New Max Maven DVD - Multiplicity

[SteveP]

I just launched Max's new DVD Multiplicity on L&L's site.

Excerpt for the ad copy:

"In this remarkable DVD you will learn techniques and subtleties involving equivoque and multiple outs, including ideas revealed for the very first time, plus over two dozen routines. Join Max and special guest Eugene Burger, for an utterly irresistible combination of mystery, surprise and insightful absurdity."

10 minute demo video on the site:

http://www.llpub.com/max-maven-multiplicity/

There is currently a pre-release special going on for one week. Details on the site.

[Dave V]

Hi Steve,
This looks great! I'm not too thrilled with the "picture in picture" double shots of Eugene in the demo that really doesn't add to the presentation. I wonder if there was a good reason for that? Or was it someone playing with one of the toys in the editing suite?

One problem I see with a "multiple out" video demo like this is that I really don't know if I'm seeing the "out" or the one time (out of two in Eugene's segment) that it hits.

My magic buying budget is limited, and although it looks great I still have to wonder if the "miss" plays as strong as the "hit."

[SteveP]

Dave,

The picture in picture was limited to that segment.

You stated: "I really don't know if I'm seeing the "out" or the one time (out of two in Eugene's segment) that it hits."

Well that's the genius of this DVD because Max's strategies for the outs are so good, it won't matter. Like a lot of other people, I've played around with equivoque over the years but was always uncomfortable with the outs. This DVD gives you everything you need to be confident in the outs because they are just as strong as the one time hit.

There is a lot on this DVD. The DVD is much more than just clever presentations. What I included on the demo was three presentations that I felt were entertaining. Max also has work that involves other principles working along side equivoque for some incredible outcomes.

I hate to sound too excited about the DVD because of my work with L&L and my comments coming across as an obvious sales pitch, but it really is an exceptional DVD if this is a technique someone wants to master. Once you learn it (and it's not going to take someone that long to master the more advanced thinking) it's something you always have and are ready to do.

[Max Maven]

The picture-in-picture images are not what was used in the final edit, and I have no idea why they show up in the on-line demo. I would expect that they won't be on the actual DVD.

[SteveP]

Max,

I created the demo video from the check disk and it was like that on the check disk.

[Richard Green]

I put my order in today...birthday present to myself!

I have to say that the directness of "Watchman" sold me on this one...as well as the fact that everything else Max has released is wonderful...

Richard

[Dave V]

Thanks Steve and Max,
Looks like I'll be adding one more item to my "wish list" now.

[SteveP]

Who wants another sneak peek? C'mon, I know you do.

Based on some comments & pm's I got the past couple of days, I decided to do a second demo video with two other routines.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWuzC5rJJnQ

Enjoy and don't say I never gave you anything.

[Edward]

Looks like this is going to be a great DVD.

[Richard Kaufman]

Between this DVD and the enormous chapter in the new Berglas book, plus the performances of Magician's Choice on the DVDs which accompany the Berglas book, you'll have pretty much all you need.

[PickaCard]

Finally! I remember hearing about this video shoot about 5 years ago. I think there were even a few pictures in an old L&L catalogue around the same time Nothing came out.

I have already placed my order as anything by Max and Eugene are must buy. But I am wondering why these would be put on hold for so long?

Are there any recent Max Maven and Eugene Burger shoots in the works that we can look forward to in the not so distant future?

[SteveP]

The reason some projects take longer to release than others vary. L&L always shoots more than it will release in a year, so that may set back the date of a release.

Also the performer reviews the edits and provides feedback to the editing team and that too can delay a release.

L&L also likes to provide a variety in their releases. Maybe they just had several mentalism releases, so it's time to push out some card magic.

I have no idea about any future Maven/Burger projects in the works. Max could answer that.

Dave V, thanks for the heads up on the picture-in-picture issue on the demo. It's been corrected and will not be like that on the final DVD.

[Richard Kaufman]

Was this really shot five years ago?

[SteveP]

It was shot in 2004, so six years ago.

[Richard Kaufman]

... and why would they chose to put it out now. Hmmm.

[Max Maven]

Richard, I know you'd love to have some scandalous backstory here, but the simple and pragmatic fact is that the timing is entirely due to delays on my part. So, they "chose" to put it out now because, at long last, they can.

