Fitch/Kohler Hold-out F S here

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Postby zRam » 10/17/08 07:46 PM

Fitch/Kohler Holdout for sale

includes the Coin attachment. all DVD's etc...
priced cheap for a quick sell.
$1950 plus Shipping/Insurance

Ron Ramin
5008 Mill Creek Trl.
Ft. Worth TX. 76179

email at
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Postby Bill Mullins » 10/18/08 11:43 PM

I thought the original lease wouldn't allow you to transfer the holdout/DVD's/permission to use without Kohler's permission. Have you got their permission to transfer?

If they won't approve, does the buyer get his money back?
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 10/18/08 11:57 PM

Have you heard of anyone being prevented from selling? Have you seen any court papers? The lease is probably not legally binding--no court is going to recognize it. It doesn't matter what the lease says, and it doesn't matter if the purchaser signed it. Unless the law recognizes the validity of such a document, it is not legally binding.
And I have a REALLY hard time believing that any such document could be binding.
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Postby Rick Ruhl » 10/19/08 12:46 AM

Looks like these guys represent Bob Fitch and did the licence for the hold out.

Over on the green place, Bob Kohler said this:

"The license can easily be transferred but the original holder of the license is required to get the new holder to sign and send me the license agreement." ... 1&forum=76
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 10/19/08 01:09 AM

I really don't think that holds any legal weight. Once you buy something, you own it. You can sell it or give it away. It belongs to you.

Can anyone point to a single person prosecuted by Bob Kohler for selling his holdout to someone else without having the license transferred? Can you imagine the bad publicity that would create within the magic community?
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Postby Rick Ruhl » 10/19/08 01:34 AM

I had thought it was a lease when I first read about it. (99 year lease), but again, it sounds like you dont have to ask them to sell your lease, just have the buyer sign the NDA.

You and I both know how hard it is to protected I.P. in the online world. God knows how many kids have taken the time to scan your books and put them into pdf's. Same with Harry's books, many dvd's etc. Thank goodness many of us would rather have the printed ones, as you cant take pdf's to the 'library' for furthur study ;).
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Postby Jonathan Townsend » 10/19/08 09:34 AM

Bob put his terms up on his site some time ago and can be reached directly with any questions.

IMHO there is no reason to worry over the sale and transfer of the lease - and I trust the item won't wind up in the masked magician's next tv show.
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Postby Chris Bailey » 10/19/08 11:07 AM

I have a Copper/Silver/Brass for sale but I'm going to need you to sign this document first...
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Postby Jerrine » 10/19/08 11:35 AM

My opinion that there is more honor among thieves than magicians is growing stronger every day.
How much effort does it take to honor the mans wishes?
Those that say it can't be done have a long lineage.
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Postby zRam » 10/19/08 01:32 PM

I contacted Bob before I decided to put it up for sell. He was very helpful, there are no problems with selling it. There have been a couple sold that I am personally aware of, without any difficulties.

It isn't difficult to do here is what Bob wrote, "...No problem. All you need to do to transfer the rights is email me at to let me know who you want to transfer the holdout to with his contact information. I'll send him the agreement. Once he returns the agreement to me the transfer is complete..."

Pretty easy. It's a great product, I just don't wear a coat very often, so my day to day routines don't use it. Since I don't perform professionally either; it is too much work to have two different versions of the same routine; one with the Hold-out and one without. Therefore I'm making it available at a good price.

~Jerrine, no thievery going on here, unless you consider that whoever buys this from me is getting it at a criminally low price.

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Postby zauberernico » 10/03/12 11:00 AM

Dear Ronnie,

I know your wrote that a long time ago and my chances are really small that you still have got the holdout and you still want to sell it.
I would be very interested!
Please write me
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