Josh Jay

Discuss the latest news and rumors in the magic world.

Postby David Alexander » 12/17/08 06:56 PM

Brad is spot on - the hosts of a program are there to make the guests look good. Carson was the Gold Standard, but others did a good job as well...Dick Cavet comes to mind...another lover of good magic and an excellent host who was respectful of his guests. Steve Allen had plenty of good magic on his various shows over the years.

A gracious host would NEVER make a rude and childish comment at catching Josh's small error. Kathi's responsibility is to make certain her guests show well.

Unfortunately, her ego is far beyond her fading talent and she has to be the center of attention at all times. Josh was interfereing with that process the moment he produced the bottle.
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Postby Cugel » 12/17/08 07:06 PM

Brad Henderson wrote:
I would think (perhaps naively) that a host would be aware that their job is to make the talent look good (and vice versa)....

[snip]

...the real world is one thing. But this is not the real world. These are all professionals who should be working together to produce a quality product, no?

Brad


I think that is naive in a sense. What you are describing is an older sensibility. It's one I find appealing and wish it would operate. But it doesn't. To expect a TV show host to think that way in the current age is out of step with the zeitgeist. In her mind she's "the star" and in the producers' minds, too. (There are exceptions but they are people of a certain age and class - like Michael Parkinson).

The show would have thought they were doing Josh a huge favor by letting him stand close to their "talent", and that the way she interacted with him is all part of her star power. They would not
have viewed it in the negative way that it has been characterized here. Indeed, they did do him a favor, from a marketing perspective.

This isn't a theater show. It's a modern TV show with all the bad behavior that is expected. (And I still don't think they were in any way bad for real world audience members).

Josh did a great job.
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Postby Jeff Haas » 12/17/08 08:07 PM

The hosts reacted very typically, like a lot of people do in closeup. They know the magician is out to fool them, they regard magic as something for kids, and they're not going to let this magician get the better of them. So it becomes a battle of wits as you go through the trick. You're trying to keep it on track and they're trying to knock it off the rails. You run into this all the time with adults, especially anyone successful and/or in a position of authority (salespeople, senior execs, etc.) You're entering their space, and it would be fun to mess with this guy and his little card tricks.

They also are quick to pick up on anything inconsistent. Kathy established this at the top - "You're supposed to keep the secrets, but you wrote a book?!"

Tricks that have a longer process, like the signature fusion that Josh used, are vulnerable in those conditions. You need fast, short material that doesn't telegraph where it's going. The longer process bores people who are used to chatting quickly and making a lot of jokes.

This seems to be amplified when someone's on TV; you can always sense the host thinking, "Get on with it!" And then they makes jokes or bust the performer's chops so that there is something entertaining happening. (Remember David Roth on Letterman? Same thing.)

If you're going to do closeup, you have to learn to deal with this. Otherwise you'll be eaten alive by some salesperson in front of his buddies - and he won't even work that hard to do it, the bastard.
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Postby Kurt Ruckman » 12/17/08 10:09 PM

Interesting discussion and video clip. All the more so because Josh Jay got busted and called out by Kathy Lee--something that has happened to all of us at one time or another. I understand that she should perhaps have been more polite as her role as TV host is a bit different than that of an ordinary spectator. But isn't it one of our main burdens as magicians to somehow get rid of the "challenge" aspect that is inherent in a fooling art?
It seems to me that Josh did not establish the story or emotional hook that we've all been taught is necessary in turning a trick (to be figured out) into an effect (to be experience). For example, the typical fused card plot (e.g. Doc Eason's version) involves a couple. The magical fusion is the climax of the love story developed along the way. Josh started with an interesting and relevant premise-collecting autographs, but he didn't develop it, and the fusion part wasn't organic to the theme. Obviously part of the problem was the extreme time burden of being on national TV.
Standard disclaimer: I'm not as good a magician as Josh Jay, I'm a fan of Josh Jay, yada yada. I hope this doesn't disqualify me from daring to analyze his performance, and hopefully learning something from it. Josh was exceptionally poised, and he has a real presence and likeability that really shone through the whole segment.
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Postby Jonathan Townsend » 12/17/08 11:04 PM

As usual with a clip - it makes good sense to watch with the sound off and see who's looking at who or what and when.

