Search found 89 matches

by Marty Demarest
January 10th, 2016, 12:22 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

AJM wrote:I apply Occam's Razor to all this.


I believe that same "logic" was recently used to assert that the author filled out the copyright application.

The author didn't fill out the copyright application.
by Marty Demarest
July 31st, 2015, 7:23 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

One small (probably inconsequential) thing I noticed when reading a few pages of Gallaway is the use of the term "stock" as in the card/paper stock used in printing. It occurred to me that Erdnase uses the term "stock" extensively in a related but somewhat different context, for...
by Marty Demarest
July 31st, 2015, 4:43 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Marty, if Smith’s recollections of the ridge at the board’s perimeter are accurate, then that’s no magician’s close-up mat – at least I’ve never seen or heard of one with ridges. On the other hand (and trying to make sense of Smith’s recollection), perhaps a ridged mat would be handy for card games...
by Marty Demarest
July 31st, 2015, 4:06 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Chris, you seem to be calculating odds based on someone having The Expert at the time of its publication. How do you know that the Gallaway copy was owned by him in 1902? Do you know that he didn't purchase it while browsing a used bookstore in 1918? During what time span did Gallaway use that bookp...
by Marty Demarest
July 30th, 2015, 12:55 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Caslon!

Acorns!

Cover Typeface!

Those last two examples are from another printing firm. A firm that used the acorns and that typeface on cover matter. Maybe the binders of the book?
by Marty Demarest
July 30th, 2015, 12:34 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

However i might suggest that, for an artist knowing nothing about card cheats or the sleights they used in the practice of their craft, the demonstration of a second deal, or a bottom deal ... might indeed be called a "card trick" by somebody completely uninitiated, even though it was a g...
by Marty Demarest
July 29th, 2015, 10:22 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Also from Gardner's notes of his initial interview with M.D. Smith: "He [Erdnase] had a small board, like a chessboard, with green baize on it, and Smith thinks he remembers a small ridge about half-inch high around edges. Placed it on table. Did the card tricks on it, and used it as base for p...
by Marty Demarest
July 29th, 2015, 9:26 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Not once did Smith relate anything at all to Gardner directly related to Erdnase talking about magic, or the performance of magic. Based strictly on the content of Smiths conversations with Gardner, Erdnase had nothing to do with either magic, or with performance. I believe you are mistaken, Roger....
by Marty Demarest
July 29th, 2015, 8:43 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

I can't help myself, I have to pick a nit: ;) 4. A magician would have known how to spell "Charlier pass". c.f. "The Acrobatic Jacks": "(Open pack with left thumb bookwise, ready for the "Charlier Shift"..." 6. The only author he mentions by name (Hoyle) wrote...
by Marty Demarest
July 29th, 2015, 2:51 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Chris, I generally agree with you as to the primacy of the book as evidence. But the book is not just the author's style. There's a whole lot of content there, too--including the author's own admission that he produced the book in live collaboration with M. D. Smith. This was confirmed by Smith. The...
by Marty Demarest
July 29th, 2015, 12:19 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

I think the wholesale dismissal of M. D. Smith's recollections is a mistake. He is the only person we know to have met Erdnase and lived to tell the tale. According to Gardner's notes from that first meeting, Smith remembered Erdnase. Moreover, he was very sharp and quite clear about what he remembe...
by Marty Demarest
July 27th, 2015, 11:37 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

It really should be asked how we know James McKinney & Co. printed The Expert . The Expert 's LoC copyright application lists "c/o James McKinney & Co." as Erdnase's contact address and residence, but the company is not named as the book's printer. The LoC registration of the submi...
by Marty Demarest
July 25th, 2015, 11:22 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

I just want whatever Gallaway was washing with!

A professional lifetime handling type and fresh print in the ink-stained trenches, and not a mark on them. And no trace of scrubbing or solvents either. As M. D. Smith said--some of the softest hands he'd ever held.
by Marty Demarest
July 13th, 2015, 4:10 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Oh come on, Dustin! All that stuff is what makes Erdnase the professional wrestling of magic.

