Chris Bliss Diss

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Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 11th, 2006, 4:21 pm

Originally posted by Jim Maloney:
Originally posted by mrgoat:
[b] There is one theory. It was the music that made it, not the juggling.

It sure as hell wasn't the choreography to the music, the movement to the music nor the juggling.
You seem to be implying that the same reaction would be garnered by simply passing around an mp3 of "Golden Slumbers/Carry That Weight/The End". As much as I like the Beatles (and that is quite a lot), I don't think that's the case. Rather, it was the songs, in combination with Chris's juggling that got the reaction.

If it was simply the music that got the reaction, then wouldn't Jason Garfield's video get passed around just as much as Chris Bliss's? The fact that it's not seems to indicate that it's Chris's routine working in combination with the music that people are enjoying.

Would Chris's routine get the same kind of reaction without the music? Doubtful. The routine and the music are inextricably linked and form a whole that is greater than the sum of its parts.

-Jim [/b]
No, I am implying little. I am saying that I think if we could pick a track as popular and do a simple act to it...would that work as well?

What fact are you basing the Diss video being passed round less? I will wager you one cold pint of ale that the Garfield one is actually seen by more eyeballs that the original one - soley because of this malarky. I had a site that was on BoingBoing once and the traffic it got was totally frightening. Really.

Be interesting to get the Utube stats...

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 11th, 2006, 4:24 pm

Originally posted by Brad Henderson:
It was not just the music. If it were, the Garfield's routine would have resonated...and it didn't. It was the balance between the two. Regardless of what you think about the movement, for some reason, that coupled as it is with the music produces something neither on its own, or neither coupled with something else, has been able to do.
OK I was being a tad trite when I suggested it was just the music.

:)

It is certainly the balance, but how that be learnt from?

Should we forgo anything at all complicated and do a routine with a Sven deck, a d'lite and sponge bunnies. Cos audiences do seem to love that. (Admidtely I have seen one good bunnies routine but I will never admit to it). (Never).

Are we all wasting our time trying to do anything complicated? Is it merely magical masturbation?

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 11th, 2006, 4:38 pm

To mrgoat:

Yes, I did get a bee in my little bonnet. Maybe I owe you and the other GF readers an apology for the rant.

mrgoat wrote:
the ramblings of someone with too much time on his hands
You got that right! Excluding opening and closing salutations, quote attributions and quotes (and the text that Dustin S. deleted from one of your posts), heres the count thus far (i.e., prior to this post) on this thread:

mrgoat: 23+ posts, 180+ lines of text ... and counting....
magicam: 1 post, 14 lines of text

Where does that put you on the too much time on his hands scale?

mrgoat wrote:
I'm afraid this thread (and me) has been alarmingly misinterpreted by you....
Whats alarming is, on more than one occasion on this forum, you have made derogatory remarks about alt.tragic and the caf, yet you dont recognize that on this thread you sound like one of the very bozos you seem to be mocking on those other forums. Thats what I was referring to by asking you to take your hypocritical bulls**t elsewhere.

Whats alarming is that you dont have the self-respect or self-awareness to come clean after being politely and diplomatically invited to do so (courtesy of Jim Maloney). Then again, as Jim has shown considerable restraint with you, maybe I can learn something by his example you certainly seem incapable of doing so. Frankly, Im amazed at the amount of grace being shown to you by others here, given that, with every post you make, it becomes more and more clear that you didnt make your post simply because you thought the Garfield video was funny. You keep slinging ca-ca at all of us here and Im the only guy who seems to have had enough of it. Perhaps Im flat out wrong about getting on my high horse.

mrgoat wrote:
... I am really glad you enjoy Bliss ...
Where did I write that?

mrgoat wrote:
... Some people 'get' Garfield, some don't. You don't.
How did you draw that conclusion? Where did I say something negative about Garfield? All I did was request (in vain, admittedly) that you stop being a hypocrite on this thread.

mrgoat wrote:
... what would make a clip of someone doing a Sven routine so viral? Something for us all to think about ...
Maybe a couple dozen people on this thread saying, basically, its the entertainment, stupid! isnt conclusive enough for you, but it says something to me (then again, youre the expert on viral marketing .... ). By the way, not that its going to happen, but itd be nice if you explained how the Garfield video is funny. So far your 21 posts (and counting) all sound remarkably similar, covering topics that you have repeatedly claimed are unimportant.