I'm watching for grimaces, sighs and distracted looks for clues to what happened.
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Postby MaxNY » 12/18/08 12:15 AM

Hey, speaking of cougars...That HBO documentary "Dancing with Tigers" is getting rave reviews in the NY press!
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Postby Mark Paulson » 12/18/08 12:34 AM

David Alexander wrote:Both women are in their mid-40s (or look like it) and Josh is 27...cougars and younger men...
Both of the women behaved like a slightly drunk and frustrated 40-something who is bored with her marriage to a rich, successful husband who is no longer interested in her for very good reasons. I've seen dozens of them in my time doing parties in Beverly Hills and Bel Air.



Actually, Kathy Lee is 55. Hoda is 44. Joshua was lucky to get out of there alive. From what I've seen of her, Kathy Lee always behaves like that.
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Postby David Vamer » 12/18/08 05:57 AM

KL would never have pulled that crap with P&T...but it sure would have been fun to watch her try!
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Postby Cugel » 12/18/08 08:39 AM

Alrightey, then.
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Postby Paul Cress » 12/18/08 11:38 AM

Topic caught my eye so though I would watch the clip under enforced silence.
Bottle production was clumsy, obvious, and handling too contrived, you even see the cork in thumbpalm (well I hope it was the cork?!?), card work was on par. Not impressed.
ps. No axe to grind or hidden agendas here, Ive seen him do a LOT better.
The two 'ladies' didn't help but as a seasoned pro that shouldn't be a problem for him.
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Postby Dave Mithaca » 12/18/08 11:57 AM

Josh did a great job getting the show back on track; however, as an arm chair QB, I wish that he would have used the method that Doc Eason uses of having both cards placed back into the deck for the fusion. Going back to the deck while the supposed signed cards are being held, even if not to do anything tricky, seems to me to be unmotivated and a natural inviting of skepticism. Props to Josh for his well-earned success!
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Postby Joe M. Turner » 12/18/08 02:57 PM

Just to clarify something... In our discussion of the behavior of the hosts on that segment, nobody here has suggested that the only alternative would have been overt cheerleading. Just because some of us thought what we saw from KLG was unnecessary and perhaps a touch unprofessional doesn't imply that we thought she should have been chanting Josh's name. Neither does it suggest we thought it was some unforgivably heinous hosting crime.

Josh did the right thing by not over-reacting. Perhaps we all take that as the best lesson of the event.
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Postby Gary Kosnitzky » 12/18/08 05:40 PM

It was a real treat watching Josh perform, even if it was just a couple of pieces.
I don't think it was that unpredictable on how these 2 ladies behaved. They are talentless and need to be in the spotlight, David Alexander summed it up when he said:

" Both of the women behaved like a slightly drunk and frustrated 40-something who is bored with her marriage to a rich, successful husband who is no longer interested in her for very good reasons. I've seen dozens of them in my time doing parties in Beverly Hills and Bel Air."

Hoda did seem a little shikker.
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Postby Bob Farmer » 12/18/08 05:57 PM

On the point made above that Josh needed a better emotional hook, I would have said this to Kathie Lee:

"If you select the right card from this deck, it will tell you exactly what Frank is doing right now with your personal assistant, Veronica."

That would have shut her up.

One thing that was unclear and should have been to sell the book: were the tricks Josh performed in the book? That would seem to be the hook to sell the book.
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Postby Brad Henderson » 12/18/08 06:48 PM

There are lots of issues to consider here, and KLG is only part of the equation.

First, Joe is right. Cheerleading would come off as fake, and I do not think anyone would suggest that. But there is a difference between being insincere and doing what it takes to work together to produce a succesful show. But as someone pointed out, this isn't a theater troupe, this is TV and the cult of the celebrity.

But I think a little armchair quarterbacking could be beneficial. First, I know Josh and consider him a friend. I also know that he is critical of his own work. So, I see nothing wrong with turning a critical eye to his appearance with the intent of learning from it. While those such as TheDean may confuse criticism with "not getting along" I hope others realize the difference.

The biggest problem I saw was Josh's lack of presence in the moment. It seemed as if he had already worked out what he was going to say and do, and was not willing to LISTEN to the hosts and RESPOND appropriately.

While all performers should have a plan and script, these encounters are about interaction. Josh didn't interact. Occasionally he acknowledged their comments, but he quickly tried to force things back on his own track. You could almost hear him thinking, "Ok, great, but what I was saying was..."

