Impromptu Mental Epic

Instead of mentally projecting your mentalism thoughts, type them here.

Postby Chris Bailey » 04/10/03 08:13 AM

Does anybody have any suggestions for a good impromptu Mental Epic. I think I read a routine somewhere that used crumpled Post-It notes.
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Postby Charles Spector » 04/10/03 08:53 AM

Check-out "Mind, Myth & Magick" by T.A. Waters. I won't tell you where it is because I think it would be well worth searching through this book.

Charles Spector
PS It uses a small spiral note pad.
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Postby Steve Bryant » 04/10/03 09:59 AM

Check out Docc Hilford's "The Richey Technique Revealed." It uses 3 ungimmicked pieces of paper and 3 ungimmicked envelopes. See Little Egypt Magic last October for further details.
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Postby Guest » 04/10/03 11:12 AM

Dick Osterlind has the very best routine using nothing but a spiral bound steno note pad. You will find it in his latest booklet "The very modern Mindreader" available from Dick at http://www.osterlindmysteries.com/
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Postby Bill Cushman » 04/10/03 01:44 PM

Re: Richard Osterlind's StenoEsp: I like the bonus routine he includes at the end with spiral bound index cards even better, though it does require about two seconds of preparation. I've made a couple of changes I want to share with Richard (both in the set up and the routine)that I think take it to new heights, both simplifying the handling and creating a more logical progression. Whichever version you use, Richard deserves major kudos for creating and sharing these ideas.
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Postby Guest » 04/11/03 01:50 AM

Originally posted by Charles Spector:
[QB]Check-out "Mind, Myth & Magick" by T.A. Waters. I won't tell you where it is because I think it would be well worth searching through this book.QB]
Oh Charles, you are so cruel.

MM & M is an awesome book, but the organization of that book is perversely opaque. All of the chapter heads are written with arcane and impenetrable titles. Furthermore, none of the tricks themselves have descriptive names. It's like reading Iraqi!

Sure it's great to stumble onto hidden treasures, but to steep an entire book in obscurity is just so twisted.
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Postby Guest » 04/11/03 07:28 AM

Though it's not exactly "impromptu" I'll also suggest looking at Bob Cassidy's Mentalism CD and his take on both, the 3-Envelope Predition routine (on video) and his slant for "4th DEMENSIONAL TELEPATHY"

The Richie Technique is awesome, by the way!
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Postby Mike Porstmann » 04/15/03 01:46 AM

From the very first day he taught it to me (and that's many years now) I use a method that Roy Johnson also described in one of his books (can't tell you as I am not at home right now).

It uses only three business cards (I use double blank playing cards for easier handling) and six double push offs or double lifts.

Look it up: it's great, clean and uses unprepared items!
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Postby Charles Spector » 04/15/03 09:05 AM

Okay David,

Triposte, page 59.
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Postby Peter Vanspauwen » 04/15/03 10:38 AM

Another impromptu version can be found in the July 2002 issue of our own Genii ;)
On page 64 we have Phil Goldstein's "Caffeinomenon".
With only a coffee mug, a pad of paper, a pencil and a coffee theme for the predictions, this one can hardly be made more impromptu. If th HPC move with a piece of paper doesn't scare you off, this is a good trick for the real world.

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Postby Guest » 04/15/03 12:22 PM

This may sound like a shameless p;ug but the late Jack Dean had several "takes" on this theme and those effectsare still available from AB Stagecraft.
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Postby Guest » 04/17/03 05:53 AM

Originally posted by Chris Bailey:
Does anybody have any suggestions for a good impromptu Mental Epic. I think I read a routine somewhere that used crumpled Post-It notes.
Silly me... I missed this when I went through this thread previously...

Here's the bit... First, you gain the assist of two people that are willing to assist in an experiment in Telepathy. One is sent out of the the room, the other remains with you... Next you remove one single post it slip from the pad, place a dot in the center of it and ask Spect. #1 to neatly print a word, draw a simple geometric shape, etc. (it really can be anything simple they want to chose.) NOTE: They whisper this "thing" in your ear and you say "Fine" (demonstrate using the pad in your hand along with your own index finger as the pencil) "I want you to fill the entire page like this with that thought..."

Once done, Spect. #1 is told to crumple the slip into a ball with the writing to the inside and place it into his/her pocket. Once done, they take their seat and #2 is brought back to the room and your side.

You now explain (kindof) what just took place... as I hand them their single slip of post-it paper I bring intentional reference to those "Hologram" posters -- the one's you stare at and get a 3-D image from -- explaining that sometimes Psychic Impressions are manifested in that manner. I also demonstrate how to move the slip about and look perriphreally in order to pick up subtle images... long story short, I'm telling them what to look for without tipping a thing to the audience.

