A new word association game

Discuss the historical aspects of magic, including memories, or favorite stories.

Postby David Ben » 03/09/06 04:36 PM

Gaetan Bloom is the Winston Freer of his generation...

Pete Biro is the Max Holden of his generation...

Jay Sankey is the U.F. Grant of his generation...

You get the idea, now submit your own.
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Postby Bill McFadden » 03/09/06 08:02 PM

Denny Haney is the Al Flosso of his generation; or at least the Louis Tannen.
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Postby Bill Duncan » 03/09/06 11:11 PM

Phil Goldstein is the Max Maven of his generation.

How'm I doin'?
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Postby David Ben » 03/10/06 06:39 AM

Right now, Bill is the winner.
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Postby John Pezzullo » 03/10/06 06:52 AM

Mike Gallo is the Lou Gallo of his generation.
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Postby Dustin Stinett » 03/10/06 04:52 PM

David Ben is the Ross Bertram of his generation.
(Pretend we have one of those smiley face deals with him smooching a big-o-butt.) :D

Mark Kalin & Jinger are the Maskelyne & Cooke of their generation.

Roberto Giobbi is the Jean Hugard of his generation.

James Randi is the Houdini of his generation.
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Postby Earle Oakes » 03/11/06 05:06 PM

Richard Kaufman is the Goldston,Stanyon, Wilson,
Hugard, Mulholland, Annemann, Elliot, etc of his generation.
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Postby John Pezzullo » 03/11/06 08:44 PM

Originally posted by DustinStinett:
Mark Kalin & Jinger are the Maskelyne & Cooke of their generation.
I don't think that Cooke was as attractive as Jinger.
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Postby Richard Hatch » 03/11/06 11:12 PM

Originally posted by John Pezzullo:
Originally posted by DustinStinett:
[b]Mark Kalin & Jinger are the Maskelyne & Cooke of their generation.
I don't think that Cooke was as attractive as Jinger. [/b]
No, but Maskelyne was.
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Postby Guest » 03/13/06 08:09 PM

Billy McComb is the Billy McComb of his generation.
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Postby Guest » 03/13/06 08:17 PM

OK, I thought seriously about this for a minute. I'm curious to see who will agree/disagree with me on this:
Tommy Wonder is the Dai Vernon of his generation.

Look at his routining and how every single move has a purpose and looks completely natural.
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Postby Guest » 03/13/06 09:20 PM

I got another one.
Steve Forte is the Erdnase of his generation.
This guy knows the real work.
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Postby Guest » 03/14/06 09:51 AM

Jeff Mcbride/Ben Chavez

Lance Burton/Channing Pollack

Tommy Wonder/Fred Kaps

Rene Lavand/Hofsinzer

Michael Ammar/Dai Vernon
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Postby Guest » 03/14/06 10:53 AM

Originally posted by Noah Levine
Michael Ammar/Dai Vernon

You've got to be kidding. For Dai Vernon I was thinking more like John Carney or maybe Tommy Wonder as someone posted above, but Michael Ammar ???
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Postby Guest » 03/14/06 11:27 AM

I want to clarify my post above. I have nothing against Michael Ammar but just don't feel he belongs in the same class or mind set as a Vernon, Carney or Wonder.
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Postby NCMarsh » 03/14/06 09:47 PM

Docc Hilford = Robert Nelson

Pat Page = Al Baker

Gazzo + Joel Bauer + Paul Diamond + Steve Cohen = Max Malini

Micheal Ammar = Marshall Brodien

N.

(I think Haney = Flosso is brilliant)
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Postby Guest » 03/15/06 09:48 AM

Not that I diasgree necessarily with the analogy but Marshall Brodien is still VERY active in this generation. He actively provides/designs magic sets for some of todays top performers as well as still releasing magic through toy stores under his own name. Also unlike Ammar he markets almost exclusively to the general public and not to magicians.
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Postby Guest » 03/15/06 11:36 PM

Originally posted by Tom Dobrowolski:
Not that I diasgree necessarily with the analogy but Marshall Brodien is still VERY active in this generation. He actively provides/designs magic sets for some of todays top performers as well as still releasing magic through toy stores under his own name. Also unlike Ammar he markets almost exclusively to the general public and not to magicians.
That would make Marshall Brodien the Marshall Brodien of his generation, which is too easy.

