have the thing pre-printed on your publicity brochure and display it, then demonstrate the seemingly impossible thing with the extra piece, then GIVE the whole thing to the spectator. This gets rid of all the dead time.

I like the bonus a lot! I love anamorphic art and this little item is great. There are no instructions for it in the envelope, but there is a video on the Real Secrets website for it.
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Postby Dustin Stinett » 01/01/13 02:10 PM

Richard Kaufman wrote:I would not do it as described. I don't know about the rest of you, but I'd have a hard time keeping the spectators interested while I engaged in the necessary activity before actually being able to demonstrate what's interesting.

That's exactly the same challenge I have with it. I don't come with a cool musical soundtrack.
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Postby stereo » 01/02/13 10:29 AM

I think that we should not hide for make it, and use it as "a device that is used to create an illusion".

Or , Personally I have used it to tell a story. The story of two rival with excatly identical restaurant, facing a street . To attract the customers the first restaurant decided to put a nice decoration and the customers go to him. But the next day the tablecloth was stolen by his concurent who has put on his restaurant. I repeated a second time with another one, wich is stolen too. Then the first restaurant decided to work in secret during the night (you now make the regular routine). The next day The second restaurant is trapped because he can not stealing again because.. (you know why ).... But the viewer also fell into the trap ...

I hope I have not said too much, but I try to show that it is possible to find good ideas with a bit of imagination.
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 01/02/13 12:09 PM

Stereo, that's a very good presentation! But I think having the items preprinted rather than drawing them in front of the audience is better. Your presentation would go very nicely with that idea.
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Postby Matthew Field » 01/02/13 01:31 PM

The gizmo itself is beautifully made. And the other illusion is excellent as well.

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Postby stereo » 01/02/13 02:26 PM

Thank you Richard.
To be more clear I begin to draw with paper pencil 2 strictly identical pattern, using only one design (but you can start with all already draw). I added above the restaurant's name and you can add a few details if you are a good draftsman. I prepared three colored tablecloth (each being better decorated than the previous).
The first 2 are stolen and fit to the drawings of rival restaurant wich is exactly the same.
Now I erase the first drawing and I hide to draw the second different pattern, telling the story of secret night work of restaurant transformation. And i use the third better decorated tablecloth, and I tell the rest of the story. It is also possible to conclude several way, as for example like in Tenyo's Illusion scale acting visualy as if you strech the cut out tablecloth.
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Postby Bill Mullins » 01/02/13 02:47 PM

It's a shame that there isn't a forum at the RS site, so that:

1. Discussions like this could continue explicitly, and

2. Participants don't put their RS status at risk due to inadvertently crossing a line in discussing the tricks.
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 01/02/13 02:58 PM

I have been bugging the RS Team to create a Forum for many months, and have even offered to host it here as part of the Genii Forum.

They keep trying to create a sense of community, but can't do that if we members cannot have a place to congregate and chat! The pizza party at the Genii Bash was a great start, but it was only a start, and I think they're losing momentum by farting around.
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Postby erdnasephile » 01/02/13 03:32 PM

I completely agree.

I don't believe in randomly tipping secrets, and I get the desire to keep things exclusive. I also realize this is what we signed up for of our own free will.

However, the whole notion that you constantly have watch what you say to avoid having your membership cut off isn't very pleasant. Plus, the lack of a forum is stifling discussion that would help in coming up with creative ways to use the RS stuff.
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 01/02/13 03:57 PM

We have to play by the rules set up by the RS Team, but they really need to give members a place to play and discuss!
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Postby stereo » 01/02/13 04:17 PM

Yes it's not very easy, but as lot of people seem to have been extremely disappointed by the magic of this month. So I wanted to try to show the positive side by being a little creative. But it is true that writing my post I have constantly change, remove words, pondered, trying to be clear without saying too much. Very difficult because in addition I do not speak English well. Maybe I should have simply send the idea to the RS team, but I do not think it's enough interesting to be shared on their website.
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Postby Ted M » 01/02/13 04:22 PM

Nobody needs to wait for Real Secrets to take the lead on this.

We could create a forum here, have everybody buy a couple Dover books by Karl Fulves and Martin Gardner, and work through one page from each book per month. Together, as a creative community.

Folks who relish the exclusive/isolationist aspects of Real Secrets can simply pretend they have an invisible treehouse in their back yard, and go sit in it. Alone.