"Magic is like a story." Where did that go? It was forced and out of place. He was rushed. There was something there, but he did not take the time to expound on it. They didn't find it interesting or important, so we have a conversational mishmash with word vomit, not presentation.

When they were introducing him, he was not making ye contact and was not listening. He was playing with the balloon.

He did not acknowledge the post production pat down - a very real moment. "Real" is what people connect to. There was an opportunity here and it was missed.

Likewise, when the first card moment occurred, he should have let it breath. It was stunning. But (and I'm not saying I wouldn't have done the same thing in the moment) he seemed more interested in "getting to the punchline" than allowing this "real" moment to play out.

Now, I do not think this excuses KLG's gaff. But it became clear that there was a power struggle going on. The women had questions, Josh wanted to do tricks.

Would I have done better? Can't say. Hindsight is 20/20 and even more clear when one is looking at someone else's work. In this "magicians helping magicians" [censored] world we have created, people assume that criticism is condemnation. I am not here to condemn Josh, but to learn from him.
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Postby Cugel » 12/18/08 06:54 PM

I think you're over analyzing things. Josh was nervous and who can blame him? Still and all, he did a great job and I seriously doubt ANYONE here would have done any better.
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Postby Brad Henderson » 12/18/08 07:29 PM

Why not over analyze things. You kind of have to if you want to ever learn from an experience.

We have an artifact in the form of a video clip. What made it what it was? Would other choices have impacted what it became?

I think these are fascinating questions and ones we can learn from.

Of course, this "brotherhood" nonsense means that any criticism is considered taboo. But to think that a performance couldn't have been better is equally nonsensical. So I don't think Josh needs defending (and it saddens me that we as a community would feel compelled to need to). Of course he was nervous.

But that doesn't mean we can't evaluate his choices and consider others.

Great actors do it.

Maybe that's why they suck less than we do.

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Postby Jonathan Townsend » 12/18/08 07:41 PM

Over analyze? As if everyone here already knows how to avoid those problems? As if all here know how to handle a situation where one's script delivery has gotten out of sync with their audience?

Okay let's over analyze - how about the way he set down the bottle, should the label have been facing the hosts or the camera?
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Postby Tim Ellis » 12/18/08 07:48 PM

First a message to Josh - your personality was perfect for TV. Full of energy and expression and not too over the top. I think you have a great future an as on camera performer.

Regards to KLG catching Josh do the move... to some extent, dont we as magicians ENCOURAGE this sort of reaction with sucker effects? Perhaps she thought the move was so obvious Josh wanted her to point it out?

Regarding the pat down - I think that was a potentially much funnier moment because what WERE they looking for? The bottle had been produced and they wanted to feel where it COULD have been? Weird spectator logic.. did they think he'd have more in there?

But yes, the two ladies were behaving exactly as spectators in that situation would:

Where did the bottle come from? Must have been from his sleeve or his jacket.

He won't say how he did the trick, but he wrote a book telling the secrets?

The signed card from his hand is now under our hands... is it the same one?

He dropped a card on the deck, better let him know I saw it!


Alternatively, they could have sat politely and let him do his tricks, plug his book, and clap at the right times. But then it would have been the Joshua Jay show.
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Postby Stuart Beck » 12/18/08 07:55 PM

An obervation...if Josh (who I think is terrific by the way) who is promoting a book...would of had had a copy in view throughout the appearance or at least had either himself, Kathy or Hoda hold up the book at the end so the TV audience could get a good look at the cover.
It was only flashed for a second right at the beginning.
Are the tricks he performed from the book? Thinking from a layman's POV...I'd like to have seen a few things from the book and get a glimpse at the cover so I could go to Border's and find it easily you know?

We've all encountered audiences like that...I thought he handled her fine just fine...
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Postby Bob Farmer » 12/18/08 08:54 PM

Back to the book -- here's another idea for future shows:

Josh shows the book and adds an unknown card as a bookmark explaining he's going to do the trick at that page and this way they can find the explanation easily.

He has a card selected and signed -- it vanishes and when they open the book it is the bookmark.
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Postby Bill Duncan » 12/18/08 09:22 PM

Tim, Tim, Tim... Don't you understand that it's a TV hosts job to sit back and be amazed at the close up magician? :)

That's how Johnny did it. That's how Cavett did it. Apparently TV hosts simply don't know their place these days.
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Postby Philemon » 12/18/08 10:14 PM

Both Johnny and Dick were amateur magicians themselves.
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Postby Dustin Stinett » 12/18/08 10:28 PM

Philemon wrote:Both Johnny and Dick were amateur magicians themselves.