[Richard Kaufman]

Max ... six years? I have no need for any scandalous backstory. Just curious.

I'm sure it's going to be a great DVD and very well received. I know that you are a genius at verbal control. :)

[The Magic Apple]

[color:#990000]The Magic Apple will getting this DVD TODAY!![/color]
[size:14pt]PLUS THIS Thursday Max Maven will be APPEARING at The Magic Apple for a DVD release party[/size]!
From 4pm to 7pm: We'll have Coffee, Snacks, Soda and more!

Come on down and be one of the first to get this GREAT DVD!

We will be offering special in-store pricing on Thursday as well!!

[BlueEyed Videot]

Of course anything by Max is a must buy, and I've already pre-ordered from L&L when the DVD was first announced. That being said, what I'm hoping to hear is any news on the long-awaited Maven Gilbreath book. I've long maintained an open slot in my Mentalism library for it.

Max, any word? (nudge-nudge)

[Don Hendrix]

I received an email yesterday saying that the DVD has been shipped.

[The Magic Apple]

Max talked a lot about the DVD yesterday and I watched MOST of it. Very impressive stuff! There is some PRICELESS material in this DVD.
Good Job Max and Thank you for coming by the shop for a few hours yesterday!

[Robert Allen]

Richard, which new Berglas book please?

[SteveP]

I'm glad you're enjoying the DVD and it sounds like Max's appearance at your shop was well received.

Now that this has shipped and people are starting to watch it, I've been anxious to hear what other people think of the DVD because I think it's one of the best mentalism releases.

Unfortunately on The Cafe there has been more negative than positive feedback. Since I'm not a Cafe member I thought I would clarify a couple of issues here since some are members of both forums.

What is unfortunate is that some have dismissed the DVD because the demo showed a 50/50 routine with a brick and a feather which wasn't explained. There are about a dozen effects on the DVD which weren't explained as part of the Tour De Force section and one of those was also included in one of the demos as well. No one is commenting on those routines however.

Max has given more than enough explanation with other routines and in his discussions with Eugene that the outs in the Tour De Force section are evident. However some aren't happy that an out wasn't given for the brick presentation. There was an explanation of sorts at the end of the DVD, right before the credits as part of funny moment between Max & Eugene. But that obviously wasn't enough for some. There are those who will be happy with that, others who demand a scripted 'out' and the rest of us who worked out our own presentation for it (which I did and know of several others who have as well).

The demo videos were not created to be misleading and were not planned between L&L & Max and I wanted to clarify how the demo videos for this DVD came about.

Most of the time the contents of the demo videos are my decision. Louis makes some recommendations and sometimes the magician/mentalist lets me know what they want. If it's up to me, I watch the DVDs and look for routines that will fit within the time constraints of YouTube, will show up on a small screen, can withstand repeated viewings with minimal chance of an explanation and finally if it fools me.

This DVD was challenging because just about everyone who was going to buy it knew the method, so we wanted presentations that were going to be unique within the Equivoque framework and were strong, sort of "Wow, I never thought of doing that with Equivoque" reactions. Louis recommended the brick and feather routine at the beginning, but also recommended the 'pay off' at the end of the DVD. I didn't see how I was going to edit those two pieces together and decided to leave the pay off moment in favor of showing more routines.

After some feedback on the first demo from Dave V, on this forum, about not being sure if he was seeing the 'out' or the first time choice, I decided to create a second video which showed another strong routine and a routine with multiple outs to show it was just as effective.

So that is how the demo videos for this were created. No one was being underhanded. No one was trying to pull one over on anyone. No bait and switch. Max had nothing to do with the contents of the demo and L&L basically left it up to me.

My guess is the most of the people who purchased this did so because of Max's reputation and his work on this technique and NOT for one effect. This project was hardly a secret and many people were anticipating it. If someone bought it for the one effect, the only thing I can say is that with some thought, there are outs for it and Max has given you some powerful tools to work with. To dismiss the entire DVD because of one effect is a loss because this DVD offers so much more.

If anyone has any comments regarding this and don't want to post those comments publicly, feel free to email me at stlpellegrino@gmail.com. Of course I'll be more than happy to answer questions here as well.

