The Magic Castle Is Broke

Discuss the latest news and rumors in the magic world.
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Guest » July 30th, 2005, 12:13 pm

We know that the Magic Castle is in financial trouble.

Is it not logical to posit that someone at the top either caused the problem through greed or no one at the top saw this enormous problem coming from a mile away?

Do we all want to see the Castle go out of business because of uncorrected greed and/or incompetence?

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Richard Kaufman » July 30th, 2005, 5:45 pm

I want everyone to feel free to post any thoughts they have on this issue HERE on this Forum, not only on a Forum that is accessible ONLY to members of the Magic Castle and that is subject to potential censorship by the very people who are being criticized.
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Ryan Matney » July 30th, 2005, 9:20 pm

I thought when you were the director/president of a company or business it was always YOUR responsibility when it went under or had problems?
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Guest » July 31st, 2005, 4:56 pm

Originally posted by Ryan Matney:
I thought when you were the director/president of a company or business it was always YOUR responsibility when it went under or had problems?
I'm not a lawyer. That said, I have had some experience with failed enterprises, sad to say. And no, Ryan, the principals in the company, if it has been properly registered, are not legally responsible for debt after the failure of the company. It is the reason that people incorporate.

There is one exception to the rule, one instance in which the corporate veil can be pierced. That is, if the taxes are not paid. Then, anyone responsible for the direction of the cash flow can be held personally responsible for the corporate tax debt. In fact, ALL the people responsible for direction of the cash can be held responsible. So if the debt were, let's say, 100,000.00, and the president had 50,000.00 the government could take that, and then go after the remaining debt from the other officers or responsible parties. And remember, you don't have to be an officer or stockholder of the corporation, you have to have been aware of the debt, and have been able to direct it, instead of other bills, to be paid, and not done that. So, in theory, the bookkeeper, if she signed checks for the rent before paying the tax debt, could be held responsible for the debt. She knowingly directed the cash flow to other debt before paying the taxes. At least that's my understanding of the law. And it is a very simplified explanation of a very complex group of laws. anyone else? Lawyers?

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Gerald Deutsch » August 2nd, 2005, 7:56 am

A friend of mine told me he was going to send money to the Castle because it's needed. I asked whether his money would do any good or would it be like "spitting in the ocean".

In my many years of working with distressed companies I've learned that if a company needs $10X and gets $6X, not only will it not save the company but the $6X will be lost.

I have found that one of the most important tools to be used is a "cash flow projection" with columns for the future months (or weeks for the first month) listing:

Cash on hand beginning
Receipts
Disbursements
Cash on hand end

If this is done correctly it will show the maximum cash that will be needed AND WHEN IT WILL BE NEEDED.

This can be done with the help of a good accountant but, of course needs the input of management.

This cash flow chart can then be the basis for raising funds - if indeed the necessary funds can be raised. To raise funds that clearly won't do the trick just to be able to keep payroll for a short period is not wise.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Sam Kesler » August 15th, 2005, 9:09 am

If I read the accounting firm's report right, the people in charge didn't know the difference between employees' net and gross salaries? At minimum showed net salaries as outgoing expenses on the books, hence one part of the shortfall. An honest mistake? Incompetence?

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Pete Biro » August 15th, 2005, 9:20 am

What is needed is a paid CEO that knows how to run a business. Not volunteer board members elected because as magicians they are well-known.
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Pete Biro » August 15th, 2005, 4:38 pm

Is Gingras able to read the balance sheets and keep 'em up? Then he's the CEO... if not????
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Brian Morton » August 16th, 2005, 10:39 am

Terrence, to quote Richard one more time:
I want everyone to feel free to post any thoughts they have on this issue HERE on this Forum, not only on a Forum that is accessible ONLY to members of the Magic Castle and that is subject to potential censorship by the very people who are being criticized.
.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby KirkG » August 16th, 2005, 4:52 pm

In fact, as far as the current Forums are concerned, I don't think there has been even one incident of censure or blocking. The old TG issues seem to be at rest.

Some have been asked to tone down the rethoric and to re-think their posts and some have chosen to edit or remove their own words.

There is quite a bit of disagreement and mud slinging going on. I expect when the dust settles, the real information will come out and that is what I would like to see shared.

Generally, the review shows a past problem, that should not continue into the future, so the Castle is good for now. What will happen at the two year option or the 4 year renewal date is yet to be seen.