Finally, (finally)

mrgoat wrote:
... Garfield's only point as far as I can tell [emphasis added] - is that what [Bliss] did was easy, and without real value. ...
but later mrgoat wrote:
... It is upsetting to a lot of us (emphasis added) that our friends would think that we would like chris bliss's routine. We know better ...
Man, does your story keep changing. But I seem to be the only one who is bothered by it, so time for me to clam it.

Clay

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Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Pete Biro » April 11th, 2006, 7:15 pm

If what Bliss does is SO EASY... howcom everybody isn't doing it. I have juggled off and on for 40 years and started to work again after seeing Bliss (live) over at the WMS in Las Vegas... and I can't even start to do some of what he does. Forget style, I'm just talking mechanics.

When you read the Washington Post link you will be totally amazed at how many millions have now seen Bliss... he may be the most known juggler in the world now. He's even on www.ringostar.com

Stay tooned... :genii:
Stay tooned.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 11th, 2006, 9:01 pm

Just to be clear, I was not suggesting that what Garfield did was the equivilent to Criss Angel, he was the complaining magician to David Blaine.

Now is the time for him to come up with something better and show the world.

Kirk

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 12:01 am

A few years back I used to do a sponge bunny routine to the Beatles 'All You Need is Love'. Artistically I was very satisfied with it, but it was a commercial flop. It garnered the biggerst hate mail I've ever received.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 5:54 am

Originally posted by Pete Biro:

When you read the Washington Post link you will be totally amazed at how many millions have now seen Bliss... he may be the most known juggler in the world now. He's even on www.ringostar.com
:genii:
Just a quick correction - the link is www.ringostarr.com

Man, that would be an endorsement to take to the next pitch meeting. "Well, Ringo Starr has my work on his personal website..."

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 9:07 am

Originally posted by Magicam:
To mrgoat:

Yes, I did get a bee in my little bonnet. Maybe I owe you and the other GF readers an apology for the rant.
Very gracious. Your apology is accepted.

Bye

Damian

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 9:09 am

Originally posted by Pete Biro:
If what Bliss does is SO EASY... howcom everybody isn't doing it. I have juggled off and on for 40 years and started to work again after seeing Bliss (live) over at the WMS in Las Vegas... and I can't even start to do some of what he does. Forget style, I'm just talking mechanics.

When you read the Washington Post link you will be totally amazed at how many millions have now seen Bliss... he may be the most known juggler in the world now. He's even on www.ringostar.com

Stay tooned... :genii:
As I said, I read the piece.

Well, every juggler I know thinks it's easy. No direspect to you Mr B at all, as I know you have juggled for a while. I'm confused about what parts you think are hard? But probably tricky for you to describe the sections - unless you know the names of the bits you think are tricky?

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 9:18 am

Originally posted by Kirk the Magician:
Just to be clear, I was not suggesting that what Garfield did was the equivilent to Criss Angel, he was the complaining magician to David Blaine.

Now is the time for him to come up with something better and show the world.

Kirk
Oh, I thought I was the complaining magician? I'm getting lost in your analogy...

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 9:20 am

Originally posted by Eric Rose:
"Well, Ringo Starr has my work on his personal website..."
Next to a skateboarding dog...

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 10:07 am

Originally posted by mrgoat:
Next to a skateboarding dog...
Which isn't entirely inappropriate if you consider the idea mentioned by Carl Mercurio - as a magician, our competition isn't other magicians, but the dancing bear.

Well, I'm going to step out of this thread now. In spite of resounding kudos from almost everyone to Mr. Bliss, it seems a vocal minority just doesn't want to say anything nice about him. Guess some fellows will always let other's success get their goat...