[Robert Allen]

Some years ago I was lucky enough to attend a lecture by Eugene Burger in San Francisco. The majority of time was spent on equivoque based on requests from us. After having personal instruction from Eugene on how to do this, and despite going in knowing how it was supposed to work, I still didn't get all the nuances, and of the people there, I was probably the best prepared to learn it. Others literally could not see it happen even though there were in the know.

Given that, personally, I wouldn't be too concerned if a few fan boys from the Magic Cafe are up in arms over not being able to do this complex type of trick after a single viewing of the DVD.

I'll be buying one. Maybe this time I'll finally become good enough to perform it. If not, at least I'll be entertained by someone who is.

Robert

[amp]

I love it ! Thank You Max .

[Bob Cunningham]

"Unfortunately on The Cafe there has been more negative than positive feedback ... What is unfortunate is that some have dismissed the DVD because the demo showed a 50/50 routine with a brick and a feather which wasn't explained."

I can understand why there have been complaints. It is outrageous that Mr. Maven teaches principals and then expects us to learn those same principals and apply them to our own performances.

It seems clear that in the future any similar DVD must be sold with a Federally mandated warning: "CAUTION: This DVD requires thought and study! The Surgeon General has determined that this material may be harmful to those who wish only to mimic other performers."

I'd demand my money back, but I am having too much fun thinking about how Mr.Maven's insights can apply to my performances.

[Mind Guerrilla]

Mr. Pelligrino,

You say, "Louis recommended the brick and feather routine at the beginning, but also recommended the 'pay off' at the end of the DVD. I didn't see how I was going to edit those two pieces together and decided to leave the pay off moment in favor of showing more routines."

1)What was the difficulty you encountered in editing?

2)Was there any concern at L&L that customers would expect to receive an explanation for the brick routine?

3)Was any consideration given to superimposing the words "performance only" on the clip?

4)In light of customer reaction, will the promo containing the brick effect continue to run, unchanged, on L&L's website?

Speaking of the website, the ad there boasts that this DVD contains "over two dozen routines". This is true only if you count the unexplained brick routine as well as Mr. Maven's holding up the words "The" & "End" at the conclusion of the disc (hardly a routine).

5)Was anyone at L&L concerned that the ad copy might be deemed misleading?

Thanks, in advance for your reply.

[Ryan Matney]

This is really sad.

Maybe the point of the feather/brick routine was simply to show that there is power in a simple 50/50 choice.

Perhaps it's value is illustrative rather than in the explanation.

Nobody would ever perform that trick anyway, for several reasons, but they must bitch about the one trick that wasn't revealed.

[NCMarsh]

The disc is well done.

I particularly enjoyed the "tour de force" for two reasons:

1.) these techniques are only effective when they're instinctual; and while that only happens through experience, seeing the techniques in different contexts over and over really helps to get the whole thing inside your bones

2.) The huge range of plot possibilities shown gets your own creative juices going. I couldn't help but get out my notebook and start brainstorming objects/plots and, as a result, have the bare beginning sketch of a plot that excites me.

For a medium (video) that typically fosters imitation, this is no small accomplishment.

There is also fine work combining equivoque with other methods. And there is some very strong material here.

A few minor quibbles:

• I don't know why folks (including Mr. Maven) insist on pronouncing "equivoque" as if it were a french past participle; it isn't, and it isn't spelled as such. It ought to rhyme with "oak." Minor, but had to get it off my chest after several hours of "equiv, ok?"
• This is a bit of a stretch, and perhaps asking too much of a video, but I felt that the disc reduced "equivoque" to a procedure for forcing objects; and I think it is unfortunate if the student walks away with just that. Mr. Maven's work in this area is excellent, and it is a powerful and broadly-applicable tool; but I think of Eric Mead's line in Twisted Web that "equivoque is a way of life."
  Understanding that the performer defines the effect, that the performer interprets the procedure for the audience, and that words have malleable meanings...this is a foundation for miracles that never begin with "we will eliminate all of these but..." Again, this may not be the medium, but it would have been nice to have explored a broader understanding of equivoque on a disc devoted to "multiplicity"
• Again minor: one of the powerful things about equivoque-for-forcing-objects is that, once mastered, you have a miracle that can be performed anywhere you have pen and paper...it is that rarest of pieces that allows you to do magic with found objects in any environment...this is a focus of Berglas' essay in the "Mind and Magic of..." book, so perhaps that's a reason for staying away from it...but it seems worth a mention for the student to whom the impromptu possibilities do not occur (there's a great essay in one of Barrie Richardson's books about the impact of some impromptu after-dinner equivoque on his seen-it-all wife)

Again, this is all picking nits and the product is well-worth your money...and Verbal Control remains one of the best values in magic at $5....

