On Tommy Wonder's Tamed Card

Discuss your favorite close-up tricks and methods.

Postby Tom Bennett » 09/17/09 05:27 PM

Hi,

I just made a new blog post on Tommy Wonders wonderful routine "The Tamed Card".

I can only recommend it to all the Youngsters that only know the YouTube and Theorie 11 stuff. Have a look at it, as this really shows the difference between a nice trick and a great routine.

If you ever wanted to learn it yourself but got frustrated by the description in the books or the explanation on the DVD I attached my own pratice companion document.

Have fun:

http://escamoteur.de/wordpress/index.ph ... amed-card/

Best
Tom

P.S.: If you like my blog, please register and spread the word!
Check out my magic blog www.escamoteur.de
Tom Bennett
 
Posts: 66
Joined: 07/15/08 03:16 AM

Postby Tom Stone » 09/17/09 07:59 PM

Tom Bennett wrote:If you ever wanted to learn it yourself but got frustrated by the description in the books or the explanation on the DVD I attached my own pratice companion document.


Tom, even though your post are well meant and in good faith, the copyright of the piece belongs to the Tommy Wonder Estate, and should not be published without permission.

I would be very much relieved if you could remove the PDF from your site, and then discuss the matter with Frank Bemelman of the Tommy Wonder Estate or with Dick Koornwinder (who is a member of this forum), before putting it up again.

Tommy Wonder Estate can be contacted at: info@tommywonder.nl
User avatar
Tom Stone
 
Posts: 1118
Joined: 01/18/08 01:00 PM
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Postby Jeff Haas » 09/17/09 11:26 PM

I've always thought the significant thing about this routine is that it is based on a part of Tommy's performance character. He reveals that he's obsessive-compulsive and asks the audience to indulge him as he has to deal with it.
Jeff Haas
 
Posts: 923
Joined: 01/17/08 01:00 PM
Location: San Mateo, CA

Postby Tom Bennett » 09/18/09 03:05 AM

@Tom Stone: I just put a comment on the page on this concern. Please have look. I won't take it down for the moment. Btw. anybody can buy the DVDs or the Books and I doubt if Tommy Wonder Estate does get money for it anylonger.

@Jeff Haas:
I totally agree and good that you pointed it out. I forgot to add to the post, that Tommy's presentation is highly tailored for his character and anybody wanting to perform it is highly recommended not to use his presentation to the word but to develop their own.
Best
Tom
Check out my magic blog www.escamoteur.de
Tom Bennett
 
Posts: 66
Joined: 07/15/08 03:16 AM

Postby Mats Kjellstrom » 09/18/09 03:10 AM

TIP - I use double scotch tape. Wax is messy...
Mats Kjellstrom
 
Posts: 165
Joined: 03/13/08 03:20 PM
Location: Everywhere

Postby Tom Bennett » 09/18/09 03:27 AM

Isn't the tape too visible?

I already thought of using 3M PostIt spray glue.
Check out my magic blog www.escamoteur.de
Tom Bennett
 
Posts: 66
Joined: 07/15/08 03:16 AM

Postby Henley » 09/18/09 06:27 AM

I tried double stick tape and 3M post-it glue stick and ended up coming back to wax. A tiny flattened spot in 2 opposite corners. It's invisible and just the right tackiness.
Henley
 
Posts: 52
Joined: 03/13/08 06:20 AM
Location: Japan

Postby Tom Stone » 09/18/09 06:54 AM

Tom Bennett wrote:@Tom Stone: I just put a comment on the page on this concern. Please have look. I won't take it down for the moment. Btw. anybody can buy the DVDs or the Books and I doubt if Tommy Wonder Estate does get money for it anylonger.

Dear Tom. You have a good reputation, and I can see that the transgression was made unintentionally in good faith, so I'm surprised over your response. You are not an amateur who is ignorant of artistic rights. Right?

While there are a lot of weird problems with copyright in USA vs. the rest of the world, those troublesome issues do not exist here since both Holland and Germany have signed the Berne convention without reservations.
That means that, since the creator of the piece is dutch; dutch copyright law is applied. The piece therefore is protected by copyright during 70 years after the creator's death. The rights belong to the estate of the creator.

In the comments at your blog, you write: I didnt make it better, I just distilled the best from the Book and DVD.. With that, you admitted that it isn't a derivative work (which would have been allowed) but a clear-cut transgression of copyright. And the document is too long and detailed to fall under the Fair Use doctrin. Should the Estate choose to bring this to court, you would lose within minutes. Google it, if you have any doubts.

With this piece, the Estate is extra sensitive, emotionally, since Christian Schenk of CardShark.de has obtained the license to manufacture it, and Christian is held in very high esteem, since he was the first person ever to contact the Estate to ask permission. I.e. the Estate is not happy with anything that might undermine Christian's work.