While this comment is certainly true, its actually immaterial in this aspect of the discussion. Johnny Carson made all of his guests look good no matter what their vocation or avocation. I didnt watch Cavett enough to be able to say the same, but in what I did see he appeared to have the same quality.

What Brad noted were the reasons Johnny always gave for his demeanor with his guests: It was always about putting on a great show.

Too bad this simple conceptone I think should be timelessseems to be out of favor among todays celebrity talk show hosts.

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Postby David Alexander » 12/18/08 11:12 PM

First of all, given the circumstances, Josh did a fine job. Could he have done better? Yes, of course. Nearly every show can be better and the performer who forgets that has a problem. Every performance is, or should be, a learning experiencean opportunity to learn and grow. You catch your mistakes, analyze, learn and are better prepared for the next time.

The statement that no one on this board could have done better is absurd as there are people here who have been performing professionally longer than Josh has been alive. There are also performers on this board who, because of experience with people like KLG and her cohort, know how to take control immediately and maintain control throughout their performance. The highly experienced performer does not automatically trust the other person to behave as they should. They control them so they behave as the performer needs them to behave. This comes with experience and practice. The Gold Standard in this being John Calvert. Blackstone Sr (and to a lesser extent Junior) was also a master at controlling his audience.

Of course there is always the high probability that people like that would never get on the show because of their strong personalities. The shows producers understand the talent they work with.

I still think Josh was something of a victim with the age disparity, him dressing young and the two older women deciding to get frisky with him. Its not that they were behaving out of character for women like those many of us have encountered at parties, but since they are professional television hosts they should have held their behavior to a higher standard. They werent even remotely gracious. He was just raw meat to be played with, something Im sure the producers who brought him in well understood.

I cannot imagine either of those women behaving the way they did with Jon Stetson or Docc Hilford or any top performer who has a strong presence and more experience. Josh will be fine and this will be just another growing and learning experience in the development of his career.

Kathy, on the other hand, will just be another day older and more frustrated as she goes home to Frank.
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Postby Cugel » 12/19/08 01:06 AM

Brad Henderson wrote:Why not over analyze things. You kind of have to if you want to ever learn from an experience.


Perhaps I should have been clearer. I think you over-complicate or overcook your analysis. Analyze as much as you want, but I think the conclusions to be drawn are far simpler.

Of course, this "brotherhood" nonsense means that any criticism is considered taboo. But to think that a performance couldn't have been better is equally nonsensical. So I don't think Josh needs defending (and it saddens me that we as a community would feel compelled to need to). Of course he was nervous.


You misrepresent me. I'm not opposed to criticism, just over-complication where it's unnecessary or not germane. This thread starts with a psycho-analysis of the "Cougars" that beggars belief. That's an example of someone defending the "brotherhood" because the audience didn't stick to the script.

But that doesn't mean we can't evaluate his choices and consider others.


Of course.

Great actors do it.

Maybe that's why they suck less than we do.


No offense, it's too bad that you "suck". But don't assume we all do.
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Postby Cugel » 12/19/08 01:22 AM

David Alexander wrote:The statement that no one on this board could have done better is absurd as there are people here who have been performing professionally longer than Josh has been alive.


Nonetheless, I don't think there is anyone who has contributed to this thread so far who could have done any better. Considering that several have clearly demonstrated that they find modern TV conditions anathema (the fact that the host is the main talent unless a known celeb appears) would suggest that they would have done far worse. Old fashioned expectations are no match for modern day realities. Deal with it.

I'm not saying Josh's performance couldn't have been better - he was perhaps nervous. But I don't think anyone here would have done any better than Josh under the circumstances.
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Postby Bill Duncan » 12/19/08 01:45 AM

Dustin Stinett wrote:
Philemon wrote:Both Johnny and Dick were amateur magicians themselves.


While this comment is certainly true, its actually immaterial in this aspect of the discussion. Johnny Carson made all of his guests look good no matter what their vocation or avocation. I didnt watch Cavett enough to be able to say the same, but in what I did see he appeared to have the same quality.

What Brad noted were the reasons Johnny always gave for his demeanor with his guests: It was always about putting on a great show.