Kirk

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Pete Biro » August 17th, 2005, 10:17 am

Had a great time there last night... the food and service was excellent. All seems to be running well.
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Brian Marks » August 17th, 2005, 10:50 am

Not being a magic castle memeber, it seems there was mismanagement. Are people really afraid of hiring a professional manager due to Enron? Thats just stupid.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby KirkG » August 17th, 2005, 2:52 pm

The AMA, not the Magic Castle, needs to watch its budget and use its funds wisely. It really isn't all that big, now that the restaurant is subbed out. So to spend big bucks on a CEO to run a magic club is a little bit wasteful IMHO.

Kirk

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Pete Biro » August 26th, 2005, 3:03 pm

GOOD AFTERNOON AND WELCOME TO THE MAGIC CASTLE. I have been asked why I dont respond to the comments of a couple of un-named members on the Castle forums. No, I dont respond. I am hurt by their constant innuendos and I am personally offended by their remarks.

One of them, made the comment that the current financial problems of the Castle were created by Milt, Dale and Lew. I totally agree. If Bill and I had not created the AMA and the Magic Castle 44 years ago there would be no problem today.

If you read the pages of Genii Magazine when the AMA was first announced in 1951 you will see that Dad, William W. Larsen Sr., envisioned a fraternal magic organization devoid of politics. He was sick of the political rat race of the magic organizations at the time. I wonder what he would think of his dream today?

I am sorry that Dale has decided not to run for the board again but I understand his need to pursue his personal life and his chosen career change.

Lew has also said he will probably not run. In Lews case he is simply sick of the accusations of some of the members. Lew is one of the most respected financiers in the entertainment business and has devoted years to the benefit of the AMA. What a shame that a few on the Forums seems to have forgotten hat Lew and Dale guided us through riots, fires, earthquakes and other disasters. Because of their negotiations I am now working with the Glovers with new enthusiasm and the future of the club looks bright.

I have great respect for Dale and Lew and I have absolutely no respect whatsoever for the two members constantly hammering us on the Forums.

Milt Larsen (from News of The Day, Friday, August 26, 2005)
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Guest » August 26th, 2005, 6:56 pm

1. Did anyone else notice the following unexplained items in Operating Expenses? Royalties: $17,000. Licensing Fee: $34,000. Creative Services: $34,000. To whom is this $85,000 going to yearly and for what fees and services?

2. The board of directors seems to have been picking up a lot of meal and drink tabs. The statement specifies expenditures during one month of $4994 for food and $2175 for drinks. That's $7169 for a 30-day period, and if that's a typical outlay, that comes out to over $86,000 yearly.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Dustin Stinett » August 26th, 2005, 8:37 pm

As I work about 50 to 60 hours per week as an analyst for my living, the last thing I want to do on a Friday night is come home and look at spreadsheets and read a 19-page executive summary, but thats just what I did. Bottom line; I am satisfied with the findings of the review, the recommendations and next steps the BOD will be taking. I hope those members who are wondering about whether or not to send in the assessment take the time to study the documents. As for Dale and Lew, I guess Im one of the few who remembers when they came in and rescued the club from a financial disaster that was a larger threat than this one. Thank you both for your years of service. I think you are leaving the Academy in better condition than when you arrived on the scene. I hope those who follow you recognize that.

Dustin

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Pete Biro » August 26th, 2005, 10:07 pm

Dusty one... you nailed it.
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Guest » August 27th, 2005, 6:03 pm

I have been a member of the Academy for many years, and did send in my assessment. Unfortunately, now that I have the information provided I am not regretting sending it in...but now question why we did not get this information before the assessment was requested. I got my package today in the mail, which says a lot about why I am concerned.

Anyone with any business sense would see something is wrong and indeed, broken. Inventory not taken, simple accounting entries not made, books not maintained, etc., etc. Sounds like there needs to be a complete change of board, responsible personnel for accounting, and others. This organization is too important to let "vanish." Something must and can be done to right the ship and get it back on course. I don't know how and what it will take, but do believe for the art it needs to be corrected and preserved. While I am an ameatur by standards, I love the art and have dedicated many years or hard work/time/money into performing.

As a business professional, I know this can be corrected. After reading the extensive packet of information, letter, and financial data I resent the idea from some postings we should not be "airing dirty laundry." As a concerned member of the Academy who did submit my assessment, I have every right to make my comments heard. Not saying anything is not only a violation of my rights and privledges, it raises the question, "What if nobody spoke up where would the organization go?"

This is also one of the great rights afforded to us as Americans.

Magically Yours,

Lawrence Berry

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 28th, 2005, 7:50 am

Terrence, this is not a thread to discuss where to discuss things--it is a thread to discuss a situation, so STOP re-stating the same thing. It's annoying.
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Richard Kaufman » August 28th, 2005, 7:55 am

A friend just pointed out to me that one of the recommendations of the auditors was to cut costs, and one of things they recommended be cut was the salary of the performing magicians.