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 10:19 am

Originally posted by Eric Rose:
Originally posted by mrgoat:
Next to a skateboarding dog...
Which isn't entirely inappropriate if you consider the idea that Pete Biro mentions occasionally - as a magician, our competition isn't other magicians, but the dancing bear.

Well, I'm going to step out of this thread now. In spite of resounding kudos from almost everyone to Mr. Bliss, it seems a vocal minority just doesn't want to say anything nice about him. Guess some fellows will always let other's success get their goat...
Heh. Goat. ISWYD.

But I am not annoyed. I am far from disgruntled. Garfield wasn't disgruntled. It's HIS CHARACTER.

I really think it should make us all question what is entertaining to a lay audience. Some people seem to have some difficulty with that question. Maybe they like hot shot cuts?

I'm off to work on my d'lite routine set to Bohemian Rhapsody.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 10:27 am

I saw Chris Bliss on Good Morning America the other day. My main thought was how the heck he can listen to those horrible songs night after night for 30 years.
Steve V

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 10:45 am

Wow...let it rest Goat.

It's funny...I saw Bliss in the 1980's and I still remember him. And it wasn't just because he could juggle.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 10:48 am

Originally posted by Chris Bailey:
Wow...let it rest Goat.

It's funny...I saw Bliss in the 1980's and I still remember him. And it wasn't just because he could juggle.
Sorry? Let what rest?

Aside from this insulting Clay chap, most of this thread is a fascination discussion to me.

Can't a thread that is provoking interesting comment and thought continue?

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Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Pete Biro » April 12th, 2006, 10:59 am

When did I ever mention Dancing Bears?
Stay tooned.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 11:27 am

Sorry, Pete, that was an error on my part. The dancing bear comment was from a post by Carl Mercurio (July 23, 2004 - that's some nifty search function, Brad A!) For some reason I incorrectly remembered it as one of your posts!

Well, now that the record is corrected, I will re-invoke my previous departure from this thread.

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Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Jeff Eline » April 12th, 2006, 12:55 pm

Eric Clapton only plays 5 notes (basically) out of a possible 12. He's pretty good. (add Robert Johnson, BB King, Mike Bloomfield, Buddy Guy, T-Bone Walker, Muddy Waters, etc...)

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Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Pete Biro » April 12th, 2006, 1:38 pm

I'm trying to work out a 2 ball juggling bit, but need some good music.
Stay tooned.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 1:38 pm

I suppose if Jason Garfield was a magician and he saw Slydini's one coin routine, Jason would have gone back home and immediately practiced the routine with four coins. Maybe even adding a couple of difficult backclips and palm changeovers (you know, since Slydini's one coin return has so few difficult sleights). Yeah, I'm sure that would make the routine better...

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 2:09 pm

Originally posted by Jimbo:
I suppose if Jason Garfield was a magician and he saw Slydini's one coin routine, Jason would have gone back home and immediately practiced the routine with four coins. Maybe even adding a couple of difficult backclips and palm changeovers (you know, since Slydini's one coin return has so few difficult sleights). Yeah, I'm sure that would make the routine better...
Brilliant point missing! You realise it was a magian's idea to do the 5 ball version? (Penn Gilette's).

But someone showed me Slydini one coin routine last summer. I cannot remember being so fooled and entertained in my life. I was gasping at it. I thought at some points it was some elaborately made coin, or a trick shirt. It just *vanished*. Can't remember the last time I was so awestruck by a trick. Sheer beauty.

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Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Pete Biro » April 12th, 2006, 5:30 pm

Penn isn't a magician, he's a juggler that does the talking in Teller's magic show. He's also a bass guitar player.
Stay tooned.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 12th, 2006, 6:45 pm

Pete:

You might wanna kill me for this (and as much as it may pain me!), but re Penn being a magician, I would tend to agree with goaty, if only in the context of the discussion in this thread. If we are going to accept as correct one of the points on this thread which has been argued (persuasively, I believe), then we should look to lay audience perception and reaction as a central element to judging whether or not a performance is good, entertaining, etc. I suspect that the general public would think of Penn as a magician, regardless of whether or not he actually is, functionally or otherwise.