Still.... After discussing the matter with Frank Bemelman and Christian Schenk, the position is: Your document is unlikely to hurt Christian's license, and Frank recognize that you hold his brother in high esteem. Frank said that if you ask for permission, you will recieve it instantly, and then it will not be a copyright transgression anymore.

The way have been paved for you. I hope you take it.
Contact the estate at: info@tommywonder.nl
User avatar
Tom Stone
 
Posts: 1118
Joined: 01/18/08 01:00 PM
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Postby Tom Bennett » 09/18/09 07:19 AM

Hi Tom,

just to the legal copyright point. I do respect authorship, don't get me wrong. Still there would be some doubt if a magic trick can have a copyright at all. Only a written document can have this normally. The fair use priciple only works if I would have copied larger parts directly which I did not.
But I don't want to go deeper into this here.

I already had a very nice email conversation with Frank, he even added his own comment to my blog post.

Best
Tom
Check out my magic blog www.escamoteur.de
Tom Bennett
 
Posts: 66
Joined: 07/15/08 03:16 AM

Postby Tom Stone » 09/18/09 08:32 AM

Tom Bennett wrote:Still there would be some doubt if a magic trick can have a copyright at all. Only a written document can have this normally. The fair use priciple only works if I would have copied larger parts directly which I did not.


Tom, I'm happy to see that you cleared the matter with the estate! Great news! :)

The things you doubt are clear cut. It's only within US copyright where there are some confusion on the matter. That confusion doesn't exist between Dutch and German copyright law.

Copyright, according to the Berne Convention, doesn't just apply to written documents, but to paintings, photo, film, theatre, dance, music... all artistic work essentially, including specific choreographic renderings of magical illusions like the Tamed Card.

Hermetic Press has the creator's permission to describe the Tamed Card, and have the copyright for that particular description but not for the trick itself (since copyright can not be transfered, sold or given away).
The same with L&L - they have copyright on that particular filmed documentation of the piece, but not any rights to the piece itself. The piece belongs to the Tommy Wonder Estate.

And now, thanks to a single email to Frank, you have the estate's permission and are not longer committing a copyright transgression. In most cases, that it all it takes - a single email.
User avatar
Tom Stone
 
Posts: 1118
Joined: 01/18/08 01:00 PM
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Postby Jim Martin » 09/18/09 08:54 AM

Christian Schenk's web site is "card-shark.de".
Jim Martin
St. Louis MO
Jim Martin
 
Posts: 468
Joined: 01/17/08 01:00 PM
Location: St. Louis

Postby Tom Bennett » 09/18/09 10:15 AM

anybody can buy the DVDs or the Books and I doubt if Tommy Wonder Estate does get money for it anylonger.


Not that this is missunderstood. I did NOT in any way say that L&L or Hermetic press act dishonorably by not paying any longer. It's not so commong in magic that someone get's payed on a royalty basis. Often magicians only get a one time fee. That's was the base of my assumption. I was now told that Tommy indeed got a contract on royalty basis, so my assumption was completely wrong.

Best
Tom
Check out my magic blog www.escamoteur.de
Tom Bennett
 
Posts: 66
Joined: 07/15/08 03:16 AM

Postby PMS » 12/26/09 08:58 PM

I love Wonder' presentation and ratonalle for bringing out a "packet" of cards!
PMS
 
Posts: 20
Joined: 11/26/09 01:08 PM

Postby Jonathan Townsend » 12/26/09 10:35 PM

How do you keep from having an ever larger wallet full of cards if you take this from table to table?
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time
Jonathan Townsend
 
Posts: 6919
Joined: 01/17/08 01:00 PM
Location: Westchester, NY

Postby Denis Behr » 12/27/09 03:51 AM

By doing it just as Tommy Wonder describes it!
Denis Behr
 
Posts: 285
Joined: 01/18/08 01:00 PM
Location: Munich

Postby Dick Koornwinder » 12/27/09 05:20 AM

Yes Denis, this is the only right answer!
Dick Koornwinder
 
Posts: 130
Joined: 01/17/08 01:00 PM
Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands

Postby Pete Biro » 12/31/09 12:45 PM

Well done, all.
Stay tooned.
User avatar
Pete Biro
 
Posts: 7125
Joined: 01/17/08 01:00 PM
Location: Hollyweird

Postby Jonathan Townsend » 12/31/09 02:03 PM

There are seven cards in the wallet at first table. Why are there not eight when the performer gets to the next and nine at the table after that?

Let's presume the audience has the cognitive abilities to count to seven and follow what happens from table to table: A collection of seven cards is shown and an eighth card added. The seven change to match the eighth and the collection of eight cards is put in the wallet.

