Endless Loop

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Postby Guest » 03/05/02 06:46 PM

Any recommendations for a good "endless Loop" video. I'm very familiar with the routine but would like to see video. Thanks.
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Postby Guest » 03/05/02 08:21 PM

I have not seen the tape, but I hear that Marc DeSouza's "Chain Gang" video is very good.
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Postby Paul Green » 03/05/02 09:28 PM

I have seen the Marc DeSouza video--It is excellent! Marc had a unique ending that I had never seen before.

I would also suggest the School for Scoundrels manuscript and the Bob Knigge "Air Chain" booklet.

Keep looking,

Regards,

Paul Green
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Postby Brisbin » 03/05/02 10:46 PM

May I also suggest that you check out "Johnny Thompson's Commercial Classics of Magic" (L&L videos) for another inspired performance of the endless chain. (I believe it's on Vol. 3 of 4) I enjoy the way he really gets the audience involved in this "honest game." ;)
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Postby Brian Morton » 03/05/02 11:00 PM

Having done the chain for about five years now and collected most of the works in print on it (as well as viewing what's on video) I'd say that, if you have to have video on it, go for Johnny Thompson's. He'll give you an idea of how to do this age-old gypsy/carny scam with charm and panache.

But to be honest, if you really want to do it right, get Whit Haydn's notes on it -- and then realize that the real work is not in the handling, it's how to present the trick without coming off as a jerk. If you can do something other than the "I win/You lose" presentation over and over again, without losing the charm of the scam, you might achieve something with it. But then again, that's the hard part, isn't it?

brian :cool:
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Postby Brisbin » 03/05/02 11:14 PM

Originally posted by Brian Wendell Morton:
...the real work is not in the handling, it's how to present the trick without coming off as a jerk. If you can do something other than the "I win/You lose" presentation over and over again, without losing the charm of the scam, you might achieve something with it. But then again, that's the hard part, isn't it?

brian :cool:


You said it Brian. The biggest challenge I face, and I imagine others are thinking about it too, is how to routine some of these classic spectator-involved effects without the "I'm a genius, you're a jerk!" flavor. There has to be some middle ground between a straight (yawn) demonstration, and making the participant feel like a loser. I'm thinking primarily of tricks like the monte, loopy-loop, and even the standard "guessing game" themes for the chop cup, etc. One "name" magician at an infamous A-1 convention a few years ago, justified stinging his helpers by saying it was just "taking the mickey out of 'em."
It doesn't work for me, and I don't think, in general, that style works for the bookers and corporate types I want to rehire me.
Maybe this is more of a suggestion for a new topic? :rolleyes:
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Postby John Pezzullo » 03/06/02 03:20 AM

Joe,

Check the following URL for a list of "Endless Chain" references:


http://magicref.tripod.com/magref/magchain.htm

Are you the same guy as the Joe DeStefano in 'Chinatown Poker' (New Stars of Magic - Volume 1, Number 4)?

[ March 06, 2002: Message edited by: John Pezzullo ]
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Postby Guest » 03/06/02 03:57 AM

Thanks for your suggestion John. And, YES - I am the "Joe DeStefano in 'Chinatown Poker' (New Stars of Magic - Volume 1, Number 4)?"

Thank you for remembering. I hope you enjoyed it - if you have it.
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Postby Oliver Corpuz » 03/06/02 07:32 AM

I like Marc DeSouza's "Chain Gang" video because he shows you two ways to throw a win/win combination. This unique throw gives you more possibilities in the presentation. But Brian is right, also study the school for scoundrels notes by Whit Hadyn & Chef Anton, there are some important tips in them. I also found it worthwhile to study other "swindle" game presentations such as the three shells, 3 card monte, thimble rigging, even cups and balls.

Regards,

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Postby Van » 03/07/02 10:29 AM

Chuck Smith has an excellent in-the-hands- version. Only in booklet form though.

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Postby Brian Morton » 03/07/02 11:56 AM

Van writes:
Chuck Smith has an excellent in-the-hands- version. Only in booklet form though.

Robert Neale publishes an in-the-hands version in "Tricks of the Imagination," with a very good bibliography on the chain trick. it helped me track down a lot of places to find ideas.

brian :cool:
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Postby Brian Morton » 03/07/02 12:18 PM

Van writes:
Chuck Smith has an excellent in-the-hands- version. Only in booklet form though.

Robert Neale publishes an in-the-hands version in "Tricks of the Imagination," with a very good bibliography on the chain trick. it helped me track down a lot of places to find ideas.

brian :cool:
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Postby Guest » 03/14/02 07:52 AM

One item that may be of interest: I just got an email from Denny & Lee's that there is a new Fast and Loose VIDEO from Whit Haydn and Chef Anton's "School for Scoundrels"

The email reads:

"FAST AND LOOSE VIDEO-$30.00 (JUST ARRIVED!!)
Here is a complete video instruction and performance of the classic "Fast and Loose" gambling scam. All the details fully explained plus two complete routines performed by Whit Haydn and Chef Anton. Here are the moves, the type of chain to use, the lay down of the chain, the "selling of the lie," the come-ons, the proofs, the hooks (why laymen find it so fascinating). It is difficult to find a routine so entertaining and appealing. I highly recommend this video."
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Postby Bill McFadden » 03/14/02 08:55 AM

Point of clarification: the School for Scoundrels video has been in release for about a year or so. Scoundrels and Marc DeSouza's version comprise the definitive works on "The Endless Chain/Loop." Denny was announcing that his supply has been replenished. I know first-hand that the videos, and the excellent chains sold by Whit and Anton fly out of Denny's store. A word to the interested, along with my $.02.

[ March 14, 2002: Message edited by: Bill McFadden ]

[ March 14, 2002: Message edited by: Bill McFadden ]
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Postby Guest » 03/15/02 09:09 AM

Perhaps this thread has died. I thought I'd also mention George Blake's "Loopy Loop" pamphlet, which had a number of excellent bits to choose from.

Robin
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Postby Brisbin » 03/15/02 01:07 PM

Johnny Thompson also gives credit to George Blake in his Classics of Magic video. BTW, I want to correct my earlier post - Mr. Thompson performs the routine on Vol. 2, and not Vol. 3.
Best, Vic
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"What the mind harbors, the body manifests." - Tohei Koichi
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Postby Guest » 03/15/02 01:22 PM

BTW, nothing to do with the endless loopy, but Vic's mention of the Johnnie Thompson tapes makes me want to say that they are just about the best multiple tape set I've ever bought. Virtually every trick is a lesson in how to perform tricks both well and entertainingly for real audiences.

If you add the recent two-volume Skinner tapes (presentation only with one trick exception), you're got enough personal training for a lifetime.

Robin
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