Now, of course (and contrary to what mrgoat claims), the fact that Penn (magician or not) supposedly came up with the idea is absolutely irrelevant, whether with respect to what is really going on here with mrgoat (i.e., he just cant stand the thought that Bliss is a more popular performer, and if judged by popularity alone, is indeed a far better performer, than his brother, so he has made dozens of posts on this tread (vainly) trying to convince readers here of his conviction), or with what he claims is going on here, viz, I just thought [the Garfield video] was funny, thats all. Unfortunately, the folly and hypocrisy of goatys claim is painfully evident (albeit not to him) by the fact that he has refused (been unable?) to give a simple explanation as to why the Garfield video is so hilarious in his 25+ posts (and counting....).

mrgoat wrote:
...most of this thread is a fascination discussion to me.
Indeed.

Clay

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Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Pete Biro » April 12th, 2006, 7:30 pm

I guess I should put out the disclaimer that I despise Penn, following his blasphamous exhibition at the WMS a couple of years ago. Totally uncalled for and worse than bad taste. Offended so many people.
Stay tooned.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 5:43 am

Originally posted by Magicam:


Now, of course (and contrary to what mrgoat claims), the fact that Penn (magician or not) supposedly came up with the idea is absolutely irrelevant, whether with respect to what is really going on here with mrgoat (i.e., he just cant stand the thought that Bliss is a more popular performer, and if judged by popularity alone, is indeed a [b]far better
performer, than his brother, so he has made dozens of posts on this tread (vainly) trying to convince readers here of his conviction), or with what he claims is going on here, viz, I just thought [the Garfield video] was funny, thats all. Unfortunately, the folly and hypocrisy of goatys claim is painfully evident (albeit not to him) by the fact that he has refused (been unable?) to give a simple explanation as to why the Garfield video is so hilarious in his 25+ posts (and counting....).

Clay [/b]
Can you please learn what hypocrite means?

Go on. Give it a go. www.dictionary.com is your starter for ten. Then you can apologise to me again if you like.

I bet you have difficulty with ironic too don't you...

I thought you were trying to be amusing continually asking why I found it funny. Didn't realise you were a bit slow. Sorry about that. Let me break it down for you. I find it funny, as if you care, that a juggler took a popular 3 ball routine and did it with 5 balls. Is that really tricky for you to work out?

Is that ok now or is it still hyprocritical of me?

I can draw a picture of it if that will help you understand.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 8:03 am

Hypocrite (def.): a person who professes beliefs and opinions that he does not hold.

Hurried example (one of several possible):

quote from the goat, sometime earlier on this thread:
It's only a internet forum. Don't take it all so seriously man.
e-mail recently received from a ruffled goat:
Do you want to stop insulting me on a public forum or do you want me to start insulting you back? You are coming across as a f--kwit. Go back to a forum where arguing is encouraged. You seem to be het up about very little. Lots of love. Damian
Damian, of the hundreds of posts Ive made on this forum, the ones on this thread are by far the harshest, and really, the only harsh ones. Id like to think Im a fair person, patient person, etc. I just happened to read this thread late in the game and found you to be so full of it, that I said so. In toto, your posts pretty clearly disclose that you think youre cool, hip, all that, etc. but youre not. Youre just a pretender, a poser, a lamer, a tool.

As presented on Garfields website, his video using 5 balls to mimic a 3 ball routine may be a lot of things (including a wonderful display of technical skill), but it aint funny. And thats just not my opinion thats the opinion of every person posting to this thread, except you. Given your claims about how easy Bliss routine is, funny would be a Bliss look-alike sitting backstage, reading The Idiots Guide to Juggling 5 minutes before curtain time and a successful performance.

But a muscled, sullen bald guy in a skintight outfit haltingly juggling 5 balls in a poorly lit gymnasium to a scratchy soundtrack? Dude, so not funny.

Maybe the problem is that you dont have a good sense of humor.