(Don't tell me this thread wouldn't suffer if you deleted the post where Paul Wilson compares someone's intelligence to his dog's when they disagree about a move in The Expert. It's the best!)
by Marty Demarest
July 13th, 2015, 2:46 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Richard, my note was sardonic. (Hence the wink.) I was responding to Matt's inquiry by applying David's reasoning to his own work. To wit: "I would be surprised, for example, if the author had a college education. He may have had the gift of gab--a skillset not uncommon for advantage players, p...
by Marty Demarest
July 13th, 2015, 11:18 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

This is not some newbie, it's David Ben. Matt, David's books are riddled with errors both mundane and acute--a clear indicator that David has no higher education. (I'm citing David himself for the "logic" behind that statement. But for a good time, check out David's book Tricks and his bi...
by Marty Demarest
July 13th, 2015, 11:03 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Dustin, I applaud your work and the efforts of every volunteer who moderates these forums. I'm also grateful to Richard for operating them. I thank you all for your time and attention. It's y'all's party, I'm happy to be a guest and play by the rules. But I'd like to respectfully object to the delet...
by Marty Demarest
July 12th, 2015, 2:34 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Magicam, yes, the reference to sales of The Expert in The Sphinx is the example you found. 12/15/1905, p. 118, "Among the Dealers." I interpret that section of the magazine somewhat akin to Richard's notes at the beginning of Genii , where he often mentions products that catch his eye, or ...
by Marty Demarest
July 11th, 2015, 2:39 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Lots of interesting new material here! Bill, I question notion that The Expert might well have fallen into obscurity if it weren't for Dai Vernon. Certainly Vernon is responsible for a great deal of the book's success. But it doesn't follow that the book would be forgotten without him. In any case, ...
by Marty Demarest
March 7th, 2015, 9:46 am
Forum: Buzz
Topic: James Randi in NYT
Replies: 1
Views: 528

James Randi in NYT

An oddly truncated review of An Honest Liar.
by Marty Demarest
March 7th, 2015, 9:40 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

I meant questions for me (and other researchers), Chris. The copyright application should answer those questions. It doesn't. The simplest answer that fits the evidence is: The form was filled out by someone who believed that someone named S.W. Erdnase wrote the book, that he was a real person, and ...
by Marty Demarest
March 7th, 2015, 9:20 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

The most interesting thing about the copyright application, to my mind, is its lack of legal validity. The entire purpose of a copyright registration was to establish legal ownership and rights to the material. But by withholding his legal name, the author of The Expert essentially forfeited those r...
by Marty Demarest
March 6th, 2015, 11:26 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

I'm not sure that I would regard the use of a pseudonym and the printer's address in place of a residence (possibly the author did not have a stable residence) as a lot of fibbing. Don't worry Dick--I won't tell the taxman. ;) Didn't E.S. Andrews have a permanent Chicago address at the time? Interp...
by Marty Demarest
March 5th, 2015, 12:04 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Roger, you assumptions about the implications of self-publishing make sense. But evidence suggests otherwise. I have examples of self-published works that applied for copyright at that time, but which used the printing firm as filing representative. For example: The New Century Edition of The Househ...
by Marty Demarest
March 5th, 2015, 11:43 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

I know that Richard Hatch has a letter written by Edwin Sumner Andrews. How does the handwriting on it compare with that on the copyright application?
by Marty Demarest
March 5th, 2015, 11:31 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

I see no reason to make any assumptions about the copyright application, nor do I trust it. After all, it was supposed to indicate whether a pseudonym was used, and to state the author's real name. It gives "S.W. Erdnase" and no indication of a pseudonym. It also lists his residence as &qu...
by Marty Demarest
March 4th, 2015, 10:11 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

I would say that we don't know who filled out the copyright form. It could have been anyone affiliated with McKinney & Co. It could have been the author. One point of interest is that, if it was filled out by the author, then he would likely have had direct contact with the title page, which nee...
by Marty Demarest
March 4th, 2015, 12:05 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Andrew, unfortunately the "What the Font" link you provided doesn't work. Can you summarize your results? Thanks for digging into this deeper! We used a modern Caslon for the Charles & Wonder edition as well. (And just for the record in your example: No "Th" ligature. Additio...
by Marty Demarest
February 22nd, 2015, 11:28 am
Forum: Buzz
Topic: Groundbreaking new work on Edwin T. Sachs
Replies: 26
Views: 6194