For those who enjoy this work, there is a beautiful touch (fooled the hell out of me) for an eqivoque force on Jon Armstrong's recent L and L set....

And I loved the way the brick effect was used...

N.

[SteveP]

Ryan Matney: "Nobody would ever perform that trick anyway..."

The 50/50 routine has hit a nerve with some people for a number of reasons:

• It's a new twist on the Russian Roulette plot
  
• Many who see it, can see themselves doing it (as is)
  
• Max's presentation is very direct, apparently leaving little to no room for equivoque-style alternatives

If a word-for-word routine were included, there would be 100 guys out there right now doing it and we would see 13 year olds doing it on YouTube. If anyone takes the time to work it out they will have something unique to them. (that should be considered a gift!)

Mind Guerrilla: "1)What was the difficulty you encountered in editing?"

Using the word 'editing' is an exaggeration of what it is I do when creating the demos. It's just me and a Macintosh using iMovie. I'm not a video editor and I know just enough to pull some clips off of a DVD and get them on to YouTube. I just didn't see how I was going to get a smooth transition from the effect to the interaction between Max & Eugene at the end.

"2)Was there any concern at L&L that customers would expect to receive an explanation for the brick routine? "

I don't know. We never talked about it.

"3)Was any consideration given to superimposing the words "performance only" on the clip?"

Again, we never discussed it. Everyone is fixated on the 50/50 routine, and there is another routine in the clip that is also performance only, but no one is upset over that one.

"4)In light of customer reaction, will the promo containing the brick effect continue to run, unchanged, on L&L's website?"

I haven't heard from L&L since the comments started appearing on The Cafe. I don't know if Louis has seen the comments (some of which have been removed). It's not my call to remove the video, if it's even justified to do so.

"Speaking of the website, the ad there boasts that this DVD contains "over two dozen routines". This is true only if you count the unexplained brick routine as well as Mr. Maven's holding up the words "The" & "End" at the conclusion of the disc (hardly a routine).

5)Was anyone at L&L concerned that the ad copy might be deemed misleading?"

That's not something that I have ever spoken to L&L about with any DVD.

I have a very limited capacity with L&L. I take care of the website, I add the new releases to the catalog and home page and create the demo videos. On the rare occasion there is a technical problem, I resolve that for them.

We've been working together for about seven years and we've only had two other issues with demos. The first was a David Regal clip where I took Regal's intro to the video and put that as the first part of the clip. David didn't like it thinking it wouldn't help sell the product, so I redid the clip.

The other was a Steve Dacri clip where he made a comment about handing a knife to one of the spectators. People complained and I changed it.

Will that happen here? I don't know. My feeling is that both demo clips are an accurate representation of the product. Max has provided enough information for anyone to do the routines on the DVD.

Just about any magic DVD isn't about copying what you see, but rather learning techniques and getting inspired and that's what Max presented here.

[Richard Green]

Having gone through the entire DVD several times, I have to say that this is one of the best values I've ever received. I felt as though I was watching a "masters level course" in the subject, and while I thought I understood 'equivoque' previously, I now feel that I can more effectively utilize this wonderful tool!

My previous use of equivoque or multiple outcomes was limited simply because I felt that I didn't really understand how to implement them without seeming like I was doing what Max referred to in his initial examination and discussion of "Magician's Choice". Having taken a couple of these items out and used them in the "real world" over the weekend, I can say with all confidence that I now have a new 'weapon in my arsenal'.

Thank you, Max.

Rick

[Richard Green]

I've not read through every single post here since some of them were quite lengthy, so if I'm repeating something already posted, I apologize.

I just had to say that I felt that this was Max at his most charming. It just felt wrong...