But don't take it all so seriously man. Its just my opinion.

Clay

P.S. It seems you might also think youre good or clever at debating, but thats not so either. Hint: in debates where intellectual integrity is required, answering questions or addressing issues directly is paramount. In debates where it is not, stunningly brilliant mental misdirection is required. In either case, on this thread, youve been an abject failure. But in case you take issue with that assessment, you can always start over and prove me wrong. CHS

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Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Richard Kaufman » April 13th, 2006, 8:10 am

How can a thread about a juggler have 105 posts in it?
Is this like the juggling act always getting the most applause at a magic convention show?
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Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 8:24 am

Interesting comments on this here:

http://www.magicentric.com/?p=199

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 8:30 am

Originally posted by Magicam:
Hypocrite (def.): a person who professes beliefs and opinions that he does not hold.

Hurried example (one of several possible):

quote from the goat, sometime earlier on this thread:
[b]It's only a internet forum. Don't take it all so seriously man.
e-mail recently received from a ruffled goat:
Do you want to stop insulting me on a public forum or do you want me to start insulting you back? You are coming across as a f--kwit. Go back to a forum where arguing is encouraged. You seem to be het up about very little. Lots of love. Damian
[/b]
Excellent. So you cannot cite one example of my being hyprocritical in this thread. Instead you resort to publicly posting a private email I sent to you. Putting the bad form of doing that to one side, thanks for proving yourself wrong.

Well done for showing yourself up as an groundless argumentative troll.

I couldn't have done it better.

Good job.

alt.tragic is waiting for you.

Silly little man.

PS Sorry RK and everyone interested in actually discussing why this Bliss video is so popular, I did try to take this chap's personal issues with me off the thread and to email but he doesn't seem interested in doing so. Shame.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 8:36 am

Originally posted by mrgoat:
Originally posted by Magicam:
[b] Hypocrite (def.): a person who professes beliefs and opinions that he does not hold.

Hurried example (one of several possible):

quote from the goat, sometime earlier on this thread:
[b]It's only a internet forum. Don't take it all so seriously man.
e-mail recently received from a ruffled goat:
Do you want to stop insulting me on a public forum or do you want me to start insulting you back? You are coming across as a f--kwit. Go back to a forum where arguing is encouraged. You seem to be het up about very little. Lots of love. Damian
[/b]
Excellent. So you cannot cite one example of my being hyprocritical in this thread. Instead you resort to publicly posting a private email I sent to you. Putting the bad form of doing that to one side, thanks for proving yourself wrong.

Well done for showing yourself up as an groundless argumentative troll.

I couldn't have done it better.

Good job.

alt.tragic is waiting for you.

Silly little man.

PS Sorry RK and everyone interested in actually discussing why this Bliss video is so popular, I did try to take this chap's personal issues with me off the thread and to email but he doesn't seem interested in doing so. Shame. I will now ignore him and hopefully he will go away as clearly he is just trolling. Shame the internet doesn't have a killfile![/b]

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 8:46 am

Originally posted by mrgoat:
Originally posted by mrgoat:
[qb]
Originally posted by Magicam:
[qb] Hypocrite (def.): a person who professes beliefs and opinions that he does not hold.

Hurried example (one of several possible):

quote from the goat, sometime earlier on this thread:
[b]It's only a internet forum. Don't take it all so seriously man.
e-mail recently received from a ruffled goat:
Do you want to stop insulting me on a public forum or do you want me to start insulting you back? You are coming across as a f--kwit. Go back to a forum where arguing is encouraged. You seem to be het up about very little. Lots of love. Damian
[/b]
Excellent. So you cannot cite one example of my being hyprocritical in this thread. Instead you resort to publicly posting a private email I sent to you. Putting the bad form of doing that to one side, thanks for proving yourself wrong.

Well done for showing yourself up as an groundless argumentative troll.

I couldn't have done it better.

Good job.

alt.tragic is waiting for you.

Silly little man.

