Will Mentalism Face Extinction in the next 50 years?

Instead of mentally projecting your mentalism thoughts, type them here.

Postby Guest » 03/17/05 12:08 AM

With the rapid rate of digital technology and microscopic cell phones and microphones, will mentalism become extinct in the next half-century because anyone will be able to send a message from an invisible sender (mouthpiece) to an invisible receiver (earphone)?
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Postby Guest » 03/17/05 02:56 AM

I have a good feeling that someone like Ted Annenman probably had the exact same concerns about what mentalism would be like in 50 years. Might mentalism have to evolve? Yes. Will it become extinct? Probably not. I think that as long as people dream about the idea of being able to reach into someone's brain and extract a thought, mentalism will always have a place. Now, lets say that fifty years from now, they create some machine that monitors our everythoughts. If that happens, mentalism may become extinct. Then again, if they invent a thought reading machine, we'll all have more to worry about then whether or not people clap for our book tests.

Noah Levine
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Postby Jonathan Townsend » 03/17/05 06:54 AM

Extinct... nah... probably more prevalent, but the volunteers may want to wear tinfoil hats
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Postby Guest » 03/26/05 10:45 AM

No worries. The pseudo-sciences are still safe; astrology, feng shui, Bigfoot hunting, mind reading...

Mp
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Postby Guest » 04/02/05 09:41 PM

Originally posted by Mississippi Pete:
No worries. The pseudo-sciences are still safe; astrology, feng shui, Bigfoot hunting, mind reading...

Mp
Not true... the last Bigfoot sighting in the Red Woods claimed he was hanging hexegon mirrors and using a GPS system to make certain they were properly aligned. :D
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Postby Guest » 04/03/05 04:26 PM

Unhappily BAD mentalism will never go away...ever!

And as far as electronics in common and public use is concerned as to exposing our more secretive uses of the technologies -- Peter Poppov is still preaching and showmanship can cover many sins. We do not need to make electronic acts look like a bad code act, do we. We need to turn second site into a puzzle of how do we?

Billet reading, psychometry, prediction, even ghost hunting -- all fly in the face of modern technology because of man's search for the opposite of Occam's Razor -- the more unbelievable and complicated by pseudo science the more accepted.

Will technology keep up with our needs for concelement is more of a question. Can an electronic impression board be made thin enough to pass muster? Or will John Riggs have to keep running his routers ?
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Postby Guest » 04/03/05 09:24 PM

That is an interesting question that would only concern intellectual life.

Walk through some stores. I especially invite you to survey hunting and fishing departments, the cosmetic section, health and beauty aids, and gym and expercise equipment. Then watch some contrived "reality shows", TV sports (especially wrestling), "special interests" talk shows, and public education and social programs.

What makes you think that reality has a chance? Americans are in the fantasy business big time!

Bob
Magic By Sander
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Postby mago » 04/04/05 10:36 AM

I cannot say what others in the Unite States will do in this regard in the coming years.

I can state from my many years at the Rincon Gaucho Supper Club in Mexico City, that people love it and Usually believe in it.

My ex-boss Wolf Ruvinskii, used a Very old system that he had taught his assistant for some years.

Along came I and taught his son how to use a wireless transmitter and ear piece that enabled him to do wonders.

Even with this electronic act assistance, the people still loved and believed in the old sytem/code.

I feel that people of all nations want to believe.

Look at how some of the evangelists are doing in using some of our techniques.

Go forth and amaze.

Tom Wolf
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Postby Guest » 04/06/05 05:42 AM

What's that old saying "The magic of today will be the science of tomarrow???"

As technology evolves so too will our side of the fence and how we use things. It's been that way for untold generations. Magicians are, by nature, gadget freaks and tinkerers... we love to find out new ways of making older ideas work (and some of those older ideas are superior to their 21st century "up-grades" in my opinion.)

I remember the first time I got to work the Thurston Sawing with Kirkham... now I'd done the Thin Model for years and here I was looking at this huge, very heavy cabinet. Yet, the more I got to play with it and then, the more I studied the audience's reaction to it, the more I learned to love it. In so many ways, that big clunky box is superior to our nice thin and deceptive looking arsenals of today... it's "Romantic" I guess you could say.

