Brad Henderson wrote:again, your definition is nonsense.
if i look at a non coin in my hand and act as if one is there MY INTENT is to convey untruthful information. It is NO different from telling you there is a coin there when it isn't.
and my definition that i quoted wasn't 'the vernacular' it came from an actual dictionary.
so there is that.
tell me. if i flip through a book and look down as i say 'page 121'. how is that a lie? i never said we stopped at page 121. i just made a statement and that led you to assume that the page was 121
how is that different from slydini taking a coin that isn't in his left hand and pretending to transfer it to his right?
both intentionally convey false information.
how is one a lie and one not?
and you never addressed the difference between magic and illusion. in star wars we have the illusion of space ships laying. is that magic? has anyone ever confused one for the other?
You keep calling it my definition, as if you hope to marginalise it. I quoted The Oxford English Dictionary, Mr. Henderson.
"Nonsense"?
It is a pity we have to go over this again, but it appears that you will not get it. A lie is an INTENTIONALLY false STATEMENT. Not an intentionaly false impression. They are not the same.
If Slydini had said, "Now that the paper ball is in this hand, I want you to watch closely"- that would have been a lie. What he would say is, "Watch carefully. I put the ball in my hand..."
Which was not a lie. He did put it in his hand, albeit very briefly.
Your definition of "lie" is not the first one in any dictionary that I am familiar with. The primary definition is the proper one. The others are less authorataive, generally from the vernacular. An example might be the colloquial usage of "living a lie". But such dramatic interptetations are not to meant to supplant the literal meaning.
As for your Star Wars references: I never suggested that all ilusions constitute magic. I said that filmed versions of magical effects belong in the "magic" genre, just as music videos belong in the "music" category. Whether they are "live or Memorex" notwithstanding.