PS Sorry RK and everyone interested in actually discussing why this Bliss video is so popular, I did try to take this chap's personal issues with me off the thread and to email but he doesn't seem interested in doing so. Shame. I will now ignore him and hopefully he will go away as clearly he is just trolling. Shame the internet doesn't have a killfile!

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 9:24 am

I don't see what's intrinsically "funny" about doing a 3 ball routine with 5 balls.

But I'm a juggling layman, so perhaps I'm not privy to that sort of juggler "humor".

I'm glad Garfield has a complete list of what encompasses thieving "hack" juggling acts so that this juggling layman will know what he isn't allowed to enjoy anymore. :cool:

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 9:36 am

My 2 cents - I liked them both. Strangley I was in awe of Chris but laughed at Jason. Two different things.

rnaviaux

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Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby NCMarsh » April 13th, 2006, 9:44 am

This Jason Garfield character doesn't understand entertainment.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 10:24 am

I went to Garfield's site. Nathan is on target. Garfield has the mind of an accountant, not an entertainer.

A good entertainer creates an illusion, not just a demonstration of supposed accomplishment. Every one of us lies to our audiences either overtly or by implication to create the desired illusion. Jugglers should have the same liberty in their goal of entertainment instead of demonstrating some accomplishment the audience doesn't give a rip about one way or the other.

Bliss is an entertainer. The other guy is technically accomplished which does not automatically make him "better" or more entertaining. One is fine for working for other jugglers. The other delivers what he's paid to when he works in front of lay audiences.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 10:27 am

Sorry I was unclear.

Actually both goat and Garfield are the complaining magicians to David Blaine.

Now is the time for Garfield to come up with and publish a better routine. That would make him the Criss Angel of juggling.

I hope I cleared that up. Again my apologies for my awkward analogy.

For what it is worth, I enjoyed both performances for different reasons. I guess jugglers care more about the technical aspects of juggling performance as magicians do theirs. So be it.

Kirk

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 10:33 am

Originally posted by Nathan Coe Marsh:
This Jason Garfield character doesn't understand entertainment.
That must be why he got booked to do his show on cruise ships then.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 10:37 am

Originally posted by Kirk the Magician:
Sorry I was unclear.

Actually both goat and Garfield are the complaining magicians to David Blaine.

Now is the time for Garfield to come up with and publish a better routine. That would make him the Criss Angel of juggling.

I hope I cleared that up. Again my apologies for my awkward analogy.

For what it is worth, I enjoyed both performances for different reasons. I guess jugglers care more about the technical aspects of juggling performance as magicians do theirs. So be it.

Kirk
No problem at all Kirk.

I don't remember actually complaining that much. Just asking questions. Got some brilliant answers too. Really made me start thinking about the entertainment value in what we do.

I'm no finger flinger anyway. Never to any flourishes, or overtly technical routines. Still, makes me think on how I can capture what Bliss had to make his technically weak act so popular.

Fascinating stuff.

Guest

Re: Chris Bliss Diss

Postby Guest » April 13th, 2006, 10:40 am

Originally posted by David Alexander:
I went to Garfield's site. Nathan is on target. Garfield has the mind of an accountant, not an entertainer.

A good entertainer creates an illusion, not just a demonstration of supposed accomplishment. Every one of us lies to our audiences either overtly or by implication to create the desired illusion. Jugglers should have the same liberty in their goal of entertainment instead of demonstrating some accomplishment the audience doesn't give a rip about one way or the other.

Bliss is an entertainer. The other guy is technically accomplished which does not automatically make him "better" or more entertaining. One is fine for working for other jugglers. The other delivers what he's paid to when he works in front of lay audiences.
Interesting. Why do you think Anthony Gatto had such a successful show in Vegas then? As that was pure technical juggling?

Watch a few of the videos (esp the cruise work) on Garfield's site. He certainly gets entertaining. Although you may hate his onstage persona.

I think there is room for technical performance as long as it is surrounded by entertaining patter etc.

Gatto proved there is. Garfield is very succesful working for lay people, and indeed getting his WJF compo on ESPN.


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