As before, the single slip has a dot in the center that they are to focus on... #2s job is to divine what #1 wrote... when they are done jotting down their impression they also crumple the slip into a ball...

At this point #1 returns and the two exchange paper balls... #1 recounts what he/she said/drew... both open their slips and 9 times out of 10 they will match!

I forget exactly I believe this was originally a Dunninger bit. Post it's and certain memo pads used in various hotels here and there, have a peculiar quality about them that allow for this technique to be used...

Read what I've said carefully, you should be able to understand what is afoot. ;)
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Postby Necromancer » 04/18/03 11:37 AM

Craig's answer, while very good, isn't a "Mental Epic" type routine. The latter is a three-part prediction that is typically accomplished by working one-ahead. And I agree that Osterlind's take on it is quite nice.

Incidentally, Craig's effect is an adaptation of a contribution by Punx to Corinda's 13 Steps.
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Postby Guest » 04/19/03 01:18 PM

Originally posted by Necromancer:
Craig's answer, while very good, isn't a "Mental Epic" type routine. The latter is a three-part prediction that is typically accomplished by working one-ahead. And I agree that Osterlind's take on it is quite nice.

Incidentally, Craig's effect is an adaptation of a contribution by Punx to Corinda's 13 Steps.
I knew it was in one of the older publications but couldn't recall which... thanks!

My reason for posting the above centered on the question of crumpled up Post it notes... an important part of the above ;)
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Postby Guest » 04/22/03 05:57 PM

Another possibility is Mental Epic 2001 from Tony Binarelli's My Way to Mentalism. I've used it before with good results.
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Postby Danny Archer » 05/03/03 06:22 AM

Mental Clip by John T. Sheets is another very practical method ...
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Postby Necromancer » 05/08/03 10:04 AM

The Xpert Device (currently exclusive to hocus-pocus.com) also provides an interesting wrinkle on the classic Mental Epic premise. I hope you'll check it out (says the biased inventor of said device). Thank you.
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Postby Bill Mullins » 05/08/03 01:58 PM

Is Mental Epic the sort of effect that _ought_ to be done impromptu? It's multi-phase, uses several props -- it seems to me that it's not the sort of effect that should be done on the spur of the moment.
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Postby Guest » 05/17/03 10:00 AM

Originally posted by Bill Mullins:
Is Mental Epic the sort of effect that _ought_ to be done impromptu? It's multi-phase, uses several props -- it seems to me that it's not the sort of effect that should be done on the spur of the moment.
An interesting point Bill and I'll agree that the Triple Prediction, be it an actual Epic styled set up or, as we've been discussing here, a more impromptu variant, is very potent magic. Especially for those of us that work on a more "real" level within strong shut-eye community tie-ins. Then again, there are ways of doing bits as elementary as a standard billet or center tear "Reading" that are as or even more potent. The point being that the performer his/her self are responsible for gearing the tone and setting the pace for how the act is percieved.

Mentalism is a very powerful art form. The psychological elements used by the mentalist (as well as Bizarrests in todays world) transmute the way people participate in "magic" as well as how they remember the experience.

Now, getting back to the original question about an impromtue version of the Epic... something came to mind recently that really "says it all"... that is, all we need to do is get "one ahead" and as to how we structure things from that point is entirely up to us. Bob Cassidy's 4th Demensional Telepathy as well as his 3-Envelope routine are awesome (I use them regularly) but I also use alternate methods like the little "NOTEBOOK" system (sorry, I forget who put it out... uses an old chalk based impression method...) or even a standard Baker switch so as to get "in position".

Another thing to be considered (and this is as impromptu as it gets...) Pocket Writing! :whack:
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Postby Necromancer » 05/19/03 10:15 AM

Originally posted by Bill Mullins:
Is Mental Epic the sort of effect that _ought_ to be done impromptu? It's multi-phase, uses several props -- it seems to me that it's not the sort of effect that should be done on the spur of the moment.
To add my additional two cents to Craig's reply: I think it's an exceptional piece to do impromptu. The only thing potentially working against it is the tendency by some performers to gum it up with the abovementioned "several props," be it gimmicked slates or otherwise.

When done only with thoughts and materials that can be reasonably found in an impromptu environment, the triple prediction can be extremely powerful.
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Postby Guest » 05/19/03 11:24 AM

Given the idea of "impromptu"... I was recently playing around with the idea of using the old Hat Pin and Spit Ball styled arrangement... I'll not go into detail just yet, but thought the concept warranted to discussion... after all, there's "No Way" for you to switch or manipulate the predictions when they're scewered, right? ;)
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Postby Guest » 05/19/03 11:35 AM

There is also the Stanley Jaks idea of doing this impromptu with three slips, same one ahead, but for the last one you ask them quickly to name a wild animal (usually a tiger/lion) if memory serves me well <I have one like Biro though so don't quote me on that point ;) >
But it does work well without resprting to a playing card force at the end which is IMHO silly as it is usually disjointed.