Since most magicians already lose money by working the Castle (i.e., any gig they could find would pay more), it's pretty insulting, not to say ridiculous, to suggest that the meager fee be cut!
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Tabman » August 28th, 2005, 9:20 am

Soon magicians will be expected to pay to work the Castle. This has already happened in the music biz a few years ago. There are so many "hopefuls" and "wannabees" trying to make it big the venues can get away with this.

If they do this I predict the final end to WWL's dream and a very sad day. If anything, they should pay them more.

-=tabman

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Pete Biro » August 28th, 2005, 9:34 am

Bean Counters will make several recommendations... without knowing the human effect.

You can be sure the AMA will not cut pay... however, there are some performers that DONATE their fees back to the AMA. If they wish to (some are wealthy, excellent performing part-timers) do that it is their call.
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Tabman » August 28th, 2005, 10:38 am

One of the full-timers I know that works the Castle could probably use the extra dough that the well-heeled part-timers "donate" back.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Alan Bursky » August 29th, 2005, 4:09 am

No one recommended that magicians pay should be cut. This is a rumor. No magicians will have to pay to work the Castle. Where does this B.S. come from? I gaurantee no magician will have to pay to work the Castle. Those of you who know me, KNOW I KNOW what is going on at the Castle.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Alan Bursky » August 29th, 2005, 6:26 am

By the way, the title of this thread is wrong. The Magic Castle is not broke. It is the AMA that is in trouble. The confusion with all of this is most people do not know the difference between the Magic Castle and the AMA.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Pete Biro » August 29th, 2005, 9:19 am

HI ALAN... yah, and boy talk about the slime bags on Castle Forum calling names and ... well you know... argh
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Guest » August 29th, 2005, 9:20 am

I'd say a more intelligent policy would be to decrease some of the wasteful spending and INCREASE magicians' pay to attract better acts than the ones who currently settle for Castle wages. That would ultimately mean higher attendance and increased revenue.

Obviously, many great acts do work the Castle, but all get the same low pay and many are able to afford to work there only because they live in California or are on lecture tours.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Dustin Stinett » August 29th, 2005, 12:42 pm

Heres how rumors can be extrapolated from facts:

While it is not a formal (numbered) recommendation, whenever an analyst highlights a causal issue in an executive summary, it is meant to be taken under consideration. Im guessing that Richards friend probably noticed this little ditty:

the entertainment related operation is not contributing any margin to coverage of overhead or general and administrative expenses. When appropriate overhead and general and administrative expenses are allocated, entertainment-related operations are incurring a sizable loss. (Bold as in original.)

These types of summaries are written knowing who all is reading them (been there, done that). To come out and say, cut your entertainment expenses and cut your payroll does not sound good and generally does not go over well with readers who only look at the recommendations. A good analyst knows how to make recommendations in a way that management will make it their idea. Whoever wrote this summary is a damn good analyst.

None of that, of course, means the powers that be will take any action in that direction. But even I can see that the reviewers consider this an issue that management should do something about, and how someone can construe what was written as a recommendation.

Dustin

PS: Regarding the separation of The Magic Castle and the AMA: Yes, it is true that they are separate entities. Its also true that this was done primarily so the Magic Castle could get its liquor license (in those days, on that property, a non-profit organization could get one; a restaurant could not). Frankly, I think its splitting hairs. Without the Magic Castle, there is no AMA and vice versa (and I think its nave to think otherwise).

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Alan Bursky » August 29th, 2005, 9:04 pm

It is my feeling within a few years there will be no AMA. But there will be a Magic Castle private magic club.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Dustin Stinett » August 29th, 2005, 11:19 pm

If that happensand it certainly maythe restaurant might be called The Magic Castle (assuming that Milt Larsen continues to sell the rights to the name; which he might in that circumstance), it certainly wouldnt be the Magic Castle as we know it, and thats what Im talking about. Furthermore, without the AMA, who still owns the liquor license, getting a new license will be very tough. And no, transferring a LL in California is no simple matter. And given that the ABC requires that all conditions of the license transfer to a new ownerand I believe one of the conditions on this license is that the owner is a non-profit organizationwell, a transfer is just not likely. If a transfer is possible, given the fact that the current license is a type 57, the new owners of the establishment will have no choice but to keep it private. Who would remain a member of that Magic Castle? Of course, this all has to do with a LL for spirits; a new beer and wine only license is a possibility. But the ABC and the city have the final call on that, and I dont think the property has ever been rezoned. Thats what led to the special liquor license in the first place (otherwise, the Castle would likely have a type 51 or 47 license). So, if the AMA goes away, its likely that the Magic Castlecertainly the Magic Castle as we know itwill go away shortly after.