Is Darwin Ortiz the John Scarne of his generation, or is Steve Forte? And if one of them is the John Scarne of his generation, does the other one have to be the Frank Garcia?
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Postby Timothy Hyde » 03/16/06 01:33 AM

Originally posted by Nathan Coe Marsh:

Gazzo + Joel Bauer + Paul Diamond + Steve Cohen = Max Malini

(I think Haney = Flosso is brilliant) [/QB]
I think your "Gazzo + Joel Bauer + Paul Diamond + Steve Cohen = Max Malini" is brilliant

well done

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Postby Guest » 03/17/06 06:20 AM

Jamy Ian Swiss is the Tom Bowyer of his generation.
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Postby Guest » 03/17/06 04:56 PM

I want to clarify my post above. I have nothing against Michael Ammar but just don't feel he belongs in the same class or mind set as a Vernon, Carney or Wonder.
I agree:

Michael Ammar/ Frank Garcia

Mike Walsh
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Postby Bill McFadden » 03/20/06 10:49 AM

Originally posted by dben:
Jamy Ian Swiss is the Tom Bowyer of his generation.
Right. So would that make Darwin Ortiz the Dariel Fitzkee of his generation?
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Postby Guest » 03/23/06 08:18 AM

Wow! This is cool.

I've broken mine into categories.

Major Touring Illusionist

David Copperfield is the Howard Thurston of his generation.

Great Stage Performer/Manipulation Act

Jeff McBride is the Cardini of our time. (I thought about T. Nelson Downs instead of Cardini)

Popular Magic Course Writer

Michael Ammar is the Harlan Tarbell of his day.

Magician's Magician/Great Parlor Performer

Ricky Jay is the Max Malini of our time.

I know this was a little obvious given Ricky Jay's reverence for Malini. I also thought about Channing Pollack in terms of cross-over into acting career.

Great Magic Historian

Dr. Edwin A. Dawes is the ??? of our generation.

Having trouble with this one. Dawes is far more scholarly than any magic historian I can think of. (For example, his work is far superior to that of say, Milbourne Christopher.)

Gary
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Postby Guest » 03/23/06 10:53 AM

Allan Ackerman = Ed Marlo (IMVHO)
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Postby Guest » 03/23/06 11:42 AM

Great Magic Historian. Edwin A. Dawes is the ?????
How about John Gaughn or maybe Mike Caveney???
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Postby NCMarsh » 03/23/06 11:51 AM

Originally posted by Bill McFadden:
Originally posted by dben:
[b] Jamy Ian Swiss is the Tom Bowyer of his generation.
Right. So would that make Darwin Ortiz the Dariel Fitzkee of his generation? [/b]
I bow before the erudition of Mssrs. Ben and McFadden -- who was Tom Bowyer?

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Postby Guest » 03/23/06 05:35 PM

Edwin A. Dawes = Henry Ridgley Evans.

BTW, Tom Bowyer was most noted for the Six Bill Repeat. Evans wrote books about real old magicians. ;)
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Postby Max Maven » 03/24/06 06:18 AM

Originally posted by Don Spurrier:
BTW, Tom Bowyer was most noted for the Six Bill Repeat.
It would truly be a shame if that is all that is attached to Bowyer's name. He was the first significant book reviewer in magic (in the early days of the Linking Ring, and his keen critical eye combined with an erudite style set a standard that has rarely been matched.
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Postby Guest » 03/24/06 06:26 AM

And he was the Jamy Ian Swiss of his generation.

Dave
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Postby Guest » 03/24/06 07:00 AM

Further to Max's comment, and hopefully not sounding like Dustin, Tom Bowyer was one of the few magicians outside of New York who was privy to many of the secrets of the Inner Circle in the 1920s, 30s, and 40s. He was also considered a very fine performer.
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Postby Bob Farmer » 03/24/06 08:33 AM

Kenton Knepper is the austraopithecus man of hos generation.
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Postby Matthew Field » 03/24/06 09:36 AM

Bob Farmer is the Ed Gein of his generation.

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Postby NCMarsh » 03/24/06 11:34 AM

Thank you for the information about Bowyer.

Best,

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Postby Guest » 03/24/06 04:29 PM

I'm surprised no one has done this:

David Roth / J.B. Bobo

Jon Racherbaumer/ Ed Marlo ( IMHO )

Richard Kaufman / Lloyd Jones / Paul Flemming

/Jean Huggard/Carl Jones

Mike Walsh
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Postby Guest » 03/25/06 01:44 PM

LMFAO Matt! Farmer/Gein, I'm not sure others got that. He can't be that bad, or are u insinuating that Gein was a flimflam man too?

Fill in the blank:
Busby is the _________ of his generation.
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Postby Guest » 04/02/06 11:20 PM

Pepka wrote:
Steve Forte is the Erdnase of his generation.
Nah, we know who Steve Forte is... ;)

Max Maven wrote:
[Tom Bowyer] ... was the first significant book reviewer in magic (in the early days of the Linking Ring, and his keen critical eye combined with an erudite style set a standard that has rarely been matched
Following on Bowyers heels was Paul Fleming, whose reviews starting in the 1940s were pure gold. Anyone wishing to obtain an excellent overview of the general state of magic literature in the 1940s need only read Flemings reviews. I am not as familiar with Bowyers reviews as I am with Flemings, but it seems fair to say that contemporary magic literature reviewers could do well by themselves in studying Flemings reviews as models of temperament, balance, etc.

