Maven & Gilbreath Principle

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Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Guest » February 26th, 2003, 7:16 pm

When is Max Maven going to publish this book?

Any info

thanks

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Richard Kaufman » February 26th, 2003, 7:46 pm

Even the publisher, Stephen Minch, does not yet know when the manuscript will be delivered. I'm sure you'll see ads for it when publication draws near.
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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Philemon » February 27th, 2003, 9:45 am

Isn't this "REDIVIDER?"

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Chris Aguilar » February 27th, 2003, 10:07 am

Originally posted by Philemon:
Isn't this "REDIVIDER?"
No, Redivider is based on the "Stay Stack" principal. It's the palindrome concept that is used, not Gilbreath.

For $15, Redivider is a damn fine investment that makes for some really fun reading. :)

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Mark Tams » February 28th, 2003, 6:56 am

What is the Palindrome Concept?

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Lance Pierce » February 28th, 2003, 7:14 am

Originally posted by Mark Tams:
What is the Palindrome Concept?
If you think of a Stay Stack arrangement, you pretty much have it. The stack is comprised of a mirrored arrangement of cards, where the first card is paired with the last card, the next to the first with the next to the last, and so on. Hence, the palindrome. As is typical of Phil, his explorations into what this principle has to offer are highly intriguing. In the effects and ideas here (dealing overall with packets of cards), some work with an arrangement of cards that are palindromic by value (where a black ace, for instance, is mirrored by another black ace), and others by position (where each palindromic pair totals a specific number). Several of the effects, particularly the last one in the book, are very strong.

It's a book worth getting, and Mr. Goldstein writes with a very friendly and appealing style. His humor is warm, and the entire booklet is a reading experience that's both pleasing and very educational (in more ways that oneor twoor six).

Andit's only $15. What a deal!

Cheers,

Lance :)

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Mark Tams » February 28th, 2003, 7:56 am

Thanks so much Lance! Much appreciated! :) :)

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Guest » March 2nd, 2003, 11:12 pm

At Max's lecture in Helsinki he told us that the book will appear in (the beginning of?) 2004!

/Goran

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Guest » March 3rd, 2003, 10:01 am

The book should be, without a doubt, a work of "terrifying beauty".

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Guest » March 6th, 2003, 12:31 am

Originally posted by wert:
Originally posted by Philemon:
[b]Isn't this "REDIVIDER?"
No, Redivider is based on the "Stay Stack" principal. It's the palindrome concept that is used, not Gilbreath.

For $15, Redivider is a damn fine investment that makes for some really fun reading. :) [/b]
Also on the cover of REDIVIDER you can read in small letters; (No, not that principle, but a good one nonetheless.)

/Goran

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Carl Mercurio » March 17th, 2003, 1:51 pm

There's some nice stay stack work in The Complete Walton using Faros...

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby sjrwheeler » December 16th, 2011, 4:06 pm

Hello,

did i miss this? or is this something thats still being made?

i'm fairly new to gilbreath but totally captivated by it.

thanks,

Sam

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Richard Kaufman » December 16th, 2011, 5:18 pm

No update about the publication of this book as far as I know.
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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Jonathan Pendragon » December 19th, 2011, 4:47 am

Who is Phil?

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Andres Reynoso » December 19th, 2011, 11:11 am

Phil Goldstein. Maven published Redivider with that name.
Andres Reynoso

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Dustin Stinett » December 19th, 2011, 12:07 pm

Im going to throw caution to the wind and guess that Jonathan was cracking wise since he knows that Max has not answered to Phil in the many decades he has known him.

I believe that it was with the republication of the Color Series under the title Prism (Hermetic Press, 2005) that Max stopped using Phil Goldstein on his (many) published works.

Dustin

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Jonathan Pendragon » December 19th, 2011, 3:13 pm

You are a wise man.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby El Harvey Oswald » December 20th, 2011, 2:37 am

Who is Max Maven?

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Andres Reynoso » December 20th, 2011, 12:43 pm

I suspected that. Was so 'extrange' Jonathan asked it :P
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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Curtis Kam » December 20th, 2011, 5:47 pm

Just wanted to mention, until the Maven work is out, there's a very interesting essay on this principle (unifying the "two" principles) in Woody Aragon's "A Book in English".

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Richard Hatch » December 21st, 2011, 12:24 am

Curtis Kam wrote:Just wanted to mention, until the Maven work is out, there's a very interesting essay on this principle (unifying the "two" principles) in Woody Aragon's "A Book in English".

