What is a "real" magician?

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Postby Guest » 12/05/02 02:32 PM

In this months Genii Aaron Fisher states that The Paper Engine is "about real technique, for real magicians." I would like to ask: what exactly is a "real" magician? I say, for what it's worth, that a "real" magician is someone an audience has seen perform magic, in that they believed, at least briefly, that they actually saw magic happening. Something like that..
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Postby Guest » 12/12/02 01:06 AM

Huh...?
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Postby Larry Horowitz » 12/12/02 01:48 AM

I think Aaron is refering to those willing to strive continually for perfection.
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Postby Guest » 12/12/02 02:07 AM

...to ask: what exactly is a "real" magician? ...
One who does not need sleights, gimicks, or anything more than force of will to effect desired results. What such a person would want a book of sleights for is beyond me. :D
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Postby Guest » 12/12/02 07:56 AM

Originally posted by Jonathan Townsend:
One who does not need sleights, gimicks, or anything more than force of will to effect desired results.[/QB]
I call that God.
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Postby Brian Marks » 12/12/02 12:14 PM

Originally posted by Dan Watkins:
Originally posted by Jonathan Townsend:
One who does not need sleights, gimicks, or anything more than force of will to effect desired results.
I call that God.[/QB]
Ive been to a few of his lecutes. Sill trying to split the Red Sea trick but it doesn't work on the Hudson River. Damn Transit Strike!
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Postby Guest » 12/14/02 12:43 PM

"Real" is one of those words with several definitions, at least 10 at last count. Youngsters these days make utterances such as, "Keep it real, dude..." In this sense, they are alluding to a more personal brand of authenticity.

In magicdom, thanks to the currency of terms like the "real work" and "real-world," there is a tendency to distinguish mediocre performers from serious-minded, above-average performers, referring to them as (ahem) "real magicians." That is, they are SINCERE (in intent and presentation)and in the informal, slangy sense, they are a "version" that is more heightened or extreme than your average duffer. So-and-so is a real magician in the same sense we say that so-and-so "did a REAL GOOD job."

The REAL WORK is may not be real at all, but only nominal.

The world of course SEEMS real enough.
The real-world needs world-class, really "real magicians" who can deliver the real work, in real time, for real people, for a real good fee.

Really?

Really.

Onward...
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Postby Guest » 12/14/02 07:31 PM

Well, Jon, that sums it up very well, thanks. Now I need to determine whether or not I am a real magician.
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Postby Guest » 12/15/02 08:15 AM

Mike:

I think that we continually re-define ourselves as this-or-that. Most of the time, at least when it comes to our playful roles as "magicians," the SPECTATORS are the ones who define us and whether or not we are "real"...These definitions also change from day to day...

Who are we?
Who am I?
Who was that masked man?

Onward...
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Postby John LeBlanc » 12/16/02 09:48 AM

Originally posted by Jon Racherbaumer:
I think that we continually re-define ourselves as this-or-that. Most of the time, at least when it comes to our playful roles as "magicians," the SPECTATORS are the ones who define us and whether or not we are "real"...These definitions also change from day to day...
Well the good thing is every performance is an opportunity to redefine what we meant the last time. (Or not.)

As for a spectator's definitions, I draw my "real" conclusions based on the number of uttered (or whispered) exclamations at the end of a routine. High marks always go to uttered profanities, with the f-word garnering extra points.

Puzzled "What the hell was that?" looks, on the other hand, cause me to delete two f-word marks; it's not my goal to puzzle.

The word "suck", on the other hand, would normally generate a desire to ball up in a fetal position, were it not for my seasoned and mature "I'm made of Telflon, you're made of glue" response.

John LeBlanc
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Postby Guest » 12/16/02 10:24 AM

Isn't it an interesting that words with an "uck" suffix are so provocative and evocative? I would add to what John L. has said, only this:

"It requires pluck and a little luck to avoid responses equivalent to "yuck."

Yuk, yuk...
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Postby Guest » 12/17/02 02:05 PM

Is "Duck!" provocative?
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Postby John LeBlanc » 12/17/02 02:08 PM

Originally posted by Whit Haydn:
Is "Duck!" provocative?
It is to some strict vegetarians. <g>

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Postby Guest » 12/17/02 02:36 PM

Is "duck" provocative?
It depends...
...on whether you are buying one from another duck or not.

"Duck" is definitely funnier than "cat."
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Postby Guest » 12/17/02 03:45 PM

Well sure, I find ducks provocative, especially the way they dress. They should probably have some sort of laws about them running around loose the way they do.

I meant "Duck!" as in "Hey, Buddy, your momma's got a shotgun. Duck!"
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Postby Guest » 12/17/02 04:53 PM

Ain't ambiguity great?
Thanks for the clarification, Whit.
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Postby Pete Biro » 12/17/02 08:52 PM

Wanna buy a duck?

Cook a goose? :p
Stay tooned.
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Postby Pete Biro » 12/17/02 08:53 PM

Make sure your reel works........ :eek:
Stay tooned.
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Postby Guest » 12/18/02 03:30 PM

Viaduct?
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Postby Jim Maloney_dup1 » 12/18/02 07:36 PM

Originally posted by Whit Haydn:
Viaduct?
Ok, boss..I give up. Why a duck?