Too bad this simple conceptone I think should be timelessseems to be out of favor among todays celebrity talk show hosts.

Dustin,
You couldn't be more wrong. Apparently it needs to be said:
Carson often treated magicians differently than other guests.
He treated magicians the way Leno treats stand up comics. As a fan, and a promoter.

There are plenty of times when Carson said or did something that got a laugh at the expense of a guest, or their dignity. I'm sure you can think of a couple if you try hard enough. I know I can.

Even with magicians, he wasn't the darling people make him out to be when things were unscripted. Go back and watch Michael Ammar's appearance on the show, with Ar-nold, and Billy Crystal. Johnny and the others upstaged Ammar, and interrupted his performance, for the sake of laughs. Michael is notably distracted, and his timing is off, yet pro that he is, the performance is one of the great examples of magic on TV because they behave like real spectators, and he deals with it.

Just as Roth did, on Late Night.

It amazes me that people bitch all the time about the disingenuous L&L audiences but are offended when a TV host acts like a real audience member...
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Postby Pepka » 12/19/08 02:23 AM

KLG has to have the worst personality of anyone ever to host a TV show. I didn't even know she was back on TV, and I've never seen that other lady; (I use the term loosely.) I'm a GMA man. Anyway, Josh did a superb job of handling a horrible situation. Had I been caught in that situation, I would have probably looked up at Kathy and said something like, "Sweatshop matron says what?" God only knows what I would have said when the lady grabbed me. Good job Josh.
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Postby Cugel » 12/19/08 02:28 AM

Wow. That'd show them. Those evil... spectators.
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Postby David Vamer » 12/19/08 04:11 AM

Josh biffed the move. He rushed it, and called attention to it AS HE WAS DOING IT. It was a rookie mistake that was egregious enough that even a ditz like KLG caught it.

The bottle production would be a terrific live performance piece, but it was TERRIBLE for TV. A second viewing of the vid, without the need to slow it down, makes the method PAINFULLY obvious. Another rookie mistake, this time in terms of selection of material.

Josh's audience management was simply non-exisitent because HE WASN'T LISTENING. He plowed ahead with his script, even to the point of delivering the "Ebay buyer" joke despite the fact that KLG had just burned the premise. "Magic is a story"?!?! WTH?

Josh is an incredibly well-versed magician. He's an OUTSTANDING advocate for magic, and is clearly ambitious. Unfortunately, at this stage of his development as a performer, he has no business performing magic on live network TV. Who wants to be known to future generations as "The Magician Who Couldn't Fool Kathie Lee Gifford"?
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Postby Joe M. Turner » 12/19/08 06:44 AM

Just for more clarity -- I'm not suggesting they "didn't behave like real spectators" or that they were "evil." I am not "offended" by what they did. I thought it was unnecessary and didn't add to their show or their celebrity status. I thought it was a mild-to-mediocre annoyance, perhaps self-inflicted... but that Josh managed it well enough. No, I didn't think they should bow down and moan/chant his name or erect some Greek columns behind him and crown him with a crown of laurel leaves. I'm not sure why the continuing suggestions that the only alternative to what happened was an exaggeratedly positive, idol-worshiping response.

Those ladies were not "real spectators." Some real spectators act like that, yes, but most "real spectators" are not hosting a national television show with millions watching. I think some of their choices did not add to the success of their show or to their own celebrity status. I thought it made them come across as somewhat petty and a bit irritable... not entertaining, not sweet, not actually interested in anything other than themselves. That may, in fact, be the kind of character that they wish to portray and that their producers may want from them... but it didn't make me want to watch them do the same thing to any other guests.

That is all.
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Postby Dave Shepherd » 12/19/08 06:47 AM

David Vamer wrote:Josh's audience management was simply non-exisitent because HE WASN'T LISTENING. He plowed ahead with his script, even to the point of delivering the "Ebay buyer" joke despite the fact that KLG had just burned the premise. "Magic is a story"?!?! WTH?

I have to agree there. I was kind of surprised at how "tricky" the segment was, with very little actual interaction with the two women.

I realize he was selling a book, which is probably about tricks, but all there was were tricks. It was about the one trick after the other, not about any stories at all. The card fusion, for example, was just about two cards fusing--not about something else, as it is in Anniverary Waltz.