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Postby Edwin Corrie » 05/20/03 08:55 AM

David Britland's "One Book, Two Thoughts", which appears as a Trick of the Week on Martin Breese's site (http://www.martinbreese.com/trick2.html), is a sort of impromptu book test/mental epic. Mentalism is not my strong point, but the routine sounds quite good to me.
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Postby Ross Johnson » 05/20/03 12:18 PM

Tony Shiels' "Psychic Chance" found in Invocation # 5 is a thoughtful mental epic type of rountine where the use of playng cards is both effective and logical.
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Postby Necromancer » 05/21/03 09:40 AM

Thanks for chiming in, Ross. Is it true you have an actual show that's open to the public coming up? Please email me with the details; I'd love to see it!

Back to the three-part prediction: I agree that Shiels' routine makes the use of cards logical for the third phase. I think that leads to an interesting point: in this sort of effect, the three phases should progress logically, even thematically, to keep the heat off the final phase.

If the theme is gambling, as Shiels' routine is, then you can use dice, (what was the middle one, roulette?), and cards -- so that a card force makes sense in phase three.

Or as in Busch's Pre-Season Super Bowl routine: the team, point spread, and coin toss all make thematic sense, and allow you to do a terrific equivocation on the last phase.

Or you could do an imaginary "date with a movie star" presentation, in which the celebrity, restaurant, and time of the goodnight kiss are all predicted, with the last phase being equivocated using a "Watch & Wear" timepiece.

Or you could play an invisible game of Bingo, in which you mentally transmit the type of win (vertical, horizontal, diagonal, frame), final letter, and final two-digit number are predicted. In this case, the number could be a psychologically force (it's not 100%, but it's undeniably exciting).

The list goes on and on. But whatever you do, thematic logic is key.
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Postby Ariel Frailich » 11/25/12 11:40 AM

Greetings!

Can someone please help me identify the following version? It was shown to me in the mid-70s.

It's a simple 'one-ahead' version, done with three billets, but they're numbered (on the outside), and the numbers are miscalled. The spectators's choices are written on a separate sheet or notepad.

Thank you for any info!
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Postby Daniel Z » 11/25/12 01:34 PM

Hello Ariel.
If it used business cards (rather than billets), and a clever mis-numbering it could be Cicardi's 3 Card Epic which was published in 1974 in issue 95 of Bascom Jones' Magick.
best,
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Postby Ariel Frailich » 11/25/12 03:33 PM

Hello, Daniel,

Thank you very much for answering! Regrettably, that's not the one. Here's a brief synopsis of what I'm looking for. You have 3 slips, a glass and a sheet of letter paper.

1) I'm thinking of a colour (write something on slip and fold it). This is #1 (write number on slip and drop it in the glass). Please name a colour (write it on sheet).

2) Same thing with a two-digit number, for slip #2.

3) Same thing for a card selected from a deck, for slip #3.

4. You tip out the glass and someone opens the slips -- they match what's on the sheet.

Method: one ahead; you write force card on slip 1, colour on slip 2, two-digit number on slip 3. You also miscall the numbers you write on the slips: you write '3' on 1st slip, '1' on 2nd slip, and '2' on 3rd slip.

Are you my old 'film'-friend Daniel Z from TO? If so, nice to hear from you! :) And if not, pleased to 'meet' you, Daniel!

Thanks again --
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Postby Daniel Z » 11/25/12 04:21 PM

Hello Ariel.
Yes I'm that Daniel.
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Postby Bob Farmer » 11/25/12 08:34 PM

Ariel:

This may not be much help but it may remind someone else of the correct reference. I remember a routine like this in a book I have somewhere. It was an English paperback, maybe by Val Andrews or Jack Yates or Ken (?--can't remember his last name). If any of this strikes a chord let me know and maybe I'll be able to track it down.
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Postby Ariel Frailich » 11/25/12 09:30 PM

BOB!!! Oh, my -- it's been YEARS! Great to see you, my old friend -- hope all's well with you!

I know the Yates version; it's similar on the surface, but actually quite a bit more involved under the hood. You write the numbers first and show them; later on, you modify them. It's in a small book of only 4 pages, together with one other effect.

If there are also versions by Val Andrews and Ken something (De Courcy?), I'm not familiar with them.

Thank you for the help, Bob -- and maybe see you some day! Take care--
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