Dustin

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Alan Bursky » August 30th, 2005, 12:54 am

The Magic Castle as we know it would be exactly the same. Just no more BOD or voting. You pay your membership fee and get to get in. I would bet the powers that be will be able to get a new booze license.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Steve Bryant » August 30th, 2005, 4:35 am

And no more whiners! Where do I sign up?

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Alan Bursky » August 30th, 2005, 5:07 am

The truth is that some people do not seem to get is; The Magic Castle/AMA is the Larsen Family magic club.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Carl Mercurio » August 30th, 2005, 8:22 am

I think Dustin hit it on the head. That was exactly my reading of the documents and the financials. As a financial analyst, my conclusion was that the club can't survive at its current revenue run rate without cutting costs. The one relief is that there really doesn't appear to be any malfeasance in all this--at least based on the information we've been presented with. I'm sure it's been a tough time for all involved, and as a paid-up AMA member, I hope things work out.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Pete Biro » August 30th, 2005, 10:28 am

Reminds me of a story about a Symphony Orchestra bringing in an "efficiency expert" -- to be brief, the report was lengthy, but the following summarizes it.

There are twelve violin players in the violin section, you only really need one with a good microphone.... etc. etc.

Bursky is right!
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Pete Biro » August 30th, 2005, 10:29 am

If you read Milt's message, you will note that W. Larsen Sr. wanted a place with NO POLITICS... and that, my friends, is not what we have.
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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Guest » August 30th, 2005, 11:04 am

Originally posted by Pete Biro:
What is needed is a paid CEO that knows how to run a business. Not volunteer board members elected because as magicians they are well-known.
Gee! Pete, you know that in my other life I am a registered lobbyist. Volunteers are the only ones in charge in our government. (It's not legal to recruit a pro.) And look what we aren't!

I had really hoped that there was a big difference between "mission accomplished" and "mission abolished".

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Dustin Stinett » August 30th, 2005, 11:47 am

Pete, Im not talking about politics at the Magic Castlesomething I would prefer to do without myself, believe me. Im talking about those pesky little things called laws and regulations as set forth by the State of California and the County of Los Angeles.

Trust me; one simply does not go be-bopping down to the local ABC office to pick up a new liquor license. First, they are not given to everyone who applies (they limit the number issued each cycle). Second, the municipality and many of its departments get to chime in as to whether or not the establishment gets said license. The municipality, not the ABC, is the final arbiter. Even if the ABC says yes, the local government can say no, and then the ABC says no. As I said, Im pretty sure the zone that the Castle is in does not allow for a 51 (club) or 47 (restaurant) license; hence the 57 (special) license the club has now. It got that license only because of the existence of a non-profit organization called the Academy of Magical Arts. The name on a license does not simply change because someone floats into the ABC office and whips out his checkbook. It is a complicated process with no guarantee of a satisfactory outcome. Thats the first thing the ABC tells you when you inquire about buying a new, or acquiring an existing, liquor license.

Can the property be rezoned? Sure it can, but I promise you this: the city does not cover the cost of the variance studies involved in doing so! Ill give you one guess who does: cash up front, and again, with no guarantee of a satisfactory outcome!

It would be wonderful if the Magic Castle was just as it appears on the surface. Its not, and it is very unlikely that it ever can be. Not impossible, just very unlikely. What some people tend to forget is that, in a bureaucracy, what you want to do and what you are allowed to do are, more often than not, two different things.

Dustin

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Alan Bursky » August 30th, 2005, 12:57 pm

I gaurantee if the Glovers want to get a new liquor license, they will get one.

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Re: The Magic Castle Is Broke

Postby Dustin Stinett » August 30th, 2005, 2:18 pm

If you say so, but, before you put your money down, consider this: In July, the ABC allocated 100 new general licenses to Los Angeles County (for over the next year). Only 25 of them fall into the categories that the Castle would need to get. 25 for the entire county. They are likely to get far more than 25 applicants. That means a public drawinga lottery if you will. If the Glovers are drawn, then the investigationa very thorough onebegins. This is where issues like property zones, building codes and the like come up that complicate the matter even more. Assuming the AMA hangs on into next year, the Glovers will have to wait for another application cycle (it is not throughout the entire year) and also wait to see how many new general licenses the ABC allocates to the county (its based on population growth). So, of course, the Glovers could get a new license. Nothing is impossible. Of course, it would also be a hell of a lot easier for the Glovers to flatten the place and build another hotel.


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