By the same token, the old Talking Tea Kettle idea has taken a whole new mode of life in recent years thanks to the micro-size of electronics and our not needing to depend upon the old coil induction systems. But, because this is known, I feel that we are better off when it comes to the deception, to use the old ways... let the lay-skeptic take the device apart and inspect every bit of it (but the lid of course... but you can switch that out)... Chances are strong he/she will never think about the old induction techniques given that they are at least 30-40 years out of date. Today's gadget freaks will be looking for contemporary technology and nothing other. So, as Lao Tzu said long ago... we use our opponents energy against him... :whack:

Sure, some folks may get wise to things like encoded shims and of course two-way radio systems (which I think Hollywood has tipped a few dozen times via movies & tv and yet, people are still fooled!)

Human beings has an innate need to believe in the miraculous. Until the Cynics of the world have managed to completely obliterrate our sense of belief in God or anything surreal, I think our side of the craft will remain intact and very much a part of the world. Granted, we will still go through those cyclic periods of popularity just like everything has done for untold centuries, but that's just life :cool:
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Postby Spellbinder » 04/27/05 02:22 PM

Professor Spellbinder (http://www.magicnook.com) addresses this topic in an article in The Wizards' Journal #3. The specific article is called Rhine Outdone, and while the methods he uses are in every mentalist's repertoire, he turns the tables on the unbelievers in the audience by getting them to read one another's minds. They may suspect the mentalist and his staff, but if they pull me out of the audience and I KNOW I'm not wired or anything, yet I still seem to be able to read someone's mind... then the magic is still there and we don't have to worry about that kind of thing ever going extinct.
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Postby Guest » 07/18/05 08:24 AM

Yes !

If indivuales Like Blaine, Nu, Maven amoung others
continue to 'Beat it into the ground' Along with Anyone out there that has ever purchased a T.Transmitter.


Less is More Guys.
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Postby Brian Marks » 07/18/05 08:50 AM

Originally posted by michaeleemagic:
Yes !

If indivuales Like Blaine, Nu, Maven amoung others
continue to 'Beat it into the ground' Along with Anyone out there that has ever purchased a T.Transmitter.


Less is More Guys.
How are Blaine, Nu and Maven beatingit into the ground?

there will ne more advanced technology that will help us out. Nothing is wrong with the old. T knowledge that theses thins exist have been widely known but not widely understood.
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Postby Guest » 07/20/05 04:10 PM

It is very clear to me that mentalism will only dissapear during the next century if the population of the world was required to wear tin or aluminum foil shields over their craniumsto protect them from our probings.
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Postby Guest » 07/28/05 05:45 AM

Originally posted by Brian Marks:
Originally posted by michaeleemagic:
[b] Yes !

If indivuales Like Blaine, Nu, Maven amoung others
continue to 'Beat it into the ground' Along with Anyone out there that has ever purchased a T.Transmitter.


Less is More Guys.
How are Blaine, Nu and Maven beatingit into the ground?

there will ne more advanced technology that will help us out. Nothing is wrong with the old. T knowledge that theses thins exist have been widely known but not widely understood. [/b]
I've seen this same post elsewhere, on similar topics. I have the feeling this is one of "those" individuals that suffers from delusional superiority to all.

Sure, there's things about each of those personalities that could be seen as a "negative"... If it weren't for Max I fear that Mentalism would be stuck in the age of Larsen and Dunninger. He added significant production value to Mentalism as well as new ways of thinking. Alain sadly, is the victim of ignorance from within the production team of his TV spots. Anyone that's seen him work KNOWS the video footage is not representative to his work, talent or personability.

Blaine?

Well, on the up-side he is the one responsible for the paradigm shift within the industry; his first special proved that you don't need $20,000.00 props to get on Tv and wow the public. On the other hand, David's "eccentric" attitudes are a bit of a detrement and not something that has helped our craft. Sadly, there are many negatives surrounding this individual and only one big plus -- the infusion of creativity his early specials gave us and the "introduction" to the Bizarre & Psychic Entertainment side of things.

The harsh reality is, all three of these performers have managed to get air time upon more than one ocassion... I doubt that our poster has managed as much, let alone work as regularly at the kind of rates any one of these three see on a regular basis.
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Postby Tabman » 07/28/05 02:56 PM

Craig Browning said: What's that old saying "The magic of today will be the science of tomarrow???"
These days its more like the opposite.

Say, I see you live in western Mass!! I lived across the river in Amherst from 1975 to late 1979. I made close-up pads for Crescent Moon Magic, played in a band and did music workshops at UMass.

That's when the Asparagas Valley Cultural Society was in the Pioneer Valley.