There is also a nice chapter on it in Persi Diaconis' new book, Magical Mathematics, which includes his sleight-free handling of Herb Zarrow and Ron Wohl's U-Shuffle Poker. He also proves an "Ultimate Gilbreath Principle" and points out a connection between the Gilbreath Principles and the Mandelbrot set. Great book!

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Mike Remington » December 21st, 2011, 5:06 am

Dustin Stinett wrote:I believe that it was with the republication of the Color Series under the title Prism (Hermetic Press, 2005) that Max stopped using Phil Goldstein on his (many) published works.


In the 1980's, at a time when I had not yet discovered Max's writing, I was in Magicland in Tokyo when a striking looking Westerner walked in speaking Japanese. I looked at the pictures on the wall above him and assumed this must be someone named Max Maven until I looked at the side wall and saw a very similar picture with the name Phil Goldstein on it. I was not sure which of the two people this was until I heard some of the young guys in the shop commenting on the strange conversation where Max-san was speaking Japanese and Siyoshi(?) was speaking English. Then I knew. Of course, in South-East Asia, where some people copy everything, I have seen the same striking look on Asians.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Jonathan Pendragon » December 21st, 2011, 5:20 am

There is also a whole chapter on the subject in Magical Mathematics.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Jonathan Pendragon » December 21st, 2011, 11:08 am

Sorry Richard, I missed your post. West and I went to Joan Lawton's Christmas dinner, so I was befuddled by food.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Atlas » September 6th, 2012, 9:29 pm

I like Redivider, it sounds as though this book has been shelved?

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Richard Kaufman » September 6th, 2012, 10:39 pm

I believe that it will now be published by H&R, who are working with Norman Gilbreath.
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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Don Hendrix » September 6th, 2012, 11:15 pm

This year, I have talked with Norman and with Charlie Randall, and Norman's book is being edited and should be published by H and R by the end of the year.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Atlas » September 7th, 2012, 2:01 am

Great news! I look forward to reading it!

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Ted M » September 7th, 2012, 9:18 am

To what extent is Max involved?

Or is Max's long-anticipated opus on the Gilbreath Principle a different book from Norman's book?

(Whatever the configuration of authors, this is exciting news.)

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby El Harvey Oswald » September 7th, 2012, 9:48 am

I believe that Norman Gilbreath's book will in fact be out this year, or early next year.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Joe Mckay » February 5th, 2017, 6:03 pm

So apparently the Max Maven book is not happening.

Shame.

I have spent a lot of time playing with this principle over the years. Here are some nice ideas for those who have an interest in this area.

1) Martin Gardner idea. Have a deck of 52 playing cards. And another deck of 52 playing cards (this deck is in reverse order to the first deck). Riffle shuffle the two decks together (you are left with a deck of 104 cards). And cut exactly in half. You will be left with two decks of 52 different cards. I think there is something very elegant about this idea - but I am not sure how to turn it into a trick.

2) Check out GAME LAW in the second volume of 'The Complete Walton' – This is very interesting. It is the only trick using the Gilbreath Principle I have seen where the spectator can give the deck two riffle shuffles.

3) Colm Mulcahy is an excellent writer on mathematical magic. He is a superb inventor as well. Here he covers a new twist to the Gilbreath principle that Leo Boudreau came up with. It is called The Bligreath Principle:

http://www.maa.org/external_archive/columns/colm/cardcolm200908.html

4) Take a deck of cards and order them in red/black order:

RED/BLACK/RED/BLACK… etc.

You then take the top card (a RED card) and insert the card anywhere into the deck. A nice way of doing this is to spread the cards face-down on the table and have the spectator insert the FACE UP red card anywhere they want.

You then tell the spectator you will deal off a pair of cards at a time. If the FACE UP red card in the pair is with another red card. He wins. If it is with a black card – you win. Thanks to Mr Gilbreath you will always win this bet.

5) A nice idea (not mine) to set up for Gilbreath effects is the following:

1) Have a deck shuffled - or use a borrowed shuffled deck.

2) Run through the cards and say that you need to remove some cards at random.

3) As you go through the cards, you throw out all the red and black cards which interrupt the red/black pattern running through the deck. So - you are basically throwing out the cards which are not already in red/black order.

4) You will be left with a pile of cards - face up on the table. They will be in a mixed up order and this helps make everything seem fair.

5) The pile that is left in your hands is now (secretly) in red/black/red/black/red/black/red/black etc order.

6) Check out SPLITTING THE DIFFERENCE - it is an application of the Gilbreath Principle to a clever OUT OF THIS WORLD variation by
John Kennedy. It is in the MAY 2005 issue of GENII magazine.

7) Peter Duffie had an unusual Gilbreath effect which he used to give away free on his site. It was called EMIT.