Don Spurrier wrote:
Edwin A. Dawes = Henry Ridgley Evans
Doubtless Don intended this as a complimentary association, but I would not equate these two gentlemans writings very closely, except to the extent that they are both held in high regard and are writers on magic history. Evans writing was pure romance, and although certainly not fiction, Evans was often not too concerned about perpetuating certain myths of magic or its personalities.

Dawes, on the other hand, while most enthusiastic with his subject matter (as was Evans), has not been inclined to leave misconceptions as they are found, and his research and writing reflects a distinctly more scholarly approach. As I wrote in HGCR #1, Dawes pioneered the consistent inclusion of primary source documentation in his works, something very rarely done by writers before him (e.g., Frost, Burlingame, Evans, Clarke, etc.).

Like Gary B., I'm stumped as well in coming up with an apt comparison to Eddie Dawes. All things considered, I think Dawes currently has no peer. That said, based on their writings to date, I think Jim Steinmeyer and Ricky Jay come closest to Dawes in their approaches to magic history research and writing - all other nominees are a distant second. However, neither Steinmeyer nor Jay have been as prolific as Dawes. But they're younger and, in time, I believe they have a good shot at joining the rarified rank held by Dawes.

Finally, Im wondering if anyone could suggest an apt comparison to Ricky Jay when it comes to Jay's accomplishments in conjuring performance and historical scholarship. Whether one looks to the past or present, I think he stands unique in that respect.

Clay
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Postby Guest » 04/03/06 07:54 AM

Like Gary B., I'm stumped as well in coming up with an apt comparison to Eddie Dawes. All things considered, I think Dawes currently has no peer. That said, based on their writings to date, I think Jim Steinmeyer and Ricky Jay come closest to Dawes in their approaches to magic history research and writing - all other nominees are a distant second. However, neither Steinmeyer nor Jay have been as prolific as Dawes. But they're younger and, in time, I believe they have a good shot at joining the rarified rank held by Dawes.
Clay has clarified the problem. Dawes is a true magic scholar. As Charles Reynolds once said to me, Dawes's historical writings are often the only ones that can be relied upon. The problem, of course, is that there are few, if any, antecedents for this level of scholarship. While I agree that perhaps Ricky Jay's writings --which are thoughtfully written and carefully researched (as well as HIGHLY entertaining) -- are comparable, this didn't seem a good answer to the "game" since they are contemporaries.


Finally, Im wondering if anyone could suggest an apt comparison to Ricky Jay when it comes to Jay's accomplishments in conjuring performance and historical scholarship. Whether one looks to the past or present, I think he stands unique in that respect.
I've got one, but it's not very good. One could argue that Houdini did precisely this -- writing several books on magic and entertainment history at a time when he was a leading stage performer. Of course, the quality of Houdini's scholarship leaves something to be desired. Houdini's major contribution to scholarship, in my opinion, is collecting and preserving important source material for later writers. Given his level of education, however, perhaps one should be more charitable toward his writings.

Gary Brown
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Postby Guest » 04/03/06 08:35 AM

Well, Gary, you got me anent Steinmeyer and Jay guess I got caught editorializing outside of the game!

Houdini may well be the best comparison one could come up re my last query. But as you say, its not very good (no fault of yours, of course; you work with what history gives you). I thought of Houdini, but (a) history has not treated him kindly so far as conjuring skills go (cf his accomplishments as a showman) and (b) Houdini got the immediate boot from me in the scholarship prong for his sometimes scandalous lack of objectivity, best exemplified by his bias in The Unmasking. Anyone who cheats like that doesnt deserve the appellation of scholar.

Clay
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Postby Guest » 04/30/06 07:01 PM

I believe Michael Weber is the Malini of our generation.

If you have ever been lucky enough to hang around Mr. Weber for any time at all, you KNOW that he not only performs INCREDIBLE tricks with ANY and EVERY known ordinary object; plus he has the impishness to plan way ahead, to most-effectively screw with you.

Please forgive me the following illustrative anecdote:
I was with him once, at a convenience store in San Francisco. He put a couple items on the counter. The clerk rang them up. Mr. Weber feigned that he didn't have any money (har har). He grabbed a pack of Lifesavers from the display by the register, (Wint-o-green, if memory serves) which he banged-down onto the edge of the counter breaking the roll in the middle. There was something rolled-up and stuck in the hole. He pulled it out: why, what LUCK, a $10 bill! He paid, and we strolled out.

I have always thought that the look on that clerk's face must have been like the look on the lady's face when Alexander Herrmann found gold-pieces in her eggs.

That's the best I've got.

But here are a few questions:
Would Steve Cohen be more like Hofzinser or Houdin? How about Mr. Ben?
Or;
Derren Brown is the ___________...?
Bill Kalush is the _____________...?
Jeff Sheridan is the ____________...?
Teller is the ______________...?

Can you chaps fill in the blanks?
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Postby Guest » 04/30/06 07:19 PM

Paul Ditmyer is the Jerry Stapleton of his generation.
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