The bottle production was, in fact, screamingly obvious. That was an awful long time to be holding a balloon in front of the open jacket. Naturally the spectators wanted to see inside there.

I'm always glad to see magic on TV, but it's always better when the magic completely dumbfounds the obnoxious hosts (as in Roth on Letterman). That didn't happen here.
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Postby Silly Walter » 12/19/08 08:45 AM

Bill Duncan wrote:It amazes me that people bitch all the time about the disingenuous L&L audiences but are offended when a TV host acts like a real audience member...


I agree. What makes anyone think that Kathy Lee Gifford would have acted any differently if she were a customer at a restaurant or a guest at a party? She may not be a fan of magic because of a bad experience with one in the past? Maybe she doesn't like magic? Who knows.

Also, you are a guest on their show and they pretty much can decide how they want to treat you. I would hope that magicians and other guests would be treated with courtesy and respect but it doesn't always work that way.

I do think Josh handled it well but he is lucky he wasn't on Letterman. He would have been crucified.
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Postby Silly Walter » 12/19/08 08:53 AM

Pepka wrote:Had I been caught in that situation, I would have probably looked up at Kathy and said something like, "Sweatshop matron says what?" God only knows what I would have said when the lady grabbed me. Good job Josh.


I like when people make up fictitious scenarios about what they would do if they were in the same situation. Besides the fact that the line you claim you would crack is embarassingly stupid, most people watching wouldn't even get it (assuming that your segment would air). Of course that is assuming you would have been booked for a show like that to begin with.

And if you did make that joke you would do more harm to magic (and get attacked on boards like this) than good.

Josh did the right thing and handled it well.

Lesson learned - if you didn't like how KLG interacted with the magician, don't do her show when you get booked.
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Postby Jonathan Townsend » 12/19/08 08:58 AM

When performing on a TV show - does one play to the host(s) or the camera? Does the show permit a discussion of such things beforehand?
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Postby Stan Willis » 12/19/08 09:26 AM

I think Joshua Jay did a fantastic job regarding his appearance on National TV and I give him a lot of credit and control especially when continually being flashed by fifty-five(55)year old leg.
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Postby Steve Bryant » 12/19/08 11:12 AM

Take a look at the current (November 2008) installment of Little Egypt Magic (littleegyptmagic.com/magic.html). Barnes and Noble is giving Josh great placement throughout the Midwest.
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Postby David Alexander » 12/19/08 12:21 PM

About no one on this board being able to do better, Ill relate two incidents that happened to me when I was promoting my book some years back. My publishers publicist got a last minute booking on a Washington D.C. radio show with what turned out to be two shock jocks. My media escort and I were able to find them on the car radio as I was driven to the station. I heard two young smart asses who sounded like they were still in junior high school. I was to be on the show for an hour. Lucky me.

After being welcomed to the show the first question thrown at me was Did Gene Roddenberry have herpes? It was a question designed to throw me off my game and rattle me. I smiled and said in a calm voice, No, and thats a nervy question coming from two guys who arent wearing pants.

They laughed and realized they couldnt screw with me and we had a great time after that. They kept me an extra hour.

Then there was the time I was being interview by CNBC for a large documentary on Genes life. Id done quite a bit of consulting with the producer even to the point of arranging an interview with Genes widow, Majel (who died yesterday) at her home. The producer was all light and friendliness until she sat down for the interview. Her first question, asked with a smile, was designed to elicit a negative comment about Rick Berman, then Executive Producer of Star Trek. I smiled back and said, Why does everyone blame Rick Berman for not being Gene Roddenberry? That set her back and the rest of the interview went well.

So, the answer is, there is at least one person on this thread who has had experience with both attack journalists and rude hosts and knows how to handle himself in such situations. There are almost certainly others as well.
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Postby Dustin Stinett » 12/19/08 01:33 PM

I dont want to highjack this thread into a Johnny Carson memorial, but since my knowledge of JC has been challenged thus:

Bill Duncan wrote:Dustin,
You couldn't be more wrong. There are plenty of times when Carson said or did something that got a laugh at the expense of a guest, or their dignity.


All I will say is,

Name one. (Not counting practical jokes he played on friends like Buddy Rich, Ed, Doc, and other celebrities who were in on such thingsagain, all part of the show.)

But before you even try, go back and watch it again and note how he dealt with the aftermath of the joke and how he would turn it back onto himself.

Dustin
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