It is a 'Backwards in Time' packet card effect:

1) You have a packet of 20 cards (just ordinary number cards) in RED/BLACK/RED/BLACK etc order. You show the spectator the cards in RED/BLACK/RED/BLACK order. You tell them this is the starting position.

2) You show 4 Aces on top of the packet - and now use a switch-out (such as the Braue Addition?) to switch the 4 Aces for 4 cards in
RED/BLACK/RED/BLACK order.

3) You now insert the 4 RED/BLACK/RED/BLACK (which the spectator believes are Aces) into the packet of cards - making sure the 4 card are well spaced out in the packet.

4) You click your fingers - and say this causes the cards to go back in time a few seconds.

5) Now - show the 4 Aces on top of the packet.

6) Then deal off the cards in the rest of the packet - two cards at a time.

7) Doing so will show pairs of cards in RED/BLACK order (or occasionally BLACK/RED) order. This gives the strong impression that the rest of the cards in the packet are still in RED/BLACK/RED/BLACK order.

Hence the cards have successfully gone back in time!

8) Justin Branch has a rare manuscript detailing a riffle shuffle principle he discovered. I no longer have the manuscript. But I do have a copy of an advert for it I once saved:

'POKER PREDICTION—A PRINCIPLE & ITS PRACTICALITIES' by Justin Branch (Author's publication; £2 or $4 ($5 air mail)).

This manuscript comprises six A4 size typewritten pages with backing and tinted translucent cover. Three pages expound the initial theory based on a 6 sequence riffle stack, an expansion of a J. G Thompson idea in a Karl Fulves book. Page 4 comprises 'Ultimate Six Card Prediction,' a no skill effect, where a spectator shuffles the 24-card pack and deals 4 special poker hands. One hand is selected, two cards discarded in a pocket and the remaining 4-card hand is as predicted. In addition, the performer may name the two pocketed cards. An extra page is included for those who want to delve deeper.

9) Check out Stewart James's rediscovery of the Gilbreath Principle. See 'Package Deal' on page 1089 of Book Two of The James File.

10) BOCCA DELLA VERITA – Book Two - The James File - Page 2410 – This is an amazing principle. It seems to my brain to be a kind of ‘inversion’ of The Gilbreath Principle. It is incredible that Stewart managed to discover this all the way back in 1928…

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Jack Shalom » February 5th, 2017, 7:06 pm

2) Check out GAME LAW in the second volume of 'The Complete Walton' – This is very interesting. It is the only trick using the Gilbreath Principle I have seen where the spectator can give the deck two riffle shuffles.


Coincidentally, I just came across Steve Beam's "Done Deal" (S-A #3) today, and it, too, allows for two riffles.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Joe Mckay » February 5th, 2017, 7:19 pm

Interesting!

Thanks for that, Jack.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Joe Mckay » February 5th, 2017, 7:53 pm

Also - it is interesting to note that a precursor to the Gilbreath principle appears in Rusduck's 'The Cardiste' magazine:

http://archive.denisbehr.de/show.php?book=631&highlight=35411

Karl Fulves in his booklet called 'Origins' details his early unpublished ideas which were also a precursor to the Gilbreath principle.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Bill Mullins » February 6th, 2017, 12:54 pm

Joe Mckay wrote:4) Take a deck of cards and order them in red/black order:

RED/BLACK/RED/BLACK… etc.

You then take the top card (a RED card) and insert the card anywhere into the deck. A nice way of doing this is to spread the cards face-down on the table and have the spectator insert the FACE UP red card anywhere they want.

You then tell the spectator you will deal off a pair of cards at a time. If the FACE UP red card in the pair is with another red card. He wins. If it is with a black card – you win. Thanks to Mr Gilbreath you will always win this bet.


Published by Roberto Giobbi in his column in Genii Oct 2007.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Joe Mckay » February 6th, 2017, 2:27 pm

This is the Omega Bet.

Originally a Karl Fulves idea. But then Bob Wagner varied it and made it popular.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Q. Kumber » February 6th, 2017, 2:46 pm

In his Master Notebook, Bob Wagner published as his own a full trick of Brian Glover's, taken word for word from its original publication in Abra.

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Max Maven » February 6th, 2017, 4:12 pm

Joe McCay writes: "So apparently the Max Maven book is not happening."

On what do you base this statement?

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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby Richard Kaufman » February 6th, 2017, 4:18 pm

On what I wrote earlier in this thread, so you can blame me.
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Re: Maven & Gilbreath Principle

Postby PickaCard » February 6th, 2017, 4:26 pm

Not this thread, the Unicorn Magic Book thread.


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