Those who yearn for the surprise-in-the-mail aspect of Real Secrets can give the books to a buddy and have that person mail them the pages each month.

Also hand them $180 to do so.
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Postby Marco Pusterla » 01/02/13 04:49 PM

In my opinion, the RS material is highly hit and miss... The tricks are clever "toys", something for the amateur but which don't warrant the expense - for my personal tastes and the way I work - to get them.

Most ideas are rehashes (sp?) of classical principles: very clever ideas, indeed, but hardly original. As a semi-pro, they are not for me: I have my set of impromptu material, worked out in 20+ years of performances, well rehearsed, and I don't need to add/replace it with the tricks provided by RS. Most of them are US-centric, which makes them unsuitable for me, hopping between the UK and Italy. I enjoy the ideas and I enjoy the tricks: I have a drawer especially for RS :)

Other than the first effect and an idea some months back (an "extra"), the material has been disappointing to me personally. I won't renew my subscription... nothing simply fits my style and my performances. I don't want to say the material is garbage: it's simply not for me, but if you are an amateur and don't rely on magic to live, then their ideas are nice. Not commercial, but nice.

This month's effect is clever and it's a practical way to perform something we all know without having to rely on larger props. But is it magical? Nope. My 9 years old saw right through it (indeed, she is familiar with the principle, having had access to my library...). There is nothing magical in most of the RS's releases: puzzling, maybe, but not magical.

I don't do puzzles, sorry!
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Postby Jonathan Townsend » 01/02/13 04:49 PM

Richard Kaufman wrote:We have to play by the rules set up by the RS Team, but they really need to give members a place to play and discuss!


How can you discuss trick 5 when some folks only started their subscription with trick 6?
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Postby Bill Marquardt » 01/02/13 10:00 PM

I honestly do not believe the originators of this scheme put enough thought into the process before introducing it. I say this as someone who was kicked out for not complying with an unwritten rule. My money was returned and I am happy for it as I believe the money has been better spent since then.

I am all for the idea, but it seems to me that an inexpensive mail order service such this could only provide material suitable for newer hobbiests or occasional users. That is of course unless they were to provide solid material from notable professionals willing to share their real secrets and routines. That ain't going to happen, not at $15 a month. Anyway, that is what books are for, eh?
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Postby erdnasephile » 01/02/13 10:21 PM

Did anyone already get automatically rebilled for Year 2 yet?
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 01/02/13 10:50 PM

Are we at the 11th installment already? I can't really remember what month it started. They won't bill for year two until the 11th installment has been sent out.

I've been very happy with my subscription--I find the material interesting and fun to play with. Some things I do for family or friends, but I'm not a pro and neither are most of the people interested in magic. Pros make up only a small percentage of the overall group of people in magic.

I'll happily let them charge me for year two and look forward to another 24 or so items.
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Postby PickaCard » 01/03/13 12:13 AM

Richard, this is installment 10.

I think a lot of people would love for RS to be more... Like a clever new Tenyo item every month. But I do not think this is realistic.

Overall, RS is hit and miss, but every month I look forward to 1 item mailed to me (which often includes a secret bonus item) and a bonus item on their website, I find that I get my money and entertainment worth every month.

I must say, I am waiting for the bonus 13th item of the 12 month period that was promised to all those who joined at the very beginning with a full 1 year membership (as opposed to those who joined with the trial membership) to really evaluate if my expectations were met.
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Postby erdnasephile » 01/03/13 01:13 AM

Jonathan Townsend wrote:
Richard Kaufman wrote:We have to play by the rules set up by the RS Team, but they really need to give members a place to play and discuss!


How can you discuss trick 5 when some folks only started their subscription with trick 6?


Bob Kohler used to have a BBS where you could only gain access to certain parts of the forum if you bought a particular trick. He would just give you the access to each forum as you bought an item.

This could work with RS if you had a separate forum for each month, but would be a bit more tricky given the number of issues; however, I don't think it would be that insurmountable.
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Postby stereo » 01/03/13 06:30 AM

Richard Kaufman wrote:I'll happily let them charge me for year two and look forward to another 24 or so items.


Puzzle are not bad magic finally.. ;o)
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 01/03/13 12:58 PM

Good magic presented badly is just a puzzle.

A puzzle can sometimes be presented magically.

But I'm puzzled by all of it.
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