Is the Amazing Hawthornie still around? I bought a giant Lop-eared rabbit from him in 1977. Best rabbitt I ever had.

-=tabman
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Postby Guest » 07/29/05 07:43 AM

None of that rings a bell with me... I'm in Northampton -- Hippieville or as it has become known, mecca of the Fem-Nazis... (Hell on earth for any kind of male creature; gay, straight or even quadped and fury...)

I've heard of another magician in the area that does kiddie shows, but aside from that there's just myself, a handful of retired guys, Rich Viano in Long Medow and his associate Guy Savoy...

Of course, being on the "beaten path" means we do fequently luncheons with key players passing through the bergs... in fact, Stetson and I are supposed to do tea with Brad Henderson sometime soon :D But then we're heading over to the other side of the state on the 30th of August to catch Rick Maue's Seance (The BOSS) all going well... maybe we'll see you there!?
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Postby Tabman » 07/29/05 01:13 PM

Roger that, I used to work The Iron Horse in Northampton. Dont know if its still there or not a that was 30 years ago. Asparagus Valley had those two guys, whats their names??? Penn and Teller in it. They did a of town fairs and gigs like that. You know its the Happy Valley anyway.

A big day for me was finding myself on a trip into Boston and making a couple of hours to visit Hank Lee's Magic Factory on Lincoln Street. I once ran into Phil GOldstein, looking a lot like a young Max Maven, standing in the doorway to the staircase that went up to the shop. It was early winter and it was raining. He was heading out into the street and I was going upstairs.

I don't know if Hank is still at that location but you knew you were in a magic shop. Great shop, Hank.

DO you ever make it over to Hank's shop??? And Ray Goulet's place, I can't recall the name right now. Ahh, Magic Arts Studio.

There's nothing like that for miles around here. I'd open one but I am already broke.

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Postby Guest » 07/29/05 08:58 PM

Yep... the old Iron Horse (now a major entertainment company... multiple locations) owns about a third of the town these days. Those brat magicians you mentioned... think I've heard of them???

Been to Hanks once a couple of years ago with Andy Levis but I rarely head over to that side of the state (I tend to be pretty much home bound most of the time due to health issues.)

Well, we'd better get back to the magic talk and not frighten folks with tales about New England.
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Postby Guest » 07/30/05 09:47 PM

I welcome technology into mentalism because most peopl don't suspect it and think your using either other methods or genuine psychic powers.

I say it all depends on how you present it.

I love the omega act and have fooled plenty of people with it and yet no one suspects technology.

You can perform miracles with the recent technology of mentalism.
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Postby Bill Palmer » 08/30/05 07:30 PM

Yep! Nobody suspects that you aren't hard of hearing when they see the earpiece.
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Postby Bill Palmer » 09/01/05 04:35 PM

BTW, mentalism definitely will be dead in 50 years. No doubt about it.

In order to preserve the heritage of mentalism, I have decided to open up a second on-line museum. It will be called the mentalismmuseum.com and will be hosted at the same server as the cups and balls museum.

Since you won't be needing those props any more, just send them to me for the museum.

;)
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Postby Guest » 09/01/05 07:06 PM

Bill,

I think it's neat that you can predict the extinction of mental magic!

(I didn't believe that the "one behind" method would work.)

Lucy has three live unicorns. They cost a fortune to keep up. Can we send them to you now too? Since the oldest is three, they should make it twenty-five more years, no sweat. You'll need a barn, a horse trailer and at least an acre a piece for them! You do have a trainer and a vet on board?

Take care.

Bob and Lucy Sanders
Magic By Sander
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Postby Bill Palmer » 09/01/05 09:51 PM

Bob, what can I say? I'm a mentalist. I can predict these things.

These unicorns, are they equine or caprine unicorns?

On a heavier note, if Bato thinks that all there is to mentalism is two way transmission, then he really needs to study the literature.

The kind of act he is referring to has been around since the first "swami in a turban" who was walking around on a carpet, using an induction system, and the first talking teakettle. But there is much more to mentalism, than that kind of act.
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Postby Guest » 09/01/05 11:59 PM

The old Talking Tea Kettle...

That's one of the greatest bits I think I've ever had the pleasure of playing with. I'll never forget the first time Kirkham showed it to me.. I damn near threw it out the window when that cold rhaspy voice whispered out from the spout... creepy! (but then, I like that kind of thing...)