Groundbreaking new work on Edwin T. Sachs

I was excited to see that Tom Sawyer has announced on his Erdnase blog that his next work will be a substantial book about Edwin T. Sachs, the author of Sleight of Hand . Given how much influence Sachs exerted on magic in general--and how his work continues to be acknowledged by magicians today--thi...
by Marty Demarest
February 19th, 2015, 11:14 am
Forum: Close-Up Magic
Topic: Alaskan Poker by Ricky Jay
Replies: 154
Views: 25671

Re: Alaskan Poker by Ricky Jay

Good point, Roger. Sometimes "influence" is a step on a journey. Sometimes it's the endpoint.
by Marty Demarest
February 19th, 2015, 11:04 am
Forum: Close-Up Magic
Topic: Alaskan Poker by Ricky Jay
Replies: 154
Views: 25671

Re: Alaskan Poker by Ricky Jay

While I think I understand Dustin's basic point, I need to disagree with this statement: I do not believe anyone else should use the patter for “The Exclusive Coterie” from Erdnase since he has become so identified by it, particularly since it suits his character so well. I do perform "The Excl...
by Marty Demarest
January 14th, 2015, 7:26 pm
Forum: Buzz
Topic: NPH exposes thin sawing
Replies: 60
Views: 10312

Re: NPH exposes thin sawing

Yes!
by Marty Demarest
January 14th, 2015, 7:17 pm
Forum: Buzz
Topic: NPH exposes thin sawing
Replies: 60
Views: 10312

Re: NPH exposes thin sawing

For what it's worth, I was shown the episode by a friend who asked, "Is that how it's really done?" I answered honestly: "Not always." The discussion then changed to sawings that couldn't have been done that way because... Etc. What I saw wasn't blatant exposure. I saw a televisi...
by Marty Demarest
January 3rd, 2015, 12:46 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

By saying "first edition, Chs&Wdr edition", are you suggesting that we compare the two? I don't have a 1st, but in all the early editions I've seen p. 29 has some damage, and you've obviously cleaned it up (or re-typeset it) for the C&W. Also, re: p. 29, yes the damage is consiste...
by Marty Demarest
January 3rd, 2015, 12:10 pm
Forum: Light From the Lamp
Topic: Reviewers and Objectivity
Replies: 20
Views: 7936

Re: Reviewers and Objectivity

Richard, thanks for the explanation. I do understand the situation, especially with regards to the size of the magic world. And I must add that by maintaining this forum and allowing for the open expression of opinions, you go a long way toward mitigating any flaws in the system. I have no problem w...
by Marty Demarest
January 2nd, 2015, 10:29 am
Forum: Light From the Lamp
Topic: Reviewers and Objectivity
Replies: 20
Views: 7936

Reviewers and Objectivity

Let me state up front that I am an admirer of David Britland's work, both as a reviewer for Genii and as a writer of his own projects. This post is prompted by his recent review of Ian Keable's book Charles Dickens Magician in Genii (January, 2015). But it addresses problems that I see elsewhere, an...
by Marty Demarest
January 2nd, 2015, 10:08 am
Forum: Buzz
Topic: Carney Theater Show in Burbank, CA
Replies: 15
Views: 3788

Re: Carney Theater Show in Burbank, CA

All done by cunning.
by Marty Demarest
January 2nd, 2015, 10:07 am
Forum: Buzz
Topic: Three Card Monte
Replies: 3
Views: 1133

Re: Three Card Monte

Finally, someone who holds the cards the way Erdnase instructed!
by Marty Demarest
January 2nd, 2015, 10:05 am
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

The past few months of comments on this forum have gone in a fascinating direction--and it's great to see some new voices becoming active. I'm only now catching up. It is heartening to see attention being paid to questions inherent in the printing of The Expert , since that is our primary source of ...
by Marty Demarest
December 24th, 2014, 5:46 pm
Forum: General
Topic: ERDNASE
Replies: 5218
Views: 1866757

Re: ERDNASE

Peter, that is a great question, and directly in keeping with the thinking David Ben expressed in his article "Popular Delusions and the Madness of Erdnase". There, he notes that an intimate knowledge of Erdnase's moves might provide insight into the man who created them. Unfortunately, af...

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