:grin:

Rick

[Robert Allen]

Richard,

If you need a different Max you can go read his reasoned response to the guy over in the magic castle thread who suggested that we should just film performers w/out permission and see how it goes ;)

It was one of the most droll yet biting responses I've seen in years. It made me smile a lot :)

[erdnasephile]

All the carping from the magiccafelumpen (MCL) Re: Feather v. Brick is reminiscent of the brouhaha that ensued when it was revealed that Max had the temerity to hide easter eggs in the Tommy Wonder and Videomind DVD's without telling everyone where they were. The nerve!

If the MCL disdains the set because of the omission of one routine, so much the better for those that do not fear work.

[Brad Henderson]

This is the same mind gorilla who accused George Robinson of underhandedness and false advertising for removing the subscription renewal address from his Magick reprints. He accused him of price gouging as he found the set listed on barnes and noble online for a fraction of the price - yet was told it was unavailable from them (b and n) at any price. From that he concluded George was gauging magicians. He complained that the reprints didn't include 3 blank pages that were never part of any subscription, nor sent by Bascom. And while he laments they are not worth what he paid, he refused offers to sell his set for his investment. (yet is clearly scanning it for errors). Most recently he implied George has exceeded his stated limitation print run.

Sadly, my comments were systematically deleted from the threads he began. Apparently, only one opinion matters to Mind Gorilla, his own - and facts have no place at all.

Just so you know what you're dealing with.

Brad

[SteveP]

Personally I don't have a problem with Mind Guerrilla asking questions. I opened the door.

I can appreciate that some people may feel cheated by the demo of the DVD, just don't accuse L&L & Max of intentionally trying to deceive customers because those who do have no idea about what they're talking about.

It's not my job to tell people they are wrong about an opinion they have about an L&L product. I just jumped in to this because no one knew the facts about the demo and people were making incorrect assumptions.

It seemed that Mind Guerrilla wanted further clarification, and that's fine. His comments on The Cafe were actually some of the more level-headed ones.

[Bill McFadden]

Not to stray too off topic, but I purchased the CW 5-vol MAGICK pre-pub. I'm a satisfied customer - the price, the packaging - very grateful that George Robinson made it all available. Biased though I may be, I dig the new layout much better than the previous CW volumes.

[Mind Guerrilla]

This is the same Brad Henderson who prefers to steer topics off course and engage in personal invective rather than discuss facts. He uses the moniker "Truthteller" on the Cafe. Insert your own joke here. :) He called me "stupid" over there but shied away from my invitation to discuss the matter in person. It's amazing how brave some people are behind a keyboard. ;)

I pointed out that the MAGICK set was not "unabridged" as advertised. This didn't matter much to me, since I bought the books for the effects not for old subscription info, but I thought others who expected an historically accurate reproduction of the material might like to know about certain omissions before they plunked down their $800. A recent ad in Genii still touts the books as "unabridged"/"nothing left out".

The books did appear for a short time as a pre-order on Barnes & Noble for about $500. If B&N could still make a profit then it's hard not to speculate on their being overpriced at $300 more.

Why Mr. Henderson seemed to take my pointing these issues out personally is still unclear. He now seems to have a problem with my asking questions.

I don't run the Cafe. One of the managers locked the thread in question because he said the back-and-forth going on there was unproductive. I asked him to unlock the thread and he did so but only after making edits of his choosing (not mine). I regretted the edits too. People seemed to be enjoying my comebacks.

Why is Mr. Henderson even bringing this up here? I get the feeling he may have been that kid in grade school who used to raise his hand and say, "Teacher, Tommy's chewing gum!" or "Teacher, you forgot to give us homework!" :grin:

We now return to our discussion of Max Maven's MULTIPLICITY, already in progress...

[Ted M]

The way I read it, he was pointing out that this complainer had a well-established pattern of petty complaints, and that it was apparently being continued here.

[SteveP]

The way I read it, and I'll quote myself:

If anyone has any comments regarding this and don't want to post those comments publicly, feel free to email me at stlpellegrino@gmail.com. Of course I'll be more than happy to answer questions here as well.

Which he did. I answered his questions. I don't think Mind Guerrilla was out of line with his questions. He asked reasonable questions. I gave him honest answers. I don't know what Brad's issue was with him regarding this product. My guess was he was continuing an argument from The Cafe.