Some of the astonished engineers figure you've got a trick wallet and decide to follow to the next table. Out comes the collection of eight - no seven cards - and an eighth card is selected but does not match. The seven change to match the eighth card and all put into the wallet. Off to the next table they go to watch where that eighth card vanishes. Being engineers they probably figure the wallet has a secret compartment and give you credit for switching out entire packets of cards at will from an imagined collection of 52 to match any selected card.

Anyway, each time you take out and clearly count seven single cards. And each time you put away eight. While the astute bizarrist might play this off as the extra card being sacrificed to the wizards wonder wallet in exchange for a spell of camouflage or such, it leaves the attentive audience member with a discrepancy.
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time
Jonathan Townsend
 
Posts: 6919
Joined: 01/17/08 01:00 PM
Location: Westchester, NY

Postby Denis Behr » 12/31/09 02:57 PM

You are right, the trick is crap! With a fatal flaw like that, this Wonder guy should better stick to the Zombie.
Denis Behr
 
Posts: 285
Joined: 01/18/08 01:00 PM
Location: Munich

Postby Jonathan Townsend » 12/31/09 03:28 PM

Those who read the book could apply what's in the book to smooth over or incorporate that feature of the routine.

Perhaps that is the right answer. ;)
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time
Jonathan Townsend
 
Posts: 6919
Joined: 01/17/08 01:00 PM
Location: Westchester, NY

Postby Silly Walter » 12/31/09 04:16 PM

Jonathan Townsend wrote:There are seven cards in the wallet at first table. Why are there not eight when the performer gets to the next and nine at the table after that?

Let's presume the audience has the cognitive abilities to count to seven and follow what happens from table to table: A collection of seven cards is shown and an eighth card added. The seven change to match the eighth and the collection of eight cards is put in the wallet.

Some of the astonished engineers figure you've got a trick wallet and decide to follow to the next table. Out comes the collection of eight - no seven cards - and an eighth card is selected but does not match. The seven change to match the eighth card and all put into the wallet. Off to the next table they go to watch where that eighth card vanishes. Being engineers they probably figure the wallet has a secret compartment and give you credit for switching out entire packets of cards at will from an imagined collection of 52 to match any selected card.

Anyway, each time you take out and clearly count seven single cards. And each time you put away eight. While the astute bizarrist might play this off as the extra card being sacrificed to the wizards wonder wallet in exchange for a spell of camouflage or such, it leaves the attentive audience member with a discrepancy.





This is an excellent point. Logic would dictate that each performance should increase the packet by one card, yet you have the same number of cards for the next performance. Why is that? I'll tell you why.

The reason there are always the same number of cards when going from table to table rather than an increase of one card like you discovered is because in the time it takes to get to the next table, the Kannibal Kings** have already eaten one card.

** That is not a typo. The "K" on each King stands for "Kannibal".
Silly Walter The Polar Bear
Silly Walter
 
Posts: 133
Joined: 03/16/08 01:31 PM

Postby Jonathan Townsend » 12/31/09 05:06 PM

How many of you have taken a "fake call" app like the one i mentioned earlier this year and used it as the prompt to get this routine rolling?

Yes,... now... really... are you sure... okay I'll see if they want to give it a go... okay ... call you later.
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time
Jonathan Townsend
 
Posts: 6919
Joined: 01/17/08 01:00 PM
Location: Westchester, NY

Postby Silly Walter » 01/01/10 02:32 AM

Jonathan Townsend wrote:How many of you have taken a "fake call" app like the one i mentioned earlier this year and used it as the prompt to get this routine rolling?

Yes,... now... really... are you sure... okay I'll see if they want to give it a go... okay ... call you later.


Are you using a random word generator?

No offense !!

Just curious.
Silly Walter The Polar Bear
Silly Walter
 
Posts: 133
Joined: 03/16/08 01:31 PM

Postby Jonathan Townsend » 01/01/10 03:04 AM

Sorry, I've been unable to find and/or master the available tools to do Burroughs style cut ups from single and multiple sources. I've wanted to explore what madlibs type text merging has to offer. Getting back on topic to TW's Tamecard routine:

Imagine you have an audience and your cell phone rings. You pick up the phone and speak the second part of that post above.
Mundus vult decipi -per Caleb Carr's story Killing Time
Jonathan Townsend
 
Posts: 6919
Joined: 01/17/08 01:00 PM
Location: Westchester, NY

Postby Nathan Muir » 01/01/10 07:48 PM

Jonathan Townsend wrote:How many of you have taken a "fake call" app like the one i mentioned earlier this year and used it as the prompt to get this routine rolling?


The answer, of course, is all of us. We've all done that, Jon. All of us.
Nathan Muir
 
Posts: 136
Joined: 06/07/09 01:48 AM


Return to Close-Up Magic