Google Magic!

Addresses new and interesting links to other sites (not listed on the Genii website) that merit attention.

Postby David Britland » 09/22/05 06:51 AM

Google Print, the new service from search engine wizards Google, looks like being a valuable resource for magicians.

With it you can search for keywords through thousands of online books. And it appears that many of those books are on the topic of magic.

These include the Karl Fulves publications for the public and many of the classics reprinted by Dover Publishing.

You can search for key words thoughout the entire online library or in specific books. So now you'll not only know how many times Erdnase used the word 'shift' but you'll be able to look up the page online. And, best of all, it's free.

Here's the link:

Google Print
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Postby Richard Hatch » 09/22/05 07:19 AM

David, a quick search there on Erdnase turned up your PHANTOMS book. How do you feel about having your work available for free online? I would assume that could hurt any royalties the publisher might be paying you, should someone decide not to purchase the book since they can access it for free. Of course, it might just as easily be argued that they will make a decision to purchase it when it turns up in such a search! I do now that many publishers are trying to stop google from doing this on their copyrighted material.

On a related question, does anyone know the Erdnase reference in T. Jefferson Parker's WHERE SERPENTS LIE? Access via the google search is restricted on that title...
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 09/22/05 08:14 AM

Google is currently embroiled in what will be the first of many lawsuits regarding its blatent copyright infringement.
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Postby Randy DiMarco » 09/22/05 09:35 AM

The publisher has to submit the books used in Google Print through the Google publishers program.

http://print.google.com/googleprint/publisher.html

I don't think copyright will be a problem for this.
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Postby David Britland » 09/22/05 10:19 AM

Hi Richard Hatch

I think the Google Print idea is a great one. As I understand it publishers need to consent to its use unless the book is out of copyright.

There'll need to be a judgement made as to what constitutes 'Fair Use,' a process that I believe enables researchers to benefit from the new technology.

At the moment Google Print clearly (in my untutored opinion) risks breaching copyright and there is currently talk of a class action lawsuit in the States.

At the moment the system is open to misuse and recent judgements involving copyrighted material and online delivery systems suggest that Google might soon find itself in trouble.

On a personal level I'm a great believer in having information as available as possible to those who can make use of it. Phantoms was never written in the belief that it would make huge sums of money.

Of course, if Gazzo catches you reading his book for free, he might have a rather different opinion.


:)
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Postby Steve Hook » 09/22/05 10:37 AM

Originally posted by David Britland:

Of course, if Gazzo catches you reading his book for free, he might have a rather different opinion.

Is there more to see than just the Contents of this book?

[Meaning I don't understand the uproar.]
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Postby Chris Aguilar » 09/22/05 11:58 PM

Originally posted by Steve Hook:

Is there more to see than just the Contents of this book? [/QB]
A while back, I seem to recall a technique that could be used to read a book in pretty much its entirety. Might not work anymore though.

From what I've read, I don't believe books need to be submitted to them in any way for inclusion, but that they are rather just scanning what they can and offering authors the ability to "opt out". But don't take that as fact as my memory could easily be playing me wrong here...
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Postby Bill Mullins » 09/23/05 12:48 AM

Originally posted by Richard Hatch:
On a related question, does anyone know the Erdnase reference in T. Jefferson Parker's WHERE SERPENTS LIE? Access via the google search is restricted on that title...
You can do much of the same type of searching using Amazon.com's "Search Inside the Book" feature. It doesn't show "erdnase" in the book . .

Apparently the reference in Google Print to Erdnase in Parker's book is a mistake. If you search in Amazon for Erdnase, you get a listing in Steve Martin's book _Pure Drivel_. This page is the same page as is blocked in Google Print; Google apparently has gotten the wrong title and cover to the content of Martin's book.
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Postby Curtis Kam » 09/23/05 02:29 PM

Interesting resource. Oddly enough, if you look up Downs' "Art of Magic", it's listed under "Humor". :confused:
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Postby NCMarsh » 09/28/05 07:34 PM

OrlandoCorporateMagician.com Orlando Magician
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Postby Richard Kaufman » 09/28/05 09:55 PM

The author of that piece is, as he admits, in bed with Google.
It stinks to high heaven.
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Postby Pete McCabe » 09/28/05 10:49 PM

Originally posted by Richard Hatch:
David, [...] How do you feel about having your work available for free online? I would assume that could hurt any royalties the publisher might be paying you, should someone decide not to purchase the book since they can access it for free. Of course, it might just as easily be argued that they will make a decision to purchase it when it turns up in such a search!
This is not meant to answer this question definitively, but anyone interested in the economics of making books available for free download should check out Accelerando by Charles Stross. Charles put the entire text of his new novel on the web a couple of weeks before the book was available in stores. There are a few links to related stories on the subject of the impact of online availability on physical sales.


Update:

An interesting thread on this subject on Slashdot .
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Postby Guest » 10/01/05 12:45 PM

Anyone who violates copyright does so at their own peril.

On Friday, I filed 396 claims for a class-action settlement brought against a number of publishers for posting my articles (and others') online and in databases without the writers' consent. This is an $18 million settlement that has already been negotiated, and the money comes directly from the publishers who violated our copyright.

I wrote over 400 articles throughout the '80s and early '90s for a wide array of publications, and our contracts rarely mentioned database rights or online rights; in fact, when the issue of alternative uses of those articles came up, I specifically excluded alternative uses.

When, around 1989 - '95, the Internet became a mass market and newspapers and magazines started seeing that they could make money online, they began posting articles online without going back to renegotiate with writers. Writers protested (including the Authors Guild, cited in another post), but the publications said, "Take us to court."

Well, we did take them to court: The Authors Guild, the American Society of Journalists and Authors (of which I was an officer), the National Writers Union, and others. The publications stalled the case in court for over 10 years, misusing the legal system with their expensive lawyers fighting against our pro bono lawyers.

Then in 2001, we won The Precedent, which was Tasini v. New York Times, et al. The current class-action suit of which I am a part is an outgrowth of the Tasini case.

And happily for me, there will be more settlements because the Internet is chock full of violations. I've heard talk of suing Google, and I believe they will regret their current violations. And I will be laughing all the way to the magic store....
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