-Jim
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Postby Guest » 12/19/02 02:29 AM

It's swordfish. Don mention it.
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Postby Guest » 12/19/02 05:52 AM

You can't fool me - - there ain't no sanity clause.
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Postby Larry Horowitz » 12/19/02 11:27 AM

Get your Tooty-Fruity ice cream, or I can sell you the code book.
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Postby Guest » 12/19/02 11:39 AM

The last few posts (mine included) roll off "like water from the back of a duck!"

Time to re-group and disentangle the original thread...

...unless you want a new one about THE VARIETIES OF BEING DUCKY?

Onward...
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Postby Pete Biro » 12/19/02 01:21 PM

Duck you very much.
Stay tooned.
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Postby Guest » 12/19/02 03:25 PM

We were kinda swimming in Duck Soup.

Besides, Jon, you were the one who was celebrating ambiguity. We were just getting stuck to all the ambiguity you can find around a joint like this. Schools out in a few days!
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Postby Guest » 12/24/02 05:39 AM

Having mercilessly beaten the Marx Brothers scripts to death ("I sold him the code and two pair of plans!"), back to the initial point:

I think Jon has it right -- the spectators, not you, will decide whether you are a "real" magician.

The best you can do is -- well, your best!

cheers,
Peter Marucci
showtimecol@aol.com
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Postby Guest » 12/24/02 06:42 AM

I guess we really need to figure out if we're real people first! A sort of 'Realty Check.' Or is that a deposit on a house? Real men know who the real magicians are, right guys? We're all real men here, except for Lisa - who's awfully silent lately... Asrah
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Postby Lisa Cousins » 12/24/02 01:08 PM

Originally posted by Asrah:
We're all real men here, except for Lisa - who's awfully silent lately...
Aw, thanks for noticing, sweetheart. Here are my excuses:

1. Cookie baking duties. :)
2. Absence of Ralph Bonheim :(
3. Presence of troll whose postings are completely out of tune with the friendly intelligence that has always characterized this board. :mad:
4. Became real magician. :genii:

Happy Holidays, all!

Lisa
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Postby Guest » 12/24/02 01:22 PM

Wow, this has become fun. I'm glad John pointed out that the audience decides on the real magician and I'm glad Peter agreed, because that was pretty much the same as what I originally said. I'm on the same wavelength as some of the top minds of magic! This makes my day! Happy holidays to all! :)
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Postby Lisa Cousins » 12/26/02 11:01 AM

Originally posted by Lisa Cousins:
3. Presence of troll whose postings are completely out of tune with the friendly intelligence that has always characterized this board. :mad:
And the VERY NEXT DAY the Billy Goats Gruff knocked the evil troll into the Swamp of Arrogance, and they all lived intelligently ever after. :D
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Postby Guest » 12/30/02 03:19 PM

You're too kind, Ms Lisa. I've just been on the lurk more than usual.

FWIW, I think you're a real magician when friends and acquaintances start referring to you as a magician, as in "By the way, did you know Lisa's a magician?" as opposed to, "By the way, Lisa here knows a cool card trick."

In just such a way, I finally knew I was a man the summer after graduating high school, when I had a job selling women's shoes. A mother pointed at me and told her daughter, "Tell the man your shoe size." And that was that.
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Postby Guest » 12/30/02 07:02 PM

How do we know if we're real magicians? First off, the fact that we're having this debate lends credence to us thinking that we are.

Secondly, the fact that we are constantly trying to improve and learn is another sign.

Thirdly, the constant incorporation of Marxian one-liners into a substantive debate is a clear sign that...well, never mind what *that's* a sign of.

"You know, I've a mind to join a club and beat you over the head with it."

Cheers,
Steve
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Postby Guest » 01/01/03 10:26 AM

well people around me refer to me all the time as a magician, and I'm know I'm not a real one (yet).

I'm simply surrounded with people that love me.

and live in a place where I'm the only magician in the nearest 10,000 miles around.
after that I'm not completely sure.

However, I agree with Peter and Jon that the spectators are the ones who decide whether or not we are magicians.

But in that case I am a real magician...

hmm...
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Postby Guest » 01/01/03 12:15 PM

Hasn't anyone here read "The Velveteen Rabbit?" Of course - the only way to become a real magician is for your audience to make you real! --Asrah (became real in 1986)
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Postby Guest » 01/01/03 02:41 PM

Come on everybody - GET REAL ! :p
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Postby Lisa Cousins » 01/01/03 03:19 PM

Well, my meaning in saying that I've become "real" is that I am now doing exactly the magic I imagined when first I waved the wand. It's a dream-come-true thing.

But ... honestly? I knew I was a real magician the minute I tried my first trick. It was one of those sirens-going-off moments.

Happy New Year.
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Postby Guest » 01/01/03 03:23 PM

Originally posted by Asrah:
Hasn't anyone ... "The Velveteen Rabbit?"
Would that be the latest Michael Ammar release or the original but unpublished Ed Marlo version?

Here is a link: http://user.mc.net/~urwhatur/velrabbit.htm
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