There are things about technology that I absolutely love... then again, I tend to be a gadget freak and pack rat (reformed to a great level in recent years, fortunately). At the same time I just can't bring myself to trust it 100%, I want to KNOW that things are going to happen when I need them to... it's an odd dichotomy.

I think I have a deeper appreciation however, for the older forms of technology. Prior to 1950 you will find some very innovative thinking that even now seems rather "space aged"... one of my favorite examples of this is the BROADCASTING OF A LADY illusion; it's hard to believe that idea was developed nearly a century ago and how well it works, even in today's market.

I'm in the process of exploiting some of today's technology in a couple of devices I'm working on for my Seance shows, including the revival of an old Rapping table idea... I simply love the old way it was done but we're adding some more up-to-date concepts to it as well.

:sleep: It's late and I'm rambling... catch y'all later!
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Postby Guest » 09/02/05 06:10 PM

No, I don't think that mentalism is just the two-person telepathy act type, Mr. Palmer; I'm saying that the completely invisible and silent transmission of information is becoming more and more possible with digital technology; this is going to pose an increasingly bigger problem for mentalists in the future.

Just look at that marketed clipboard that can transmit a picture that a spectator draws to a receiving screen like a wireless fax machine.

That's a problem.
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Postby Guest » 09/03/05 07:10 PM

I heard the other day that the world only has about a 30 year supply of oil. This would be very troubling except for one fact: I can recall being told 30 years ago that the world only had a 30 year supply of oil.

I guess they must be finding some more.

In the same way, I'm not going to worry about the future of mentalism. If there was ever a subject about which we are doomed to something less than a full understanding it would be the subject of the human mind.

I think our grandchildren will be as puzzled as we are about mental mysteries, and will find them just as interesting and compelling as we do.
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Postby Guest » 09/04/05 07:11 PM

Ed,

It does seem like they would stop making thumb tips, rope, silks, playing cards etc. if they believed that. I can also remember when Linking Ring hit 7000 circulation and saw the beginning of the end. The Magic Cafe just hit 21,000 members and like Genii, it just keeps growing. For this type we are only reaching magicians who have and are willing to use computers to exchange information about magic. That is not a shrinking number.

This week I was making final schedule arrangements for Lucy and me to spend a little over a week in New York. My telephone contact up there asked if I knew a source of magicians' wax!

Extinction seems a ways off to me.

BTW, they are looking at the oil on the Wyoming ranch again this month. It has finally become financially significant. There's never been any question about its availability. There was no hurry as long as imports came first. It's cheaper to ship oil by water than land.

The real threat to mental magic is running out of minds!

Bob Sanders
Magic By Sander
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Postby Terrence » 09/04/05 08:27 PM

Bato - I agree on invisible and silent transmission of messages is coming.

There have already been demonstrations of devices that allow the mental manipulation of an electronic cursor. We already have a transmission medium - WiFi.

As a SWAG I would think 5 years for one-way, then 10 to 20 for two-way.

If that does happen then telepathy becomes reality .
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Postby Brian Marks » 09/04/05 09:24 PM

I predict the 2 person will somehow change and survive.
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Postby Doug Dyment » 09/05/05 09:30 AM

The Evasons, currently the top two-person mentalism act, have already evolved far beyond this. Anyone who has seen their act will know that "invisible communication device" is a useful explanation for very little of what they do in performance.

... Doug
... Doug :: Proprietor of The Deceptionary
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Postby Guest » 09/05/05 08:45 PM

Originally posted by Doug Dyment:
The Evasons, currently the top two-person mentalism act, have already evolved far beyond this. Anyone who has seen their act will know that "invisible communication device" is a useful explanation for very little of what they do in performance.

... Doug
That's an understatement!

They're awesome!

The Magic Cafe just hit 21,000 members and like Genii, it just keeps growing.
Unlike Genii, the majority of its members are 14 year olds... I've always preferred QUALITY over Quantity
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Postby Bill Palmer » 09/24/05 02:05 PM

The Evasons are very special people. I had seen them on television a few times, but really appreciated their artistry when I saw them in Las Vegas. They make it look real.

Who cares how they do it? Not me.

I'll let you in on a secret though. Part of it involves practice and rehearsal. This is a pair of concepts that will improve most acts more than almost anything else around.
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Postby Guest » 01/17/06 09:22 PM

Even if you had a device which would translate others thoughs into an eatpiece your average Joe Blogs would not know about this magic technology and would therefore still be completely bewildered as to how you know almost everything about him.
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